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FM, why do you believe you can make this work if she comes home? She doesn't care about going to debt. She's combative when challenged. She isn't going to go to therapy or take her meds. What solution are you expecting to reach if she comes home?
 

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Discussion Starter #82
FM, why do you believe you can make this work if she comes home? She doesn't care about going to debt. She's combative when challenged. She isn't going to go to therapy or take her meds. What solution are you expecting to reach if she comes home?
Good question! I guess I'm just being foolish in trying to honor my vows and thinking it's a temporary phase that she'll snap out of. My daughters have hope, so I'm trying to hope with them
 

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Good question! I guess I'm just being foolish in trying to honor my vows and thinking it's a temporary phase that she'll snap out of. My daughters have hope, so I'm trying to hope with them
I hear ya. But don’t let her take advantage of you too much. And you need to establish strong boundaries of what you will not accept.
 

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Discussion Starter #84
I hear ya. But don’t let her take advantage of you too much. And you need to establish strong boundaries of what you will not accept.
Thinking about sending her one more text since I haven't initiated any contact with her in over a month
 

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So, what are you going to say in the text that she does not already know? You have shown her the facts relative to finances.

Has she ever been sexually abused as far as you know? How have other parts of your marriage been? You want to take the moral high road and keep your vows, but that is mostly legalistic. You only express emotions when your children are involved.

This became worse 3-4 years ago. Did something happen at that time? We have sort of ignored the BPD possibilities. Do you ever feel that no matter what you do, you are always wrong? Hoping you have done a lot of research on BPD. Our BPD guru might be of some help. @Uptown.

You have an appointment with a lawyer this week. Listen to her/him and hasten to do as suggested.
 

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Discussion Starter #86
So, what are you going to say in the text that she does not already know? You have shown her the facts relative to finances.

Has she ever been sexually abused as far as you know? How have other parts of your marriage been? You want to take the moral high road and keep your vows, but that is mostly legalistic. You only express emotions when your children are involved.

This became worse 3-4 years ago. Did something happen at that time? We have sort of ignored the BPD possibilities. Do you ever feel that no matter what you do, you are always wrong? Hoping you have done a lot of research on BPD. Our BPD guru might be of some help. @Uptown.

You have an appointment with a lawyer this week. Listen to her/him and hasten to do as suggested.
Not sure what I can say in the text. Her grandmother whom she was very close to died 5 years ago. The money issues started about 4 years ago and yes, no matter what I do she's never satisfied...always wants more. She pulled the ”you’re not affectionate enough” card on me, but I put extreme thought into everything we did. My therapist also said it sounds like BPD. She always takes feedback as yelling or attacking, which is frustrating. I do assume there is something from her childhood that she hasn't told me about. In previous conversations over the years, she would always say there were things she needs to deal with from her childhood, but never elaborated.
 

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Entitled seems to be an understatement. It's funny that everything she says about others is exactly what she does/is herself. I can't begin to count how many times she has said to my daughters that they think they are entitled for the simplest of things
From what you write, it looks like it is not just entitlement. It is outright defiance. It's almost like a teenager rebelling against authority. You represent a persona of responsibility and limitations. That's why, as you say, even when she gets what she wants, she is not happy. It's not the issue of wanting this item of clothing or this piece of jewelry, etc. It's the issue of being RESTRICTED and LIMITED, even in the face of reality and responsible behavior. That's what she is rebelling against. That's why she calls you "financially abusive" instead of just being a "worrier" or "tightwad" or "miser". Because you represent limitations.

Honestly, she actually needs counseling to work through this self-destructive rebellion, in my opinion.
 

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Not sure what I can say in the text. Her grandmother whom she was very close to died 5 years ago. The money issues started about 4 years ago and yes, no matter what I do she's never satisfied...always wants more. She pulled the ”you’re not affectionate enough” card on me, but I put extreme thought into everything we did. My therapist also said it sounds like BPD. She always takes feedback as yelling or attacking, which is frustrating. I do assume there is something from her childhood that she hasn't told me about. In previous conversations over the years, she would always say there were things she needs to deal with from her childhood, but never elaborated.
Most women do not truly appreciate the effort given by their spouse as affection. Have you asked what she means when she says you are not affectionate enough--as in examples? What is her Love Language?
Find out about her childhood and you will discover many answers to your questions! Read about Dialectical Behavior Therapy. There is a DBT Clinical Resource Directory maintained by an organization founded by Dr. Marsha Linehan (Behavioral Tech).
 

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She refused medication when she was diagnosed back in October. Her reason was she doesn't want to feel like she's crazy
Run, run far away. Your wife is just worried about getting her way as much as possible with as little challenge or effort as possible. Everything is about her. What is the advantage to her getting her behavior under control? In her view, she's going to be doing hard work (therapy and medication) to learn to accept that she needs to lower her expectations.

To her, that's a loss all around. A normal person would worry about getting their behavior under control to not hurt their loved ones. But, your wife is not there. She wants to know that she's okay and that's it; that's why she doesn't even want to talk to your kids.

Why would you want to subject yourself (and, perhaps more importantly, your kids) to that sort of behavior? You all are better off without her.
 

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Discussion Starter #90
From what you write, it looks like it is not just entitlement. It is outright defiance. It's almost like a teenager rebelling against authority. You represent a persona of responsibility and limitations. That's why, as you say, even when she gets what she wants, she is not happy. It's not the issue of wanting this item of clothing or this piece of jewelry, etc. It's the issue of being RESTRICTED and LIMITED, even in the face of reality and responsible behavior. That's what she is rebelling against. That's why she calls you "financially abusive" instead of just being a "worrier" or "tightwad" or "miser". Because you represent limitations.

