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One other thing. If New Guy eventually dumps her now that she's free or things don't work out between them --- ILYBINILWY will likely turn into IABILWYA " I am back in Love with you again". It could happen. Don't fall for it. It generally means your Plan B the backup provider guy. the safety net.
Don't even dream about it. First of all, she is using him since beginning, and he didn't see it. He barely understand her, he thought being lazy and love to eat out everyday is all about romantic, how not shallow it is
She definitely is not an angel but he needs to reflect himself deeply.
 

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My guess is the unhappiness started right around the time the POSOM started saying all the things she wanted to hear. It’s like watching someone put up an internal false narrative of a 9 year relationship to justify going outside of it. At this point I doubt she will ever truly let herself reflect on what she has actually done here.
This is TYPICAL cheater handbook stuff -- they rewrite the marital history to justify themselves cheating. Happens ALL the time. This is something that YOU should stand up against and clarify to ANYONE who brings it up to you. YOU did nothing wrong here -- SHE is the cheater.

If her friends are still supporting her, then you don't need to be friends with them, right? Why be friends with someone who actively supports a cheater?
 

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Havent been avoiding anything here. I really appreciate the advice so far.
I exposed to her friend group. She did not deny the cheating when they found out and even went so far as to say how it’s so hard because I’m a good man, supporter, blah blah. I guess not surprisingly the friends did not oust her immediately and instead “won’t take sides”. I probably thought a few of them had some level of integrity and would oust her but that’s not the case.
House is listed and already has an above list offer within a few hours. She isn’t in the house at this point as she is “with her mom” aka “with OM” and it will sell within a few days so that’s that.
She has been on a mantra of saying “this is not about anything or anyone else but us, I’m just not happy and haven’t been for a long time” which is such **** on so many levels. My guess is the unhappiness started right around the time the POSOM started saying all the things she wanted to hear. It’s like watching someone put up an internal false narrative of a 9 year relationship to justify going outside of it. At this point I doubt she will ever truly let herself reflect on what she has actually done here.
Youve got a good handle on the reality. Yes, the unhappiness always sets in about the time thoights of a new man start.

right now she’s not talking bad about you. But rest assured it is likely to happen.

and no, the friends “not taking sides” is typical.

As long as you keep your chin up and keep working on building yourself a happy new life without the ex black cloud, you’ll be ok. Takes a while.

you’re doing good. Glad you outed her.
They are going to get what they deserve— each other.
Great chance they’ll cheat on one another.
 

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Havent been avoiding anything here. I really appreciate the advice so far.
I exposed to her friend group. She did not deny the cheating when they found out and even went so far as to say how it’s so hard because I’m a good man, supporter, blah blah. I guess not surprisingly the friends did not oust her immediately and instead “won’t take sides”. I probably thought a few of them had some level of integrity and would oust her but that’s not the case.
Nope. They took sides and it’s not yours. They aren’t your friends. Cut them out of your life immediately and permanently.
 

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House is listed and already has an above list offer within a few hours. She isn’t in the house at this point as she is “with her mom” aka “with OM” and it will sell within a few days so that’s that.
She has been on a mantra of saying “this is not about anything or anyone else but us, I’m just not happy and haven’t been for a long time” which is such **** on so many levels. My guess is the unhappiness started right around the time the POSOM started saying all the things she wanted to hear. It’s like watching someone put up an internal false narrative of a 9 year relationship to justify going outside of it. At this point I doubt she will ever truly let herself reflect on what she has actually done here.
It’s all cheater bull ****. Very typical. Nothing special at all. The good thing is you aren’t losing a thing. Dump a cheater gain a life.

Next up you’ll get the “let’s be friends”. Definition of friend is loyal, honest and trustworthy.

No contact is your best friend here. You don’t need her or this **** in or close to your life.
 

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Read up and apply.

Dear Chump Lady,
I am 6 months post divorce after discovering my ex-wife’s infidelity in September 2013. This holiday season my children (12, 8) are with my ex-wife abroad with her affair partner on holiday with my ex in-laws. It sucks that my kids spend time with the man that helped break up my family and end my marriage, but that’s another topic.
My question today is what happens to couple friends after divorce? Can anyone remain impartial and be friends with both sides, or do things naturally drift one way or the other over time? Can I remain friends with someone who has seen me crushed, particularly those few that know the whole story of the infidelity, and who stay friends with the ex-wife? Even more challenging, are those, who as a couple, are friendly with ex-wife and her affair partner.
After a year, I’ve decided to start letting the latter category of friends wane, because it’s too hurtful, as I wouldn’t the same to a friend. Or am I wrong or unique in my view? Do you need to have been through infidelity to fully understand the hurt that this causes?
Appreciate your view and advice.
Carlos

