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Just to add one more question (like I haven’t asked enough), what if I show her this post. There is a good mix of opinions. Personally, I kind of the fence leaning towards no, but maybe if she see this many neutral party reactions it might change something.
NO do not do that. This is YOUR safe place to discuss this, and if things get worse, you will still be here to get advice/guidance and you probably do NOT want her to read that then...
 

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Sorry for the constant post, but what I did tell her last night, and I have told her many times, is how I look at our marriage. I see it as she is my number one. Everything I do affects her. I lay my head down next to her, I come home to her every night. There is not one person in the world that could be worth conflict between the two of us. Every decision I make, will change my way of life and hers. No matter what. The movie “The Vow” with Channing Tatum had one good line about a cheating spouse, “I’m not going to leave them for the one thing they have done wrong, I’m going to stay with them for all the things they have done right”.

HB75, if you do what you wrote above, sure then what you're classified is : RUGSWEPT = Rugsweeping. If this is how you want to wear that badge. Nothing you may hear here will help you keep your head up. Sorry it is just the way it will be.
 

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No, ask questions, thank you for being open.

So, she goes out with this friend at least every other week or more and sometimes out to a bar where she remains out until 2 am.

You both have full time jobs.
You both have separate bank accounts.
You both do work around the house.
You feel more should be done on her end before she parties.
You feel she is texting and connected to her phone too much.

So, you were hedging because your gut tells you she might be cheating.

Of course you like the disagreeing post because it absolves your wife of any responsibility.

Let me ask you this, do you stop her from:
Girl’s night out
Visiting her Family
Visiting her Friends
Having a Phone
Having access to any money
Having male friends
Texting people

You do understand, contrary to popular belief, controlling is not always bad. If she spends as bad as you say, the finances need to be “controlled.” My wife can irresponsibly spend so, guess who is “controlling” the finances? Yep me.

Yes, my wife earns her own money, but WE pay bills, WE pay student loans, WE pay car repairs, WE mutually spent for the children at the time and I controlled those aspects. Responsible financial people can take care of finances, but not all people do this well, When we are good I ask no questions about what is left. Yet, if she needs help, the stipulation is I get to question her spending habits. Yes, it works both ways. Funny thing is, I rarely need help. Funnier than that, my “controlling” behavior has curbed her spending. She may still do it, but she works OT and rarely asks me for anything.

Also, whose idea was it to turn on the tracking app?

“I’m not going to leave them for the one thing they have done wrong, I’m going to stay with them for all the things they have done right”.
You know the problem with many movies, they are fiction.

It is a neat saying, but guess how the wife of the actual couple felt.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6258363/Couple-inspired-Vow-getting-divorced-25-years.html
Heartbreak as couple, who inspired romantic drama The Vow after wife lost all memory in a crash and relearned to love her husband, are getting DIVORCED as she opens up about his infidelity
Sorry for the constant post, but what I did tell her last night, and I have told her many times, is how I look at our marriage. I see it as she is my number one. Everything I do affects her. I lay my head down next to her, I come home to her every night. There is not one person in the world that could be worth conflict between the two of us. Every decision I make, will change my way of life and hers. No matter what. The movie “The Vow” with Channing Tatum had one good line about a cheating spouse, “I’m not going to leave them for the one thing they have done wrong, I’m going to stay with them for all the things they have done right”.
No, do not show her any of this yet. There are very few couples who work on TAM together. Many, that I have witnessed, self destruct or both leave here angry. Let this be your space for questions and venting now, until you decide what you really want to do in your marriage.
 

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Just to add one more question (like I haven’t asked enough), what if I show her this post. There is a good mix of opinions. Personally, I kind of the fence leaning towards no, but maybe if she see this many neutral party reactions it might change something.


Oh god no. Keep this place to yourself!




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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Sorry but you are putting words into his mouth.

I don't think that wives should be acting the way she is either, its completely inappropriate. Oh and BTW its not HER money, its THEIR money, they are married.


I think it should be their money but he is the one who is keeping finances separate and saying it’s her money vs his money.
 

