I have had my new girlfriend for more than a year now, our sex life is great, and I am very happy but I am haunted by some sort of "need" for physical perfection in a woman now.

You're living in the wrong generation, buddy.:frown2:

 

What exactly do you mean by that?

I assume you mean the physical appearance was once NOT very important?

 

Please read "The New Science of Adult Attachment". This kind of thinking is typical of someone with an "avoidant" relationship style. The search for perfection allows you to push woman away when you are not ready or able to commit and be fully open and secure. There is no perfect woman. Convenient right?

 

OK, thanks.

I'm sure you are probably right about that.

Avoidant wouldn't have described me in the past, but right now I would agree.

I am still quite hurt about the whole divorce. I think and dream about it a fair bit still.

Sometimes I feel guilty to my GF, but I am being the best man I can for her and I'm improving every day.

I look forward to the day when I can be deeply in love and completely happy with the person I'm with again.

 

When you love a woman, she looks perfect in your eyes, regardless of how she may "look" to the eyes of others, because you see past the physical imperfections.

If you want to spend your life searching for the perfect female specimen to mate with, you're going to be spending a lot of time alone.

 

Moving in with my GF was a bad idea me thinks.

Not sure I was ready.

 

No. I'm not going through what you are but I'm mentally healthy.

Get IC for your problem and keep fvcking the socks off of your good woman. She is worth far more than her weight in gold if she is good to you.

I am speaking from experience. I have had women almost across the spectrum. From beautiful models to chubby, but enthusiastic, plain janes and the woman who stole heart does have a rock n' roll body but, objectively, is only cute.

She is, however, extraordinary to me.
Loving, faithful, generous, selfless.

Get help. You seem to have a wonderful woman. Don't let your malfunction ruin it.
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Thanks. I know it. Appreciate the positive comments.

We all have issues and sometimes the "leave this girl before you hurt her" argument isn't always realistic. The important thing is that we are open and honest about how we feel, we do our best to be positive and fun, and we keep working to improve ourselves for that person.

Currently Reading "The New Science of Adult Attachment" and plan to see my counsellor if things don't improve.

Honestly, it has been great for weeks and weeks (before and during our holiday) and now all of a sudden.....

I guess it's just the reality of coming home, realising we are living together, talking about a joint bank account for house expenses, talking about xmas holidays etc etc.

I know it's just a defence mechanism and it will come and go. It might always come and go at some level. Who knows.

I'll keep at it. I know in my heart she is a completely selfless, ambitious, joyful, loving, wonderful woman with a heart of gold and I would be lucky to keep her and I love her for that.

It's the d^mn "love fantasy" that I was in (made up in my head) during my marriage that is so damn hard to get over. I can see why some drug addicts can't ever give up now.

ps The "sock removing" has always been phenomenal and I can see always will be. We have a very close and open connection in that respect.

 

I'm with you on this. It seems there might be some intersection at some point between you being "ready" and meeting the "right" woman. The more "right" the woman the lower down on the "ready" line the intersection occurs......? I'm borrowing a little from the "crazy/hot" graph lol but seriously. I think there are some dynamics to this.

 

I think that is definitely the case.

Realised last night that I still hadn't "LET GO" of my wife yet. I still have some anger, bitterness and sadness to let go.

I think just realising that is a big step in the right direction.

In regard to the hotness chart, I likely wouldn't be with a woman like my GF in the past. I would have overlooked her to some extent probably.

I suppose I see things in a more practical way now I'm older (fatter balder etc lol..) and a person who I can connect with is more important and a supermodel now.

As a male human though, there is always that desire for a supermodel we have to live with.

 

Live with? No way!
Ram from time to time? Sure!

 

In your dreams RD....

 

Ey? 'tis called friends with benefits!

 

Ask yourself this: what would a "supermodel", or her non-celebrity equivalent, want in a man? Great looks, super-brainy, star athlete, famous musician/actor? If you aren't any of those, then you can try the ol' stand-by, large bank account.

You forgot "insanely huge penis".

 

Had a bit of a revelation on the weekend.

A simple question popped into my head........ "What is important to me?"

NOT what do I want?
NOT what do I desire?

"What is important to me?" brought me calmness, a sense of satisfaction.

This simple question quite dramatically cuts through our selfish self and questions what we value (morals, honour, integrity, loyalty), what our hearts yearn for (love, companionship, excitement) and what our heads tell us is practical (compatibility, friendship, closeness, sexual chemistry).

