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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I don't know where to start really, just joining here and talking about it is painful.

We are both in our late twenties.

We have been married six years, we have a daughter who is 14 months old.

In august during an argument she said she didn't want to be with me and that I had missed the signs and it was too late. On reflection I can see things I have done and ways I have acted that would make her feel bad but was just oblivious at the time. Nobody is perfect obviously and she rarely allows me to voice my own concerns without arguing or trying to deflect the blame. I know I have been very grumpy and had a short tempter and been snappy which over months and months has made her feel unloved and unhappy.

She suffers from hormonal problems and can have massive mood swings so I'm used to her saying things like this in the midst of an emotional outburst when I've done nothing wrong but it usually blows over, this time it is different.

I'm still not sure the things she bought up were enough to justify her decision and she never wrote to me or tried to talk to me on our own away from the kid etc.

Anyway for some reason things stabilized again for a while, she says guilt but I don't know if that's true or she has mixed feelings. For a few months she acted like nothing had happened and I said we would have to discuss the issues and work things out or it would just rear it's head again but that never happened and some of the time felt good and normal but a lot of the time it was hard to feel natural and spontaneous because as far as I was concerned this huge issue was hovering there unaddressed. A few weeks ago she said she wanted to leave again, then after about a week it was back to acting normal again and we had sex and talked about buying a sofa etc and the whole time I still though "this is crazy we need to TALK" but then about a week ago she said again it was over during an argument and started talking about "i'm worried how you will cope on your own" and arrangements with the child etc, all very cold and emotionless.

She has certainly got it set in her mind she is making the right decision. Is there a third party? Possibly although I don't think there is and I have found no evidence.

Back in the year she arranged to go on holiday to Tunisia with her family and some extended family and I declined because I am very uncomfortable in warm climates and there were people I wasn't very familiar with and I wasn't sure we could afford it but not wanting the baby to miss out I suggested she go with the baby and I stay here. Obviously I realise that was a big mistake now and might well have contributed to things, they left yesterday and I already miss them both.

When they come back I expect things to get serious in regards to separation.

I love her so much and my love increased tenfold after the baby came along, I love her and I love our baby and there's this sort of feeling I have for them together that I can't explain, it's like the two of them are my life.

She doesn't want to try counselling, I've tried getting us to talk etc but she isn't interested. I said she should live with her mother a while to get space as her mother only lives round the corner literally two houses away but she doesn't seem interested in that either.

Now or then we talk and some emotion comes out, she will start talking about something that has hurt her or she wants to be changed but then she will catch herself and pull the shutters back down.

She used to be very loving and affectionate and now it kills me to not be able to tell her how much I love her but I feel that saying such things will only do damage at the moment. As much as it kills me I feel like she should be on her own before it could ever get better if it ever does because things have gone far enough that there is a tension between us that prevents any natural behavior.

I'm sure you hear it all the time but i'm so scared, she means the world to me, I can't bear the thought of not having her. I can't stand the idea of us not being together as a family. I feel so stupid to know a little bit more thought 6 months ago would have helped and now my heart is screaming and I could tell her how I feel for hours yet it doesn't make a difference at all.

I wish she would try harder, I feel like we missed a the part in between giving off signs and the brick wall I'm getting now.
 

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Discussion Starter #2 (Edited)
I would prefer to just talk on the forum but thanks. It's horrible isn't it? It's so hard to see them so cold. Like a different person who just looks like your wife.

I wonder if it's worth mentioning that her parents separated once before she was born and the again for good in her teens. I don't know if that has any meaning. She can be a very angry person and is usually in a foul mood with or not speaking to at least one family member, sometimes it lasts a long time but often blows over very quickly. This seems different. Sometimes I wonder if she is stressed or depressed and it isn't really so much our marriage that is the problem but I don't want to give myself false hope. A lot has changed in our lives with the baby and she has a stressful job working awkward hours then she has a horse to take care of and trying to remain social and making sure the baby visits all the family etc. I wonder ifnshe is burned out and needs to blame something so that it makes sense but I'm not making assumptions. It seems obvious now that we will seperate even if there's a hope of reconciliation.
 

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Whichever path you take, you should ask yourself something: Do you honestly beleive that you can "change" someone's mind?
or..."Do you think you can change someone's heart?"
What is change to you? You will say you are prepared to "change" but are you truly ready for what "change" may have in store for you?
Life is tough, people make decisions and others live with them or they make decisions of their own.
Relationships change all the time, if you are un-bending in the stream the current will snap you.
There is no right or wrong here, only your personal situation matters. Be true to yourself first. Clean your house.(metaphor)
Do you best.
If things change, be ready for them as best you can..it just happens.
Only God knows his plan for us. Don't despair, be happy for health and family, that which you have..hold close. Put aside your attachements long enough and you will clearly see your worth.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I'm really having a bad evening.

