When a man cheats, everything else goes out the window....

2591 Views 117 Replies 31 Participants Last post by DonJuan, 9 d ago

Airtight

Discussion Starter · 15 d ago

A good example of this was the movie Fatal Attraction. Michael Douglas cheats on his wife and he rightfully so is the bad guy. Though what gets lost is early in the movie his wife is shown to be giving there daughter more attention and him less.

I knew a woman that had a simular cheating situation happen to her. I asked her if she learned anything from it or knew what role she may have played in it for it to happen. She said no, there was nothing for me to learn. He was the one that cheated on me, she said.

Likely she will go into another relationship with someone else and do the same thing. Even if the guy tries to talk to her about it, she will likely not understand why he's complaining. Even though she will be doing the samething that was done in her last relationship that drove a guy to cheat. All because once a man cheats, it's all about him and nothing about what she did for him to consider stepping out.

Reactions: 1

1 - 20 of 118 Posts

ConanHub

· #2 · 15 d ago

Same can be applied to women who cheat.

Cheating is totally on the cheater but the relationship could definitely have problems caused by the non cheating partner.

It is up to people how they choose to deal with relationship problems.

Cheating in response to relationship problems is like drinking mercury in response to cancer.

Reactions: 5

Laurentium

· #3 · 15 d ago

Airtight said:
I knew a woman that had a similar cheating situation happen to her. I asked her if she learned anything from it or knew what role she may have played in it for it to happen. She said no, there was nothing for me to learn. He was the one that cheated on me, she said.

Likely she will go into another relationship with someone else and do the same thing.

Yes. This is why I get heated about threads on here where people say the cheater should go in to IC, rather than couple therapy. Because then the betrayed party probably learns nothing useful. It does no good.

It seems obvious to me. If someone leaves their car door unlocked with a laptop on the seat, and it gets stolen ... the thief is the one morally in the wrong. The victim did nothing morally wrong ... but they need to change their behaviour!! What's so hard to understand?

Reactions: 5

Iadron

· #4 · 15 d ago

Bad choice in men (and women) can be a character flaw. I’m sure we all know that person who always a seems to pick bad boyfriend/girlfriend/fiancés/spouses/exs.

Reactions: 2

In Absentia

· #5 · 15 d ago

You don't need to cheat. Just divorce.

Reactions: 5

Teacherwifemom

· #6 · 15 d ago

In Absentia said:
You don't need to cheat. Just divorce.

Truth. And also realize that young children literally need their every need met to stay alive. Better yet, step up to the plate and don’t make one parent do 90% of the caregiving, especially when the other parent is working too. A man that cheats because his wife is tending the children “too much” is a child, not a man. A conversation can go a long way.

Reactions: 5

Benbutton

· #7 · 15 d ago

Laurentium said:
Yes. This is why I get heated about threads on here where people say the cheater should go in to IC, rather than couple therapy. Because then the betrayed party probably learns nothing useful. It does no good.

It seems obvious to me. If someone leaves their car door unlocked with a laptop on the seat, and it gets stolen ... the thief is the one morally in the wrong. The victim did nothing morally wrong ... but they need to change their behaviour!! What's so hard to understand?

While I agree with you, for those of us who have tried the couples therapy route it a) is often times too late, and b) the potential for bias on the therapist part or one parties belief there is (the latter not being the fault of the therapist).

Bluesclues

· #8 · 15 d ago

Laurentium said:
Yes. This is why I get heated about threads on here where people say the cheater should go in to IC, rather than couple therapy. Because then the betrayed party probably learns nothing useful. It does no good.

It seems obvious to me. If someone leaves their car door unlocked with a laptop on the seat, and it gets stolen ... the thief is the one morally in the wrong. The victim did nothing morally wrong ... but they need to change their behaviour!! What's so hard to understand?

Would you concede that IC for both is actually more useful than couples therapy in the wake of cheating? My anger was at homicidal levels and couples therapy only served to fuel that anger. I was in no place to accept criticism before IC.

Reactions: 2

oldshirt

· #9 · 15 d ago

Laurentium said:
Yes. This is why I get heated about threads on here where people say the cheater should go in to IC, rather than couple therapy. Because then the betrayed party probably learns nothing useful. It does no good.

It seems obvious to me. If someone leaves their car door unlocked with a laptop on the seat, and it gets stolen ... the thief is the one morally in the wrong. The victim did nothing morally wrong ... but they need to change their behaviour!! What's so hard to understand?

It's not hard to understand but rather it is very threatening to the ego.

In my youth I was cheated on and devastated by a couple LTR GFs that I was in love with. When I was doing the Nancy Kerrigan "WWWHHHHYYYYYYYYY??!" My options as to why they cheated and broke my heart were either I was not tall enough, good looking enough, sexy enough or good enough in bed etc .............. or that they were skanky ho's.

Which option do you think my 19 and 22 year old ego went with?

Now was that the more healthy and self-reflective option that lead to more personal growth and long term development of the self?? Probably not.

But when you're already heartbroken and your self esteem has already taken a big hit, it is a big ask to ask someone to do some serious self-reflection and ask them what their contribution to the situation was.

Many will see MC as a 'blame-the-victim' type thing when the BS is asked to examine what their role in the WS hooking up with a random at the bar was.

As disinterested 3rd parties we may be able to sit and see the rational when the BS hasn't touched the WS in a year and the only interaction between them is the BS criticising them for every little thing they do.

