[Shamwow]

just don't hold your breath

I know, it's the one thing I keep coming back to, and know I need to be done with it and push it out of my head. Trust me, my therapist is on the case on that one.

 

[Shamwow]

Sham - you just recapped precisely what I was alluding to.

I would largely almost discount any derogatory comment made about any man that has hit on her. After all, look what she said about DB Mcgee before you hit pay dirt on their affair. Keep in mind, she responded in conversations with others in ways to be vague and not too revealing of what was really happening, in the event, that if caught, it will tend to lead you away with a different impression of what really happened.

Guys that are irritating and gross don't just show up in a town without a good reason why they aren't expecting some reciprocation. More was there than meets the eye.

Hence, I close my case with - Sham's wife probably cheated with more than DB McGee - in some form or fashion. The sex club atmosphere she traveled with for so long has to have a large impact when there was little to no interaction with her hubby and little transparency in the marriage. She led a double-life - until Sham got smart and saw the smoke starting to spill out around her.

So sorry you have to go through this, Sham!

Thanks, sucks hard. You remember correctly, 3 days before I left when she was stonewalling me on my demand that she tell me everything, I finally said point blank "Why don't you start by telling me when things started getting inappropriate with OM?", she laughed and called him a loser, one of the guys. So perhaps her texts about that other dude from Dec or the hotel bar guy were not truthful either, as they were mostly to OM (and she wouldn't want him thinking she's cheating on him now would she). Sigh.

 

[Dadof3]

Thanks, sucks hard. You remember correctly, 3 days before I left when she was stonewalling me on my demand that she tell me everything, I finally said point blank "Why don't you start by telling me when things started getting inappropriate with OM?", she laughed and called him a loser, one of the guys. So perhaps her texts about that other dude from Dec or the hotel bar guy were not truthful either, as they were mostly to OM (and she wouldn't want him thinking she's cheating on him now would she). Sigh.

Sham, not that I am trying to put you through the wringer here, but didn't you also mention in your other post that there was a night that she spent at a local hotel when you were home? Maybe I've got my wires crossed with another thread....

Either way, I hope this will be therapeutic and help you see her for who she's always been. I would also recommend (if you already haven't) to follow-up with her 1st ex on his side of their breakup story. Waywards (or so I'm told) have this funny way of twisting truth to match up with their actions to make themselves feel justified.

I think this realization will help you see her for who she is and what you are really dealing with.

 

[Why Not Be Happy?]

Hey....there's worse things to be called other than Jason Bourne (Those movies are cool)

 

[Shamwow]

Sham, not that I am trying to put you through the wringer here, but didn't you also mention in your other post that there was a night that she spent at a local hotel when you were home? Maybe I've got my wires crossed.

Yeah, that was when "hotel bar guy" was mentioned. I was 3 miles away, had dropped her off, wished her luck "unplugging", and she spent the whole time texting OM and almost slept with some random a-hole. Yes, believe me, I will keep all of this in mind for perspective. Kinda bummed today, off to the gym.
Posted via Mobile Device

 

[Dadof3]

Ok, everyone, tell me to shut up already!

Sham--
One more thought - piecing this speculation together with the comment she made to you about hurting the OWM - this might make sense now based on two things: the first one - you said she was loyal to a fault regarding those she loved - so you hurt DB McGees through his wife - might make some sense here; secondly - based on my assessment above: she may be thinking of ALL of the OMW's that will get impacted if you knew about the rest and were to make contact. I need to be "John Tesh" and state the obvious - there would be a lot of fallout in her work community. It would probably fall back on her as the "weakest link" and trash her rep beyond repair.

Again, speculation, but when it is viewed as a whole, makes sense.

 

[lordmayhem]

Ok, everyone, tell me to shut up already!

Ok, you got it. Shut up already.

All this speculation about other possible past affairs are irrelevant at this point and not helpful to Shamwow since he's already in the process of D. He doesn't need more triggers. Now, if he were going for R, then yes, he would need to know.

 

[Shamwow]

Ok, you got it. Shut up already.

All this speculation about other possible past affairs are irrelevant at this point and not helpful to Shamwow since he's already in the process of D. He doesn't need more triggers. Now, if he were going for R, then yes, he would need to know.

There are days where I sincerely wish my situation was different and R was on the table, gotta be honest. I talk to OMW and afterward I find myself truly jealous that at least her d-bag H is on his hands and knees begging for her forgiveness, saying he's sorry and will do anything to fix what he's done, giving her passwords and access to all accounts (at least the ones she knows about, she's not ignorant of the realities here). At least owning up and going through the motions of showing (now, after being caught) that he cares enough to express his remorse and try to make it right. Mine doesn't give a crap, or at least is a master at hiding it.