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I can’t believe no one sees how controlling this guy is. His wife has a life outside the marriage which is healthy, the problem is he doesn’t have a life outside the marriage so he resents her when she goes out.
 

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Disagree 100% that he is being controlling. She is completely out of line for a married woman. I dont necessarily think she is out cheating, but her behavior for sure is not appropriate. How would she feel if the tables were turned and it was OP staying out til all hours with a buddy, wasting way too much money and neglecting things at home?? Wifey has a choice to make, she either loses the toxic friend, or her family.
Then again, what is cheating?

She is cheating the husband and family out of their together time.

Parenting is tough, she is getting away from the home, the husband and the children in a potentially, destructive way.

Her behavior will, very likely get progressively worse. Right now, some are giving her the benefit of the doubt on what she does at these bars and at the friends home.

With her present attitude, that doubt, is undoubtedly worth looking into.

When she asked you if you wanted her to stop seeing her friend, had you said, YES, you would likely found out her true feelings.

You need to call her bluff. You will immediately know where you stand.

Does her friend have children?

What are the ages of yours? Little ones are very demanding!!

Some 'away time' from the family is stress relieving and good. What she is doing is destructive.

Those words out of her mouth, "you aren't my boss". Those words and thoughts originated from her toxic friend. Her friend is divorced. I can see why. Her ex husband probably tried to reign her in and she left her marriage.

Her friend is likely an alcoholic. Your wife will soon become one, also.

Then, she will, in truth, be married to the bottle, and not to you.

Keep in mind, when under the influence of alcohol, any boundaries she has will likely fall. If they have not already fallen.

I suspect cheating (at many levels) has already occurred, many times.

Remember, cheating can be kissing, touching inappropriately, talking trash about her family, flirting, etc.

And, taking excessive time away from the family "for not a good reason".



Nemesis-
 

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Discussion Starter #48
I show signs on controlling because it is my personality and I am working on that. I have never told her who she can and can not hang out with, I have never told her she needs to be home and a certain time. I have told her I don’t like this person, I have asked her not to stay out too late. I only control the finances because she doesn’t do well with it, and use to be a lot worse. We are working on her budgeting and spending. If I didn’t take control of it then we would be in the poor house. She knows this and would like me to completely take over her bills and her paycheck and just give her an amount at the end of the week. I didn’t not want to do that, I feel I do enough and she could take responsibility for some bills. I have told her plenty of times, just make sure there payed on time and you’re paying them, you need help just ask don’t let them build up. But time after time she lets them build up and by the time I find out it’s a couple thousand dollars behind. Both children are 5 and under. I know “The Vow” is only a movie, also why I said the “one” good line. Rest of it sucked. I love my wife, I love my kids. If she is cheating I’m willing to work it out, as long as she is, for us and our girls. She sees her family, and friends, not a lot of guy friends, but she has them, between mutual guy friends or work guy friends, no one she goes out with out or hangs out with. She has girls nights pretty often. I don’t resent her for that, I work a lot, I only get to see my girls (including my wife) a couple hours a day. To me that isn’t enough. So I enjoy being home. Yeah of course I like to go out, who doesn’t. We have a joint account that money goes in from my paycheck. She has access to that and can take money out whenever, I just ask her to let me know because of problems in the past. We would be saving that money up for a project around the house and next thing I know half of it is gone due to her taking from it for other things. I really want her to loose the friend and I made it clear but not harsh, I don’t want to tell her what to do. I feel I have plenty of examples of why she is not good for us and just causes problems when she’s around. For Christ sake the women harshly reprimanded my oldest for something so stupid. I wouldn’t even have said a word to my daughter because it was so stupid and I’m the parent, this women had only bin in our lives for maybe 9 months. I told my wife, “if that was a guy that did that to my kid, I would have lost it on him.” I almost kicked her out of my house, but I didn’t, it’s my wife’s friends and it was my wife’s place to take care of that. And my wife told me she did. So for the past nine month I have had multiple fights with my wife about this girl and more and more reasons why I don’t like her. If anyone has any suggestions for a I phone spy app please let me know.
 

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Fonlab, need the phone and password.
 