We met on the internet, she lived in Wales and I lived in England. She began to visit me every week nearly even though it was expensive.

When we decided we needed more I moved to Wales because I wasn't too fond of my job and it was exciting, I've never regretted it or looked back.

But now it scared me because I will be so alone. I don't drive either so getting back to see family and more importantly taking the child to see family is going to be tough.

She is on holiday and I am alone in the house, her stuff is everywhere and I keep thinking that soon it won't be and it kills me. I love her so much, so deeply and she used to feel the same and now that she doesn't it's killing me.

I thought if our relationship was going to fail it would have been early on because we were young and the whole moving thing was so romantic and idyllic, I can't believe how far we have come for this to happen now.

I'm in such a bad place at the moment, she means everything to me. I try to console myself that I will still have my daughter and that's amazing but I want the three of us to be together, it just feels wrong any other way. She's the only one with complete empathy for how I feel about our baby, the only one who understands when I get all emotional over silly little things she has done because it makes her heart throb as well.
 

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Come on man, she's not the "only one".
Your daughter feels your love, you keep that up! You will raise a wonderful girl by supporting her in this way.
Try to remember, you aren't going to change your EX, she must come to accept change.. sometimes, people don't accept change at all. That's their perogative. You can't will this situation to your end, you are only draining yourself of vital energy by sinking into these thoughts.
Clear your mind or try at least to develop methods to arrive at nuetrality in your thoughts. Only by balancing your mind will your ability to see clearly and come about.
Suffering is universal, emancipation from it is the goal.
Everyone deserves happiness but happiness comes from within.
Quiet the mind. It is in fight or flight mode.
Focus on positive energy.
 

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I would read "No More Mr Nice Guy" and "Married Man Sex Primer". Both helped me.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
After reading your story, it sounds like you would benefit.

She makes the most noise, you cave in to "keep the peace".

Sound familiar?

https://7chan.org/lit/src/Robert_Glover_-_No_More_Mr_Nice_Guy.pdf
It's true sometimes yeah to be fair.

But other times I do talk some sense into her, when she has lost all respect for rationality lol

It's weird because she tells her friends one of the things she respects most about me is that I will stop her when she is ranting and being foolish but she never tells me that lol
 

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It's true sometimes yeah to be fair.

But other times I do talk some sense into her, when she has lost all respect for rationality lol

It's weird because she tells her friends one of the things she respects most about me is that I will stop her when she is ranting and being foolish but she never tells me that lol
Attraction and respect begin subconsciously.

On matters like this, never listen to what people say.

Watch what they actually do.



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I feel for ya. My wife was the same way. She had problems with me and instead of just sitting me down and explaining what the issue was she played the hinting game. Personally I don't take hints that well and can barely pick out any moments where they were given. I find the whole thing childish. Just speak your mind. Some people are too overcomplicated for their own good if you ask me. I really hate drama. /end-rant
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Well she has moved into her mothers temporarily. I was upset at the time but I had honestly thought some separation was for the best and after she left and I calmed down I felt a sense of calm, perhaps because things had come to a head and the anticipation was gone.

Her mother literally lives around the corner, a 60 second walk so it's good in a way because I get to see my girl a lot but there's the problem of compromising any potential benefits of the separation, she has already suggest I come around too much but seemed to think it was an attempt to be around her when it's more to do with seeing my child and her parents at the moment, her presence makes me feel awkward ( I was a bit annoyed that she thought so highly of herself!)

I'm trying to be quite calm about it, I know begging and gifts and letters etc are counter-productive at the moment and are only of any use if and when the other person decides they want to try and fix things, until then such gestures can push someone further by making them feel harassed etc.

I'm not sure I'm doing the complete 180 but I am trying to keep myself occupied and shatter her illusion that I am curled up in a corner somewhere waiting for her to come back because I'm certain she thinks that.

I think it's best she realises she can't take anything for granted and think she has the upper hand and total control of the situation, I think it would help if she realises how different things would be without me.

If we do work it out things need to be a lot more balanced, admittedly she has hormonal problems (she has pcos) but she manages to keep herself in check around strangers so she is capable of containing herself so the random screaming matches and dramatics need to stop, she has cried wolf so many times I don't think she realises the effect that has on someone.

A lot of times she will have a hormonal outburst but then feel fine the next day because there was nothing genuinely wrong but in the process she has made me genuinely upset so even though her dramatics were for show she has made real damage to me, she has recovered to normality but has left me with genuine scars that take longer to heal so while she might feel fine hours after saying she hates me or whatever I can feel bad for a week, she doesn't seem to have any understanding of that at all, because she knows it wasn't genuine she thinks it hasn't had any deep effect on me either.