I know all the niceness from her since I helped her out this weekend is effing with my head. Therapist refers to this as my fantasy. It's a simple fantasy. But it is just that. She comes to me and at least tries to make it good, regardless of how it works out. BTW - I'm not letting these thoughts out to friends/family/STBXW, so times like these the forum is invaluable...but they're there and it's p*ssing me off. It'll pass I'm sure, just a phase of what if's and if only's that I haven't felt over the rage of the past 6 weeks since d-day. I feel them today. I felt them yesterday. Not happy about it.

Was at dinner again tonight with a colleague who's also on the verge of divorce. He's thinking about leaving her because she's bats*it crazy, bipolar and needy, while also pushing him away and blaming him for everything wrong with her life. He's tired of the crazy. Funny thing is he's almost jealous of ME because at least I had a clear cut reason to leave. (that said, he mentioned his W was reading a novel the other day - apparently she doesn't read novels - he asked her about it and she told him a guy from her Pilates class gave it to her...I told him I saw that as a red flag, and not to make him paranoid, but listed off several other possible red flags, during most of which he nodded along, looked a little surprised and then said "Interesting...well that would almost be a relief at this point.")

Guess in situations like these we all see things elsewhere we'd prefer to have...when others may not find it so appealing. Like OMW, she has what I'm saying I want...a gut-wrenching apology and remorseful actions...but still she's miserable. She's told me she wishes he would stop so it would be easier for her to just rip off the band aid. Probably because he's stirring up an even more confusing c0cktail of feelings by doing that.

Careful what you wish for, I guess. Sorry for the downer post, but one of those nights.

 

[joe kidd]

I know man... just some show that she was sorry would show that you meant something to her. Or some feeling for what you once had. Makes you question if it was ever there at all.

 

[Chaparral]

There are days where I sincerely wish my situation was different and R was on the table, gotta be honest. I talk to OMW and afterward I find myself truly jealous that at least her d-bag H is on his hands and knees begging for her forgiveness, saying he's sorry and will do anything to fix what he's done, giving her passwords and access to all accounts (at least the ones she knows about, she's not ignorant of the realities here). At least owning up and going through the motions of showing (now, after being caught) that he cares enough to express his remorse and try to make it right. Mine doesn't give a crap, or at least is a master at hiding it.

I know all the niceness from her since I helped her out this weekend is effing with my head. Therapist refers to this as my fantasy. It's a simple fantasy. But it is just that. She comes to me and at least tries to make it good, regardless of how it works out. BTW - I'm not letting these thoughts out to friends/family/STBXW, so times like these the forum is invaluable...but they're there and it's p*ssing me off. It'll pass I'm sure, just a phase of what if's and if only's that I haven't felt over the rage of the past 6 weeks since d-day. I feel them today. I felt them yesterday. Not happy about it.

Was at dinner again tonight with a colleague who's also on the verge of divorce. He's thinking about leaving her because she's bats*it crazy, bipolar and needy, while also pushing him away and blaming him for everything wrong with her life. He's tired of the crazy. Funny thing is he's almost jealous of ME because at least I had a clear cut reason to leave. (that said, he mentioned his W was reading a novel the other day - apparently she doesn't read novels - he asked her about it and she told him a guy from her Pilates class gave it to her...I told him I saw that as a red flag, and not to make him paranoid, but listed off several other possible red flags, during most of which he nodded along, looked a little surprised and then said "Interesting...well that would almost be a relief at this point.")

Guess in situations like these we all see things elsewhere we'd prefer to have...when others may not find it so appealing. Like OMW, she has what I'm saying I want...a gut-wrenching apology and remorseful actions...but still she's miserable. She's told me she wishes he would stop so it would be easier for her to just rip off the band aid. Probably because he's stirring up an even more confusing c0cktail of feelings by doing that.

Careful what you wish for, I guess. Sorry for the downer post, but one of those nights.

I for one will be real surprised if you don't get the remorse and an apology.

She 's already thrown out a few feelers but they have been curtly overlooked.

I think it will come down to how insecure a person she is. The more doubt she has the longer it will take. Too proud to just have it thrown back in her face.

 

[Shamwow]

I know man... just some show that she was sorry would show that you meant something to her. Or some feeling for what you once had. Makes you question if it was ever there at all.

Dude, why am I paying a therapist?

That pretty much sums it up, dead on. Thanks.

(feel free to send a bill to my insurance company)

 

[Shamwow]

I think it will come down to how insecure a person she is. The more doubt she has the longer it will take.

I'd say pretty insecure, as much as she puts on the strong front. She has periodically had trouble with self-esteem, and cares a lot what others think of her, though she hides it well.

Then again, that statement could describe most any person on the planet (myself included), so who knows.

 

[lordmayhem]

Don't hold your breath waiting for an apology or remorsefulness. Some people are just like that. I waited for a LONG time to hear something like that from my ex-wife and never got it. She walked out and never ever looked back. I know a couple of guys IRL that had that happen to them too.

