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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey all... just another update

My STBX and I have come to understand each other alot more since seperating, and we've also come to realise how we have contributed to our messed up dynamics from the start - and it seems we have come full circle. What started all this was our inter-religious issues, and now we're back to it.

My counsellor said that many relationships don't go straight up and down they spiral up and down which I believe is quite true. Considering how much we've learnt about ourselves, each other, and our marriage since seperation I don't see reconciliation in the works at the moment.

She is starting to wake up however, and admits to her sex addiction problem (finally! it took FOUR YEARS for her to admit), and is considering my suggestion for her to do IC, to find the help and support she needs through her issues which have obviously not been professionally dealt with.

There's hope here, but I don't feel love. I still feel the sense of belonging and obligation to her however, I just don't know where to go from here. I have yet to finish this "Awareness" book which I feel is important for me so I can detach myself from dramas in the future and deal with them without taking part of it, but for my family... I don't know.

What do you guys suggest?
 

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Be good to yourself. After all, you're the only person who's guaranteed to be your life forever.

Don't beat yourself up. Just concentrate on being the best randomdude you can be.
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There's hope here, but I don't feel love. I still feel the sense of belonging and obligation to her however, I just don't know where to go from here.

What do you guys suggest?
I suggest that sentence indicates you're still committed emotionally to wanting this to work.

Perhaps you don't feel the hormones jump when you think of her, but you're still seeing your future as being combined with hers.

Habit? Perhaps.

But then isn't loveing your partner partly about having the right habits? YOu're not so poisoned inside that you can still look at a possible life with her ( this time in a good relationship ) and say "I want that!". And that's what you're doing, right?

It's where I am right now. I don't have an infatuation, was over long ago. Her the same with me, if she ever did.

But, one can make an emotional love grow, and there's a ton of advice and information on how to make that happen here. It takes the rational part of you to commit to doing it and both of you making the other FEEL it emotionally. I need my wife to do the things that make me love her. And, I need to do the things that her love me (not "make" in a sense of force, but in a sense of nurturing).

I can't do it without her, she can't do it without me. I can't carry the whole relationship... nor can she. But to make it work requires the rational side to commit and plan of action.
 

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What’s often said here is that a wife wont “wake up” until she sees the divorce papers. That’s when things become “real”, when they look to see the part they played in the demise (or potential demise) of their marriage. My wife was the same, only when separated for 6 months did she ever “admit” to any behavioural problems.

But sometimes these epiphany moments come too late and we “just don’t care” such were the difficulties we had in the marriage. It’s often a case of too little and way too late.



But there’s also another side to all this. You have been very much the codependent to your wife’s sexual needs. And just like the guy married to an alcoholic woman, once she gets herself some healthy sexual behaviour (the alcoholic stops drinking) all your emotions associated with her “bad” behaviour leave you. Such that you feel empty inside.

And now that you haven’t got those deep emotions in you fogging the way you perceive your wife you can actually begin to see the woman she really is behind her mask (maybe).


So you’re like a codependent without a raison d'être. It can feel extremely like freedom but sometimes deeply disconcerting at the same time.


It may be that the two of you can “rejoin” but instead of into a codependent type relationship (you’ve stopped drinking, your wife may get healthy sexual needs) this time into an interdependent relationship.

Interdependent relationships are the healthy ones. But for them to be successful you need common goals, common interests and common qualities. If there is still love between the two of you it may well be worth exploring to see if you’re both up for an interdependent relationship.
 

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If you suddenly turned your feelings back on after being treated like a d!ck for all these years then I'd be sadly disappointed in you. An admission from her is nothing but words at this point.

There is nothing for you to DO now but work on you now. The ball is in her court. If she truly wants you back she will move heaven and earth to make that happen.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thanks guys!

As for seeing a future with my STBX - Yes, that is true, I don't think I can see us really cut ties completely, even if we didn't have our daughter. No one really knows us that close except for each other - that's the thing with us, the one thing we have in common, we both have our dark pasts we don't talk about with our mates. Unfortunately, that also means it's going to make moving on extremely difficult - if we do not reconcile.

You're right about emotional love, if we are to reconcile then we have to start taking our relationship and commitment seriously, we've dragged each other downhill for the last 5 years. Start working together instead of power struggles. She's starting to see that but I guess as what Mavash mentioned -> it's still just words at the moment. I also have no idea how long it would take her to heal from this, and if it's even going to be in time when we can finally legally sign the papers - as then it will be too late.