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The movie “The Vow” with Channing Tatum had one good line about a cheating spouse, “I’m not going to leave them for the one thing they have done wrong, I’m going to stay with them for all the things they have done right”.
Sorry dude but that is a load of crap. Time to get your balls back and stand up for yourself and for your marriage. I don't know if your wife has cheated on you yet, but there are definitely some red flags appearing (staying out late with divorced friend, unable to be contacted at 2:00 AM, turning location off). Your behavior is actually controlling - you're acting like a 'Nice Guy'. You need to read No More Mr Nice Guy like yesterday.

Look - having friends and hanging out with friends is perfectly fine. A big red flag to me is that your wife is hanging out late night with a recent divorcee. My ex did the same thing, and that woman filled her head with all kinds of crap. We were already having problems in our marriage, but my ex's friend (separated not divorced yet) led her to believe that she could do so much better than me. Find another dude and life will be great - see how great it is for me? That woman cheated on her husband with another married man, then moved in with the AP who was still not divorced. That guys wife didn't even know he was leaving until he stopped coming home. Real great role model. Sorry for the rant, but you need to get a hold of this situation quick. You need boundaries, and you need to be ready to enforce your boundaries. You're being walked all over right now.
 

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Discussion Starter #51
I can’t tell her to cut ties with the friend, that would go over like a fart in church. I brought up the idea of a couples counselor and hoping the counselors can help her realize what one person is doing to a loving 12 year relationship and a family and removing that one person could change it all. She was a little defensive about it and I questioned that. We have Had arguments in the past and very rare. We have fought more with this friend involved then we have in 12 years. I’ve bin reading articles and getting help and support here but a lot of what I’ve bin reading is a couples counselor is good even for the best relationship. If you’re already having a re-occurring problem then it’s too late, should have had a counselor in the beginning. I know a counselor won’t fix our relationship but will help us find ways to fix it ourselves. When she got defensive, I explained that our problem isn’t healed, I don’t feel that it is fixed, it’s on the mend but not healed, and a counselor will help us work on that.
 

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Look man - you need to decide what you will and will not tolerate in your relationship. It's called a boundary, and you have to be prepared to back it up. You can't rely on anybody else to get your wife to 'see the light'. Hoping that a counselor will help your wife realize the err of her ways? Not gonna happen. YOU have to stand up for what YOU want. Like I said before, I think it's perfectly acceptable for spouses to have friends and hobbies/interests outside of the marriage. That is healthy. But your gut is telling you something is wrong, and based on what you have posted here I am inclined to agree with your gut.

I agree that under normal circumstances you shouldn't tell a spouse who they should or should not hang out with. But you can absolutely voice your concerns about behaviors and the fact that you dislike what she does when she hangs out with that friend. And think about this - how are you going to feel when you didn't put your foot down about her behavior, and then months or years down the road you come to find out she was in fact cheating on you? It happens all the time. It seems that your wife has lost respect for you. That is a hard one to come back from, but it is possible. It starts with you though - fix yourself first. You need a good IC. I wouldn't bother with MC right now. You do need to sniff out a potential affair though. That bell is impossible to unring once it has happened.
 

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It's like, telling a child not to play in the street. Do they really listen or return to the street because it is long and flat. They do what they think is best for them. Nothing more. It's ok to be the husband you are, but it's also ok to be the man of your marriage.
 

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Just to add one more question (like I haven’t asked enough), what if I show her this post. There is a good mix of opinions. Personally, I kind of the fence leaning towards no, but maybe if she see this many neutral party reactions it might change something.
Jesus please don't do that. You're trying to find ways to convince your wife what she is doing is wrong. You're hoping that you can present evidence to her that will make her realize that she is acting inappropriately. I've been there and done that, and I'm here to tell you that doesn't work. YOU have to stand up for YOURSELF and set a boundary that you will not accept this kind of behavior in your marriage. And you need to be prepared to back it up and enforce the boundary if it is crossed.
 

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I think you should flip the script. So much of this tug of war comes down to how you are expressing yourself. When you say that "she should....," you sound 'controlling.'

How about you change how you word your side of the conversation? For example,

"Wife, I won't be in a marriage where my spouse thinks it's OK to stay out until 2am not answering texts. If you believe that that is how you want to live, we will be living separately."