Dear Carlos,
You don’t need to have gone through infidelity to understand that it hurts like a ****. You just need to know that it’s unjust.
And there’s the rub, Carlos. We live in an age where people are loathe to judge injustice. Two sides to every story. No one knows what goes on in a marriage. They grew apart, blah, blah, blame shift, blah.
I can’t explain the fashion for being Above Judgment, because judgement is essential to living and especially to avoiding disaster. Should I invest my retirement savings in Beanie Babies? Should I befriend the neighborhood pedophile? Ride my bike down a flight of stairs?
If we didn’t judge people and situations, we’d be a bunch of jelly-brained imbeciles. Anyone could steal our lunch money. We’d be adrift. Good Samaritans would have to pin our addresses to our sweaters and walk us home.
Fact is, we judge every day. Worthy! Unworthy! Good risk! Bad risk!
The **** sandwich of dealing with the People Above Judgment is that they did judge, they just found you unworthy. But they don’t want to come out and say that. They’d rather pronounce the situation ambiguous and unknowing. We can all be friends, of course. Because that’s easier on them. Then they don’t have to make judgment calls or think of people differently, or rearrange their social calendars and seating charts. Let’s Pretend That Never Happened. Your grief isn’t nearly as important as their discomfort. So let’s make believe you aren’t grieving.
In fact, let’s pretend the problem is you and your bitterness and inability to confer forgiveness and move on. Then we never have to consider the injustice of this situation, the pain of you and your children, or our moral culpability at befriending someone who helped break up a marriage. If the problem is YOU and Something You Did (or did not do, like grant forgiveness), then infidelity isn’t so scary. Infidelity only happens to those who deserve it, who do the Wrong Sorts of Things. Unlike the smug People Above Judgment who are immune from chumpdom.
Cheaters have many narratives, but the favorite is happiness. Hey, we deserve to be happy. Really this is for the best. Carlos, in time, will be happier too! He’ll find someone who is a better fit, and hey, really he owes to all to this life change made possible by infidelity. No harm, no foul!
Dimmer people think… well, who can be against happiness! They don’t ask themselves at what cost? And who is paying that cost? They think… Carlos’s ex seems happy. Happy people are easier and more fun to be around than grief-stricken, angry people. Walking into Carlos’s pain is rather a bummer. So… let’s (judge!) go with the Happy People.
Don’t you like Happy People, Carlos? What’s wrong with you? Why can’t you forgive and be friends?
Well, that all makes a perverse sort of sense if you lack empathy and have no moral compass. (I’m sure stealing my bank card and buying 15 hamburgers confers happiness on someone.)
The fact is, Carlos, you don’t have anything in common with people who would be friends with your cheating ex. You don’t share the same values. You said yourself, you would not do this to a friend. Ergo — these people are not your friends. There is no reciprocity there. They would not behave in the manner you would behave. You don’t share the same moral world view.
One hard blessing of infidelity is that it shows you who your real friends are, and who is a waste of space. Who can stand with vulnerability and grief, and who runs away.
This is an opportunity, Carlos, to fix your picker in all aspects of life and cherish the people close to you, who really have your back, and dump the losers who don’t. And when you do that, you’ll discover that you’re a hell of a lot more “meh” about your ex. You ARE happier. You aren’t pick me dancing with the friendship circle over who gets the “friends.” You really don’t give a **** any more.
Your new life will eclipse your old life Carlos, and into the darkness goes the smug assholes who don’t deserve you.
 

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Have you moved money into your name only? Protected all your assets and eliminated her from using joint credit cards?
Make sure you do - because if you don’t she will swipe all the money available to her… and then likely use it for a trip with her OM.
Protect yourself every way you can!
 

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Discussion Starter · #68 ·
Have you moved money into your name only? Protected all your assets and eliminated her from using joint credit cards?
Make sure you do - because if you don’t she will swipe all the money available to her… and then likely use it for a trip with her OM.
Protect yourself every way you can!
Yes we have always kept separate bank accounts and credit cards. Good for keeping finances separate but also in hindsight makes it super easy to conceal cheating.
 

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Bud, a cheater is always gonna find a way to Cheat. That’s who they are. You’re gonna be fine long term.

Keep your eye on the future. You’ll be smarter and wiser too.

A buddy of mine’s wife left him for her boss. He ended up trading way up. He’s ecstatic now.

Good guys are hard to find and in much demand. It’s the perfect time for you to purge your life of everything about her.

IMO you aren’t losing much. Shes soiled goods.
 

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Nope. They took sides and it’s not yours. They aren’t your friends. Cut them out of your life immediately and permanently.
I agree, with any being seen as neutral, they are cowards in hiding, or them being liars, or just being moral cop-outs.

Those friends should be verbally defending you in private, though, it would be much better if it were done in mixed company.