It made me feel quite silly, but certainly helped.

 

Sure.

I definitely felt completely attracted and satisfied with my ex-wife.

I don't feel that with my current GF, but honestly, I am a changed man now.

I don't really have the ability to just blindly fall for someone like that again now.

It is a much longer process and ultimately, we are both older.

Fact is most of us don't look as good as we did in our 20's and I guess we have to deal with that, decide what is really important to us in life, and find someone we want to spend our lives with.

 

I definitely felt completely attracted and satisfied with my ex-wife.

I don't feel that with my current GF, but honestly, I am a changed man now.

I don't really have the ability to just blindly fall for someone like that again now.

It is a much longer process and ultimately, we are both older.

Fact is most of us don't look as good as we did in our 20's and I guess we have to deal with that, decide what is really important to us in life, and find someone we want to spend our lives with.

Right, I know you get it intellectually. But you've been with this gf for awhile and you don't seem to be slipping into that state so...it would appear you just aren't that into her, not enough to get past her lack of perfection.

So still, you should break up with her, as it is clear you aren't going to fall for her like that, it has been long enough for that to occur.

 

I'm sympathetic as I'm in much the same position as the OP. That said, one of our fellow TAM'rs posting something a while back that rang true for me. The idea being that after six months with someone if you're not feeling love for that person (as in being able to say "I love you" and mean it) than you should be moving on. In the end none of the background stuff really matters.

 

I agree and I do worry about that.

I do go through days where I love her and I tell her and mean it and then it goes away. Either by thinking about the past or stressing about whether it's "perfect enough".

I accept arguments from both sides. Both make sense. Both use sensible logic.

I see enough potential in our relationship and my attraction to her to persist at the moment and keep working on myself.

 

Stop accepting the pseudo-science that says men "want" to mate with the most attractive female possible--you are rationalizing your obsession. There is no way the species would have survived if men were actually built that way.

Good advice about getting counseling. You need someone to open your eyes so you can deal with your pain and anger. Good luck!

 

Did you ever consider that your attraction to the most attractive women only may have something to do with pursuing something that is out of your league, not that I even believe in them, so you don't have to form another relationship. Deep I know but I had an extra cup of coffee today lol

 

This sounds like a psychological block. Therapy might be in order to heal from your break up and to put aside any preconceived notions you have about perfection and being jaded. Look, we all want what we want and it is perfectly fine to want the supermodel. Only, you need to make sure that shallowness and biology are the only things at play here or no woman will be ok for you regardless of looks or build. Maybe work on you first, and take a step back from your relationship. Be honest with your gf especially as you are living together that you need some professional help to help you figure out a few things and need a little space in the interim.

 

Faithful Wife, I'm with you--the OP is falling back on a false "fact" to justify and sustain his obsession, rather than accept it is something HE has constructed for whatever reason.

The first position means, he is "helpless" to change. The second means, he can change his way of seeing women, seeing the world, seeing himself. That's a lot of work but it is actually not all that hard to do, once one accepts that the so-called universal isn't universal at all.

OP, obsessing about a physically "perfect" woman is something you are choosing to do--for whatever reason(s). It is encouraged by media and advertising in our culture, so you've been "indoctrinated" for a very long time--but it's only recently become a problem for you, right? Well remember, the point of that advertising is to keep you buying--keep you pursuing--keep you from finding long-term satisfaction in the car you buy, the clothes you wear, etc., etc., etc.

Read "The Pursuit of Loneliness" by Phillip Slater. That will make you look at yourself differently!

FWIW, the better "solution" is NOT telling yourself you don't want a "hottie"; the better solution is learning to see the hotness in every woman, whether it is the swell of her breast, the curve of her buttock, the glint in her eye or the lilt in a small. Learning to love what is beautiful in all women will lead you closer to learning to love women just as people, people who also happen to be hot! You'll be a happier man if you stop dividing women according to their desirability and devaluing those who don't meet your "hotness" criteria(which you are doing, whether you realize it or not) and you will also be a better person. Good luck, whatever you decide!

 

Poida, have you read His Needs, Her Needs? Physical Attractiveness is an emotional need. Both men and women have it, but it does tend to be more common in men. Like all emotional needs, they occur on a spectrum, where it's more important to some than others. It sounds like you have a very high emotional need for physical attractiveness.