These are expressions of YOUR boundaries for how YOU will live YOUR life. These are your choices. You don't have to ask her permission to define your own boundaries. You don't have to feel doubtful or guilty about defining perfectly reasonable expectations for a marriage.

Take a deep, cleansing breath and decide to lay it out simply, calmly, and with conviction - "I won't be in a marriage in which my spouse does X."

You can't control her. You can only control yourself.
 

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I show signs on controlling because it is my personality and I am working on that.
Okay, so, you are controlling. Please explain where and when.


I have never told her who she can and can not hang out with,
I have never told her she needs to be home and a certain time.
I have told her I don’t like this person, I have asked her not to stay out too late.
She sees her family, and friends,
not a lot of guy friends, but she has them, between mutual guy friends or work guy friends, no one she goes out with out or hangs out with.
She has girls nights pretty often
We have a joint account that money goes in from my paycheck
She has access to that and can take money out whenever, I just ask her to let me know because of problems in the past.
You already told us you also have separate accounts.

These actions are the exact opposite of controlling.

I only control the finances because she doesn’t do well with it, and use to be a lot worse.
We are working on her budgeting and spending.
If I didn’t take control of it then we would be in the poor house.
She knows this and would like me to completely take over her bills and her paycheck
and just give her an amount at the end of the week.
I didn’t not want to do that, I feel I do enough and she could take responsibility for some bills.
I have told her plenty of times, just make sure there payed on time and you’re paying them, you need help just ask don’t let them build up. But time after time she lets them build up and by the time I find out it’s a couple thousand dollars behind.
We would be saving that money up for a project around the house and next thing I know half of it is gone due to her taking from it for other things.
After mutual discussions, multiple mistakes and agreement you took the finances out of her hands with her consent. This is not controlling.

Please explain where and when the controlling behavior occurred.

I really want her to loose the friend and I made it clear but not harsh, I don’t want to tell her what to do. I feel I have plenty of examples of why she is not good for us and just causes problems when she’s around. For Christ sake the women harshly reprimanded my oldest for something so stupid. I wouldn’t even have said a word to my daughter because it was so stupid and I’m the parent, this women had only bin in our lives for maybe 9 months. I told my wife, “if that was a guy that did that to my kid, I would have lost it on him.” I almost kicked her out of my house, but I didn’t, it’s my wife’s friends and it was my wife’s place to take care of that. And my wife told me she did. So for the past nine month I have had multiple fights with my wife about this girl and more and more reasons why I don’t like her. If anyone has any suggestions for a I phone spy app please let me know.
Wanting a toxic friend out of your life, especially a new one who has caused more fights now than during your 12 years of marriage, is not wrong or controlling.

So, please, explain your controlling behavior. I do not see it.
 

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Wait wait wait...

You have a curfew on your wife and have to “help her out” when she “gets behind?”

Are you her husband or her parent?
I think she might need financial help with "getting behind."

And a mom who stays out 'til after 2am?

If she cant impose a limit on her staying out late, maybe someone else should? Though I think the word "curfew" is not entirely appropriate, here.
 

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I think she might need financial help with "getting behind."

And a mom who stays out 'til after 2am?

If she cant impose a limit on her staying out late, maybe someone else should? Though I think the word "curfew" is not entirely appropriate, here.
Maybe because she knows that she can count on his help she doesn't strive to improve herself. Dependence. And growing up.

It's not about curfew, it's about respectful boundaries as a working partnership.

And I'm surprised no one has mentioned this, but is it possible that your wife is having an affair WITH THIS WOMAN?

It's not the first time we have seen that here. All the red flags are there
 

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Disagree 100% that he is being controlling. She is completely out of line for a married woman. I dont necessarily think she is out cheating, but her behavior for sure is not appropriate. How would she feel if the tables were turned and it was OP staying out til all hours with a buddy, wasting way too much money and neglecting things at home?? Wifey has a choice to make, she either loses the toxic friend, or her family.
I do not see any controlling here. Going out all hours of the night on the regular is a problem. I agree the friend is toxic and no friend of the marriage.
 
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