Would-be cheaters defend other cheaters.
That dirty birds of a feather thing.

I get it.
Some (people) (friends) are capable of overlooking the moral failings in others that do not directly impact them.

Know, however, that her wayward ways will always be in the back of 'their' minds.
She is tainted.

I would weigh each of those supposed friends and see if they have other overriding worth's that you value.

Remember, it was your wife's sins, not theirs.


Are Dee-
 

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I often deeply wonder....

How is it her new lover, that other person, the POSOM, can think of her highly?

He is latching, has attached himself onto a cheater, um, from the get-go!

Now, if he has it in mind to dump her, after some period, then OK, he got his jollies off with a married woman.
Dirty mission accomplished.

But, if he marries her, he is the bigger fool, with him knowing her true worth.



Such dead and soured leaves are these, blowing and sailing over the Wayward Seas.


Nemesis- meow!
 

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I often deeply wonder....

How is it her new lover, that other person, the POSOM, can think of her highly?

He is latching, has attached himself onto a cheater, um, from the get-go!

Now, if he has it in mind to dump her, after some period, then OK, he got his jollies off with a married woman.
Dirty mission accomplished.

But, if he marries her, he is the bigger fool, with him knowing her true worth.



Such dead and soured leaves are these, blowing and sailing over the Wayward Seas.


Nemesis- meow!
You have no idea how many thirsty simps out there who are welling to wife up such a women!
 

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You have no idea how many thirsty simps out there who are welling to wife up such a women!
This is spot on.

Are you the same kaliber that was on SI. Id check the stories once in a while over there. Average advice that deals only with the beta provider side of things. That site attracts very weak betas and men who dwell in victimhood. You were the only one giving solid RP advice. I recall you ripping Apparition the Clueless.
 

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Discussion Starter · #75 ·
I often deeply wonder....

How is it her new lover, that other person, the POSOM, can think of her highly?

He is latching, has attached himself onto a cheater, um, from the get-go!

Now, if he has it in mind to dump her, after some period, then OK, he got his jollies off with a married woman.
Dirty mission accomplished.

But, if he marries her, he is the bigger fool, with him knowing her true worth.



Such dead and soured leaves are these, blowing and sailing over the Wayward Seas.


Nemesis- meow!
Funny you mention this. I had the same thought. Really how could he ever trust her knowing that they met as the result of being unfaithful in a marriage. Also, how could she trust him long term knowing he just doesn’t put any value in the vows of marriage. In reality it seems like either a match made in hell or destined to fail. For my part, I actually said that very thing To her. Not to try and change anything, but instead to plant that thought like a virus that will just fester over time.
 

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Hello all,

I am hoping this community can provide me some advice.

My wife and I have been together for 9 years and married for just under 5 years. We have had what I would consider a really strong marriage with what I discern are typical long-term relationship challenges Which I will go into.

During our time together, my wife and I have been very supportive of each other’s personal progress. I have encouraged her to take elevated roles within her company while she has supported 2 promotions on my end which required moves within the state which we live. While the first move we made was in an isolated, lower population area which she did not like, fortunately, the second move was to a larger city and brought her closer to her family. This move was one that has allowed us to have some really amazing date nights due to where we live. We started our lives together in a 1 bedroom apartment and have built a life where we now have a 4 bedroom home and while we don’t have any children (we have agreed to focus on our careers for this time period of our lives). We have travelled together both internationally and within the US to several cities and I would say that the amount of things we have experienced together is extraordinary. She also works remotely so she doesn’t have any interaction with work associates. That said, she has found a group of girlfriends her age (early 30s) which are of a similar mindset (most have SO while a few are single). I am not controlling with her friends, never saying “no” when she is going out and never being paranoid about where she was or who she was with. I would say that’s a result of solid trust and confidence in the marriage on my end. In the end, I have been a supporter, provider, lover and friend throughout our relationship and marriage.

I say all of that “good” to put into perspective the “bad” things that she says have caused her to say ILYBINILWY and that she needs to do what makes her happy. Keep in mind that we have regular date nights (regular being at least every week or every other week at most) and lunch and breakfast dates sprinkled in. The things that need work are the “day to day”, the connecting at the end of a day, cuddling on the couch etc. Also, other than the times she and I were out together, I would sometimes turn down the rare invite to do a group outing with her friends and their significant others. I now understand why that would bother her because she wants to feel the same sense of pride or show off her spouse like the others do in those group situations.