Honestly, she actually needs counseling to work through this self-destructive rebellion, in my opinion.
Ironic that you say that. She has said countless times that she doesn't know why she shuts down to me, and that she needed counseling to work through the issue.

My therapist wants to get all 4 of us in counseling together, not just my daughters and I, to really get to the issue because something isn't adding up.

You're absolutely right that she does not like restrictions and does rebel as she has admitted. Most of our disagreements have been triggered by money. She claims she has never felt equal, but I have letters and text messages she wrote me saying how great of a husband and example for our daughters I am.

Also, she has mentioned to our daughters that she is jealous of them having a close relationship with me, even telling my 15 year old daughter ”I’m his wife not you.” It's almost as if she felt she was in competition with my daughters for my attention
 

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Discussion Starter #91
Most women do not truly appreciate the effort given by their spouse as affection. Have you asked what she means when she says you are not affectionate enough--as in examples? What is her Love Language?
Find out about her childhood and you will discover many answers to your questions! Read about Dialectical Behavior Therapy. There is a DBT Clinical Resource Directory maintained by an organization founded by Dr. Marsha Linehan (Behavioral Tech).
I have asked and she said compliments and physical affection. However, I did compliment her, it was just not all day each day. I was more of the show my love through action. I was sexually abused as a child and never spoke of until this past January after an argument we had. I realized it caused me to be uncomfortable the affection at certain times, not just with my wife, but family and friends in general. I brought it to my wife's attention because I knew I began to see I was subconsciously blocking it out, but it was affecting me showing love through physical touch. I'm even uncomfortable with kissing or hugging my daughters.

I promised my wife that I would make adjustments because I do love her and think she is the most beautiful woman in the world. Just that one conversation was a huge weight off my shoulders as I carried that around over 30 years.

It became easier to show more affection to my wife and compliment her verbally more often, but she said it seemed forced. However, it was genuine from my end because it's something I always wanted to do and I was proud of my breakthrough.
 

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Plenty of parents are jealous of their children and the attention they get — especially when it involves same-sex children — so it’s entirely possible she’s jealous of your daughters. And competing with them. But you’ve got much bigger issues to deal with. She‘s a very self-absorbed person and people like her see no reason they should change (although they want everyone else to).
 

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Discussion Starter #93
Plenty of parents are jealous of their children and the attention they get — especially when it involves same-sex children — so it’s entirely possible she’s jealous of your daughters. But you’ve got much bigger issues to deal with. She‘s a very self-absorbed person and people like her see no reason they should change (although they want everyone else to).
You hit the bullseye with that because she only request changes from others, but when we request changes from her, it's either attacking or she says ”I guess I can't do anything right”
 

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Thinking about sending her one more text since I haven't initiated any contact with her in over a month
So what has your wife been doing off by herself for the past month? Do you have ANY idea? Sounds like the irresponsibility can go off in many directions, not just financial.
Be wary that if she goes SO deep in debt that she will want to come back and "nice" you to take her back, because she's broke.
 

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So what has your wife been doing off by herself for the past month? Do you have ANY idea? Sounds like the irresponsibility can go off in many directions, not just financial.
Be wary that if she goes SO deep in debt that she will want to come back and "nice" you to take her back, because she's broke.
Not sure as to what exactly she's been doing to be honest
 

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Not sure as to what exactly she's been doing to be honest
Don't worry about it. Get a good attorney and file.
She abandoned you and your children.
She has been financially irresponsible. Then she thought having the overhead of a second household would be helpful.
She is mentally unstable. I hope you have documented her actions.
You have had to place your kids in counseling because of her abandonment. You have noted times that she has been cruel and disrespectful to them.
On top of it all, her friends seem to have more agency in your marriage than you do.
She is absolutely toxic. She should bear the brunt of that.
Go for sole custody. She moved out. The only time she is near her children is when they call. They have to be sick of it.
Free yourself, and allow her to go do her own thing (whatever that is.) Under no circumstances, should you take her back.
 

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Discussion Starter #98
Don't worry about it. Get a good attorney and file.
She abandoned you and your children.
She has been financially irresponsible. Then she thought having the overhead of a second household would be helpful.
She is mentally unstable. I hope you have documented her actions.
You have had to place your kids in counseling because of her abandonment. You have noted times that she has been cruel and disrespectful to them.
On top of it all, her friends seem to have more agency in your marriage than you do.
She is absolutely toxic. She should bear the brunt of that.
Go for sole custody. She moved out. The only time she is near her children is when they call. They have to be sick of it.
Free yourself, and allow her to go do her own thing (whatever that is.) Under no circumstances, should you take her back.
My situation hurts like hell and it sucks bad!
 

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My situation hurts like hell and it sucks bad!
That is clear.
I feel for you and your children.
It's painful to read. I can't even imagine having to live it.
It takes two to make a marriage work. Evidently, your wife is unwilling or unable to step up and do her part.
In the interim, you and your kids are suffering.
I know it is easy for me to say, and harder for you to do but the only viable option is for you to move on.
Your filing might jolt her to action, but deep down you know it would be long term pain for a short term gain.
Pull the bandaid off once, and get it done.
She can only hurt you and your kids with your permission.
 
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