It's a fantasy we all share when that happens, that the WS would show at least some remorse. Some never do. Your WS checked out of the marriage long ago, despite all your efforts.

 

[Initfortheduration]

Read your whole story, both threads. Your wife is such a burden to her parents. She has a seared conscience. Now the only thing left for her is whats staring back in mirror. And i guarantee she doesn't like what she sees.

 

[Stonewall]

Thanks, sucks hard. You remember correctly, 3 days before I left when she was stonewalling me on my demand that she tell me everything, I finally said point blank "Why don't you start by telling me when things started getting inappropriate with OM?", she laughed and called him a loser, one of the guys. So perhaps her texts about that other dude from Dec or the hotel bar guy were not truthful either, as they were mostly to OM (and she wouldn't want him thinking she's cheating on him now would she). Sigh.

can we stop using the word Stonewall as a pejorative! LOL

 

[Almostrecovered]

I always thought it strange that people say that going through divorce is like mourning the death of your spouse. Not that death is preferable to divorce but with death your spouse isn't around creating false hope. I suppose you would have to treat it like a death (the wife you had is now gone) and that is much easier said than done.

 

[ManDup]

I always thought it strange that people say that going through divorce is like mourning the death of your spouse. Not that death is preferable to divorce but with death your spouse isn't around creating false hope. I suppose you would have to treat it like a death (the wife you had is now gone) and that is much easier said than done.

http://i.imgur.com/zD2rO.jpg

 

[MarriedTex]

I for one will be real surprised if you don't get the remorse and an apology.

She 's already thrown out a few feelers but they have been curtly overlooked.

I think it will come down to how insecure a person she is. The more doubt she has the longer it will take. Too proud to just have it thrown back in her face.

I, for one, will be surprised if you ever DO get an apology. For her to do that would mean that she acknowledges that she messed up what had been a good relationship due to her own bad judgement. To acknowledge bad judgement would undercut all the positive feelings of empowerment that she got from the affair. With you gone, that's really all she has to hold onto now to maintain her self-esteem.

One of the downsides of your highly effective "go dark" approach (which is the only way you could have gone and cannot be second guessed in the least - it was the only option for your sanity) is that you do not have closure. And she is unlikely to serve up closure to you on a silver platter.

When you are ready, you may want to consider biting the bullet and sitting down with her and saying "You hurt me tremendously, why did you do it?" You've established your bona fides as someone who does not roll over. I think you can afford to ask this question without looking weak.

If this thought is nagging at you, you may be well-served in having this conversation at some point. Doesn't have to be now, but could provide welcome closure to do this before divorce is finalized.

 

[F-102]

Sham, in reading of the "others" (party groper, hotel bar guy), maybe your W did rebuff their propositions, and probably indeed acted in good faith while doing so. But then, the light bulb went off, and she realized: "Hey, guys are still interested in me, I'm still attractive and desirable, I STILL GOT IT!!!" And maybe that's when it all started. She may very well have never intended to cheat, but then, all her friends probably pressured her to "get with the program", because they didn't want a buzzkill spoiling their fun, and she feared that her friends would ice her, and she wouldn't be allowed to sit at the "popular girls' table" anymore. There was one thread here where a guys W got pregnant from an OM in a ONS threesome. When asked how she could have done such a thing, her reason was that they called her a chicken when she at first said no!

Now, as far as your feelings over the past few days, you may have felt that you let your guard down by helping her. True, it was a good gesture (and frankly, one that will make you look good if the D battle starts), but you probably now feel that you let her take advantage of you, and that you fell for her deception again, that you slid back a little to Sham MkI. I know-whenever I do a favor for someone, I can't help but feel that I got hosed.

And, perhaps, her being civil is giving you a hope that she will finally admit that she was wrong and take full responsibility, that your finally gonna get a full confession from her. But she doesn't, and again, you feel that you're spinning your wheels with no real results.
But, for her to admit anything will be for her to admit that she was wrong- not only to you and herself, in keeping with MarriedTex's post, but she would also have to admit that to her friends that are in her corner, friendships that are already fragile enough as it is. Remember, she has to do a LOT of convincing that she made the "right" decision, that she is fully justified in her actions-so I really wouldn't hold my breath.

And, as far as the OM being remorseful, keep in mind, he is in an "at fault" state-he absolutely MUST make nice in order to save his own neck.

 

[krismimo]

:scratchhead::scratchhead: Really trying not to be mean here But the speculations of the what if's, Decoding What she meant to say, etc etc etc. I don't think is really helping. All we can go by is not just what she says but what she does, but most important just wait for sham to update us and tell us what is going on. The thing is I feel Sham is going through a lot right now and all these speculations (Which take up most of the thread by the way) can sort of drive any decent person a little mad. Just trying to be a sound of reason here. As for you Sham I think your doing what you need to need. The thing is you can never control what other people may or may do, all we can do is control ourselves and that is a tough job as it is .