Anyway, 2 weeks ago, she hit me with the “I’m packing a bag and staying with my mom for a week, I cant do this anymore and I need to be happy”. We have not spent one day apart in anger in 9 years, so of course this was a shock to my core. Needless to say, I am a loving husband so this was something I felt a.) I needed to reflect on what drove her to this space and b.) I needed to try and reconcile with my wife. Since that time, I have tried calling my wife (no response to phone calls) and texting her with my reflections on how I can be a better man and husband for her, including going on the trips with friends and spending quality time together each night. I received no response to that very long text message. I sent flowers to her mother‘s house with cards indicating my acceptance of responsibility in where we are and how we got here. She responded with only a “thanks for the flowers”. While she was away with her mother, I came to find out that she had texted her group of friends and said she wold need their support because she was making a life change and separating from me. Note that this is how I found out about the impending separation. So on Sunday, when she came back, I laid it all out. At least face-to-face I could say very calmly and without losing my cool, that I was committed to making these changes in our lives to make her happy And feel loved. I also recapped all of the great adventures we have been on and the life we have built together to let her know our story wasn’t finished yet. Her response to all of that was a very short, “I appreciate you saying that but I need to be happy and this doesn’t make me happy anymore.”

So with that she wants to sell our house and start the process of a divorce. We are going to live in the house together until it sells (her in the master, me in a guest bedroom). This has come completely out of the blue to me and even though I admit to being faulty in some areas, those areas are not unworkable to the point that you cant even communicate with your other half of 9 years.

A few days ago, curiosity got the better of me. I have never done this in our 9 years together but at this point I had to know. I looked at her phone and found the cause. She has been having an affair with another man. My guess is that since she is at home 99% of every day, that this came about either at the gym or during her time in her Master’s degree class (one day a week). Regardless of the when/where/how, she seems to have developed such a powerful relationship with this guy, that she is not only willing, but actively rushing into a divorce with the person who she grew and built life around. During this week after she said she wanted a divorce, she has been trying to goat me into getting angry or losing my cool. She gets annoyed when I try to talk to her in the house. She has yelled when I asked for simple closure. At all times, I have kept my cool and been calm in our conversations.

I guess my question to the group here is, why would a woman leave what seems to be a perfect life for a lustful one-off? If the things we shared together weren’t enough to deserve a conversation of “I’m not happy” before leaving, then I am not sure how any woman would be capable of ever being happy In life. I assume she is moving hard forward with the divorce and once the house sells that will be it. She probably will never even reflect on what she has just given up because there is already someone there to “make it better”.

What would you do in this situation? It is hard to be blindsided like this and from my perspective I’ve never wanted to spend a day apart much less not try to save the marriage. She just is not having any of that conversation. Do I just make plans to move on with my life? This is so raw no new I haven’t really even processed it yet, much less made that kind of a plan.

Any insight or guidance you may have is appreciated!
Do not waste your time. Let her mom know what is going on and then tell your soon to be ex Do not speak or call me ever again. I am no longer here for you
 

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Funny you mention this. I had the same thought. Really how could he ever trust her knowing that they met as the result of being unfaithful in a marriage. Also, how could she trust him long term knowing he just doesn’t put any value in the vows of marriage. In reality it seems like either a match made in hell or destined to fail. For my part, I actually said that very thing To her. Not to try and change anything, but instead to plant that thought like a virus that will just fester over time.
It's all a fantasy.

Affairs don't have the capability to recognize such rational thoughts...until exposure occurs.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
 
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This is spot on.

Are you the same kaliber that was on SI. Id check the stories once in a while over there. Average advice that deals only with the beta provider side of things. That site attracts very weak betas and men who dwell in victimhood. You were the only one giving solid RP advice. I recall you ripping Apparition the Clueless.
Hay @manowar, yes its's me, I got kicked from SI
I will post a separate topic in the "The Men's Clubhouse" today

I don't want to thread jack this thread
 

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Havent been avoiding anything here. I really appreciate the advice so far.
I exposed to her friend group. She did not deny the cheating when they found out and even went so far as to say how it’s so hard because I’m a good man, supporter, blah blah. I guess not surprisingly the friends did not oust her immediately and instead “won’t take sides”. I probably thought a few of them had some level of integrity and would oust her but that’s not the case.
House is listed and already has an above list offer within a few hours. She isn’t in the house at this point as she is “with her mom” aka “with OM” and it will sell within a few days so that’s that.
She has been on a mantra of saying “this is not about anything or anyone else but us, I’m just not happy and haven’t been for a long time” which is such **** on so many levels. My guess is the unhappiness started right around the time the POSOM started saying all the things she wanted to hear. It’s like watching someone put up an internal false narrative of a 9 year relationship to justify going outside of it. At this point I doubt she will ever truly let herself reflect on what she has actually done here.
after this whole whirlwind of bad juju is over, take some time to unwind. join a health club, go on long hikes, get in shape, really do a lot of physical things and work to get this all out of your mind. all of this will pass, and you will pop out the other side a stronger person! good luck!
 
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