And it is true, I normally keep quiet to keep the peace because it's just not worth the hassle, she has no respect for rationality, she can't accept that things upset me too so when I say I am upset about something she always invents something she is upset about worse, she wont back down or admit being wrong, she will say something absolutely ridiculous or just scream or make threats etc (no wonder I had gotten grumpy and irritable over the years!)

I dare say she can be immature.

This whole dynamic needs to change if things are to ever work.

I've spent so long not even bothering to voice my grievances that she genuinely doesn't seem to believe I've ever been upset about things in our marriage.

It's weird because other times she can be incredibly thoughtful and will fret over things that that don't bother me at all, it can be maddening because she will do inconsiderate things like say she will be an hour and then take three when shopping or seeing her horse etc (she has been like this her whole life, can't stop yapping to friends etc) and cannot understand why that is inconsiderate but then she will literally panic over something trivial.

So anyways, I'm trying to be around her less but not be overly cold or warm, I will talk to her willingly about serious stuff but I'm not going to sit there while she talks about work etc because as far as I'm concerned she gave up that kind of thing when she walked out, I'm not letting her walk out but then still have various benefits of marriage, she wont respect me or miss me that way.

I do have one question, she is going to a halloween party tonight, I said jokingly that maybe she wanted to show me her costume afterwards (nudge nudge wink wink) and while I'm not making assumptions let's just say her demeanour changed. I then said I wouldn't lock the door just in case and she made out she didn't hear me and asked me to repeat myself then she said "it's a good job I didn't answer then" with a sort of subtle grin.

I'm not saying there was anything definite there but she was obviously thinking about it and didn't give me any kind of "that would be inappropriate" response

I feel like if I said something similar again later before she goes just like "I'll see you later maybe" something maybe possibly would happen but am I right in thinking this would not be a good thing to do?

Obviously sexual frustration gets the better of everyone and I guess potentially it could help but my common sense says it would just make things more awkward and complicated.

Again I'm not saying it would definitely happen but her demeanour at that point changed temporarily and I guess it's one of life's great temptations. I don't want to approach anything like that if it's counter productive though...
 

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I'm in a similar situation. Reading posts on this site will show you that these type of situations are quite common.

I'm trying to figure out the best way to respond to my separation as well. It seems that reading posts here, that the 'man up' or fix yourself and be all business with your wife/girl/partner is the way to go. It's extremely difficult because people like you and I love our wives rationally, but made decisions that made them feel unloved or they grew apart, etc.

Good luck. Be patient and continue to show your daughter love and care.

Here's an interesting link on this site:
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/18347-fitness-tests.html
 

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Discussion Starter #17 (Edited)
Well I've managed to refrain from pretty much any displays of neediness or attempts to discuss things at all really.

Part of me thinks it's for the best but on the other hand I worry that maybe I should try and say something in case she thinks I've given up or no longer care at all.

I still care a lot but at the same time I'm not thinking about it too much so I can get on with things, I'm sort of worrying that if I'm not thinking about it too much she wont be either and wont miss me etc.

I guess what I'm saying is if I don't miss her THAT much even if it's only because I'm trying to ignore it what if she is doing the same thing and it just pushes us further apart?

I just don't know if I should continue the indifferent act or try and initiate conversations.

The problem is if I say something like hey I still care and want it to work but I'm just trying to live my every day life then it feels like all the power goes to her again and the balance swings in her favour.
 

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Well I've managed to refrain from pretty much any displays of neediness or attempts to discuss things at all really.

Part of me thinks it's for the best but on the other hand I worry that maybe I should try and say something in case she thinks I've given up or no longer care at all.

I still care a lot but at the same time I'm not thinking about it too much so I can get on with things, I'm sort of worrying that if I'm not thinking about it too much she wont be either and wont miss me etc.

I guess what I'm saying is if I don't miss her THAT much even if it's only because I'm trying to ignore it what if she is doing the same thing and it just pushes us further apart?

I just don't know if I should continue the indifferent act or try and initiate conversations.

The problem is if I say something like hey I still care and want it to work but I'm just trying to live my every day life then it feels like all the power goes to her again and the balance swings in her favour.
I wonder the same things but what I can tell you is : so far talking and being open (ie not 180) hasn't gotten me much of anywhere other than making the living situation bearable as we both try to act "normal".

Maybe the 180 works, maybe it doesn't ... But near as I can tell being emotionally available doesn't do any good either. At least with the 180 you are somewhat shielding yourself from additional hurt. I typically regret when I fall back into being my nice-guy self
 

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It is a wonderful book! I have gained a lot of insight about my hubbie and also myself.
Some women would definitely benefit from reading this book!
 

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Maybe instead of 'words about your feelings' you could just ask if she would like to go with you and the baby out to eat, or to a park, or the shopping mall. She can say yes or no. That way you show an interest without talking serious stuff that pressures her.

If she agrees to go, then don't talk R. Just focus on having a nice time and keep it light. She will be intrigued if you want to hang out together but not talk about the marriage.
 
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