If you haven't read it yet, HNHN might be worth reviewing. I've heard the author state that men who claim to have never been physically attracted to their wives were able to fall in love with their wives, once their wives began to meet the husband's other most important ENs. At the point of falling in love, the husband found the wife physically attractive. (It's rare though, because almost everyone has some physical attraction to their spouse when they marry.)

I don't know if that would be a way forward for you, but it might be worth checking out.

 

Thanks for the balanced and informative response.

After IC last night, it has become clearer just how different "loving someone" and wanting to be "in love" really are.

One is external and the other is internal.

One is is a transaction and the other is selfish.

One can be nurtured and grown, the other cannot.

The fact this conversation has changed from physical appearance to "loving" and "in love" tells me that some of my issue with physical appearance is being used as a "scape goat" for my inability to deal with my burning need to be "in love".

That feeling is something I created in my marriage with the lack of a real deep and genuine interactive relationship to sit with.

I liken the feeling to that of a drug addict who has been cut off after being abandoned.

I know it is a fantasy rather than reality, I know it isn't a good thing to want or rely on yet I am addicted.

It is going to take a long time.

 

It's not a perfect fit but "The Unbearable Lightness Of Being" keeps coming to mind.

 

F*ck I'm so confused.

What it boils down to is this. I'm not hugely physically attracted to her (she is pretty but average if I had to describe her), but I absolutely love every other aspect of our relationship (chemistry, sex, ideologies, values, lifestyle, health, desires, closeness, connection, ability to talk about our problems, ability to resolve things together, total honesty).

Has anyone been here and love has blossomed?

Am I f*cking bonkers or am I just not that into her?

I hate this.

 

How can you have chemistry but not be attracted to her? I think you are lying to yourself about one or the other

 

This is exactly what I'm completely f*cking baffled about.........

The chemistry and sex is awesome and is one of the main reasons we are together.

I read a few papers about chemistry and physical attractiveness and most identify that they are different things.

What I find strange is that even if the physical attractiveness was only average, I would have expected the chemistry to be more than enough to let love blossom. And I have certainly felt it on more than once occasion. Just not now.

 

So if the chemistry and sex are good....why does her physical appearance matter? I know this is exactly what you are asking yourself but I am being a bit more specific.

I'm wondering, is the physical appearance thing more about what you want other people to think when they see "your woman"? Like if they see you are in love with or in a relationship with an "average" woman, do you not like that feeling you would have from other men judging you like that?

I just can't quite get my mind around why her looks would matter so much at this point, since the sex is good. But I know that is because I'm filtering through my own experience and that to me, if the sex is good, then it is good and by extension, I like what I'm seeing as well as liking the sex. Or...are you meaning that the sex is good but you don't actually look that closely at her, you superimpose more attractive women over her in your mind?

I'm not meaning to be snarky here, just in case it comes across that way. I'm just curious.

My husband told me once that a friend of his dumped a girl because he saw his ex by chance while dating this girl, and suddenly saw how much hotter his ex was than the new girl. The guy wanted to be with "the hottest girl he could get" so when he saw the contrast, he immediately stopped seeing the new girl. My husband agreed this was a sh*tty thing to do, but he was also just saying, that's how some people are (and he wasn't being judgmental, it is just true).

 

Nope, it's not about what other other people think.

During sex, she seems to transform and look much more attractive.

It's when the sexual chemistry is in an ebb.

I'm as confused as you.

Perhaps the physical appearance of my parter just matters a lot to me? Perhaps it is engrained and there is nothing I can do about that. Perhaps i just need to accept it for what it is.

It just seems a massive tragedy to me to leave by far the best relationship I could ever imagine over that.

 

I would rather have chemistry than physical attractiveness. My current partner is not what I would typically call physically attractive but we have great chemistry and its way better than being with exes that were "hotter" but I wasn't as attracted to. Maybe men are different though. Having said that my current partner has a pretty hot body lol. Just to say he has certain features that I think would make him less attractive to most women.

 

See this is the thing. I have had comments from a few people similar to your situation where they say. "It shouldn't matter really, my partner isn't that attractive, oh yeah, actually, they have a rocking body."

Studies showed the importance of physical attractiveness were within a few percent, but it varied quite widely from person to person.

 

Do you find her mentally "hot"? Is her personality in & out of bed attractive to you? Is it attractive to other people ? I think its normal to want your friends to find your partner attractive in some way.

 

Yes, sexy personality. Smiley, happy, giggly, personable.

She's can get great "I want to jump you" look in her eyes.

 

And the reality is that I'm not getting any younger, skinnier or more hair. I know all this yet............

Love sucks.