You guys are right too that I do need to work on myself mainly, and this is the best time, I'm seperated!!! I still have my responsibilities as a father but I have this space to fix up what needs to be fixed! I am absolutely not ready for reconciliation at all and I don't want it either considering the flood of information that's coming up in regards to my marriage and my f--kups. Once I am content do I think I can be ready to even give us another try.

What's raison d'etre btw? :scratchhead:
As for interdependence yes, we've only scratched the surface of how it could be like for our relationship if we establish that, that still looks like a LONG way ahead for us now however, we've both burnt ourselves out. The strange thing is that we actually have alot in common, so it's indeed possible, yet what we have in common ends up tearing us apart at times. Stubborness being the most obvious example.
 

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Raison d'être: French phrase meaning "reason for existence."
It’s especially true for codependents. They try and change something they don’t like about their partner. For example try and stop their alcoholic partner from drinking or their BPD partner from being BPD.

This becomes a major part of the existence of the codependent within their marriage. Or at least the major source of very deep and powerful emotions.

If their partner is “cured” then those emotions no longer exist, so it can feel like an emotionless, flat marriage. In essence RD your emotions were hijacked on a daily basis, forced upon you by your wife’s behaviour. And she was never going to let up while you were with her.

Now you are separated you have “left the institution” and along with that all those deep negative emotions have left you as well.

It will take time for you to “adjust” to your new found peace and calm. Those healthy emotions can now re-enter you because the “chaos” that was there inside of you have left.

Now it gets really interesting as it sounds like you are going through the introspective phase. Because your eyes, heart and attention are away from the craziness that was outside of you, you can start to look inside of you and in a somewhat dispassionate way at the historically dynamics of your marriage. It will start to become clear what your contributions were to the craziness that was there. By craziness I mean dysfunction.


It will take a while to process it all. Don’t be hard on yourself. We all live and learn, we all make mistakes. The thing is to learn from them and apologise for them if you feel it’s necessary and wont cause you any harm.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Thanks AFEH, I'm doing my best, starting to miss being married atm, but otherwise still adjusting/clarifying/studying my marital issues. Our daughter is coping well, still misses me though whenever she's not with me, but otherwise my STBX and I are working through it.

I also had a call for a date from that lady friend a while back during the first days of seperation -> I told her that I'm just not ready for anything - not even sex. She understood finally but it looks like I just burned down a bridge. My STBX gave me free reign to do as I please but I rejected her offer, and she's not interested in anyone else at the moment (I wonder what she's doing to cope from her sexual system shock though - VERY suspicious)

If I end up holding off from sex only to find out my STBX lied to me and banged someone while I'm living out this dry spell and burning hot opportunities like that lady friend... I'm going to be p-ssed!
 

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I think during these times of high emotions, tensions and stress if we approach it all with the goal of learning about ourselves and our stbxw we come to know a great deal about the two of us.

For example your stbxw giving you free reign to do whatever you please. Mine said the same, to the point of she doesn’t mind if I go with other women.

That deeply hurt. To me it demonstrated perhaps more than anything that she neither loved or valued me in her life. Yet if I hadn’t ended it she’d have still been with me. Who would ever say such a thing to a person they were in love with and valued? So from my perspective I think you can actually rest assured that your wife neither loves you or values you.


But why did my wife actually say such a thing? By spying on her I discovered that she said it so that she could use it in the divorce court if I’d actually taken up with another women while we were separated.


Be very careful RD. We think we know the person we were devoted go, gave our all to and spent a long time with. It seems to me we kind of wake up one morning to discover we’ve been living with a stranger. You cannot take anything your stbxw tells you at face value. It’s why I no longer talk with my stbxw, I just expect her to lie.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Yes, I found the "free reign" thing rather odd considering she has always been a bit possessive. My gut tells me that she's trying to get me to push the knife in deeper, so she can move on easier. I don't know what love is anymore, too confused now.

I just hope she isn't lying or trying to play revenge, our daughter needs both of us to be stable and cooperative. If she does play revenge though, she'll become the one biggest threat to my daughter and that means war. Hopefully it won't come to that.

But if she is lying, she should be banging someone else yes? Considering I'm already in a system shock I can't imagine how she's feeling from sex daily to nothing and knowing that we're heading to the dumpster - even though I trust that she has been loyal thus far, at this point of time -> she's capable of anything.

Tempted to just get laid so I feel better but hell I have no idea whats going on with her.
 
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