But when you're self esteem is already in the toilet and you've already had your heart broken and now you are being told to examine why your partner is getting with someone better looking and sexier and more interesting etc it can overwhelm the ego and threaten one's sense of self even more.

Now maybe in the long run, sure, that self reflection and personal accountability can lead to growth and development and self improvement etc. But the ego will fight for it's own survival in the opening acts and it's target will be the WS no matter how crappy of a partner the BS really was at the time.

See less See more

Reactions: 3

oldshirt

· #10 · 15 d ago

oldshirt said:
In my youth I was cheated on and devastated by a couple LTR GFs that I was in love with. When I was doing the Nancy Kerrigan "WWWHHHHYYYYYYYYY??!" My options as to why they cheated and broke my heart were either I was not tall enough, good looking enough, sexy enough or good enough in bed etc .............. or that they were skanky ho's.

Which option do you think my 19 and 22 year old ego went with?

Now was that the more healthy and self-reflective option that lead to more personal growth and long term development of the self?? Probably not.

Now to be fair, years later I was able to look back and evaluate my actions in those relationships and I was able to see that in fact I wasn't Mr Sexy God and I wasn't putting my best self forward and I in fact wasn't as sexy or good looking or as good in bed or have as fun and exciting of a lifestyle as I could have,, but these were 19 year old girls that were reaching drinking age (19 was the legal drinking age at that time) and discovering the club scene and were having tons of guys approaching them and promising them the world etc and since I was not a drinker or a partier or a clubber, we simply were not compatible and I was in the wrong for thinking that we should be riding off into the sunset together at that age and that stage in our lives.

But in the moment I wasn't capable of that level of self reflection and world experience. I was simply too young and had not had enough life experience.

Should a 35 year old person with children and a home and family be better adapted to engage in some honest and serious self evaluation than a 22 year old infatuated with a 19 year old?? Gawd I hope so!!

But I think the principle is still the same in that the ego's initial response is to defend it'self at all costs during the initial assault.

Once things get to where the ego doesn't feel that it's survival is at stake can the BS engage in any real meaningful self reflection and honest evaluation of their own role in the infidelity.

And some people will never reach that point. Perhaps most won't.

And the reality is that in many cases the WS really is the asshole and there was no bona fide culpability on the part of the BS.

Sometimes the true value of self reflection and self analysis on the part of the BS is in realizing after DUE DILIGENT self reflection that they really are not to blame for the WS's actions.

See less See more

Reactions: 2

SunCMars

· #11 · 15 d ago

It is moral failure, those acts, that finally sinks a ship.

It is those nasty verbal slips, that spilled acidic bile, that causes a ship to list, to tilt at sea.

The Captain, or the Second Mate can be party to both these actions.

Reactions: 2

re16

· #12 · 15 d ago (Edited)

ConanHub said:
Cheating in response to relationship problems is like drinking mercury in response to cancer.

Absolutely, I don't understand the cheaters that essentially say "my spouse drove me to it".... ok, why not just leave when it is so bad, and then date freely.

Creating a secret relationship is a character flaw and absolutely not justifiable in any situation.

Reactions: 5

aine

· #13 · 15 d ago

Airtight said:
A good example of this was the movie Fatal Attraction. Michael Douglas cheats on his wife and he rightfully so is the bad guy. Though what gets lost is early in the movie his wife is shown to be giving there daughter more attention and him less.

I knew a woman that had a simular cheating situation happen to her. I asked her if she learned anything from it or knew what role she may have played in it for it to happen. She said no, there was nothing for me to learn. He was the one that cheated on me, she said.

Likely she will go into another relationship with someone else and do the same thing. Even if the guy tries to talk to her about it, she will likely not understand why he's complaining. Even though she will be doing the samething that was done in her last relationship that drove a guy to cheat. All because once a man cheats, it's all about him and nothing about what she did for him to consider stepping out.

Wow, a real man would talk to his partner about how he feels not run out and stick his **** in another woman, really mature. Cheating is 100% on the cheater.

Reactions: 5

Laurentium

· #14 · 15 d ago

Bluesclues said:
Would you concede that IC for both is actually more useful than couples therapy in the wake of cheating?

Generally, no. However there are exceptions like this:

My anger was at homicidal levels and couples therapy only served to fuel that anger. I was in no place to accept criticism before IC.

Reactions: 1

MJJEAN

· #15 · 15 d ago

Airtight said:
I asked her if she learned anything from it or knew what role she may have played in it for it to happen. She said no, there was nothing for me to learn. He was the one that cheated on me, she said.

I tend to agree with her here. She is who she is.

Airtight said:
Likely she will go into another relationship with someone else and do the same thing.

Probably. But then I see it...whatever "it" happens to be... as more a compatibility issue. Whatever thing she did may have been far too much for Husband A, but is not a problem at all for Husband B.

Teacherwifemom said:
A man that cheats because his wife is tending the children “too much” is a child, not a man. A conversation can go a long way.

Eh, I've watched some women go mommy mode 24/7 and utterly abandon their roles as women and wives. And yes, they were made aware it was a problem to no avail. So, I do not necessarily hold your view. There is such a thing as too much.

Reactions: 2

Laurentium

· #16 · 15 d ago

Teacherwifemom said:
step up to the plate and don’t make one parent do 90% of the caregiving, especially when the other parent is working too.

Ok, but sometimes that parent insists on doing 90%, for various reasons.

A conversation can go a long way.

Sometimes, sometimes not. It takes two to have a conversation.

So let's first agree that cheating is wrong, and is not the answer.

How would we deal with this scenario, if they came to counselling?

A man that cheats because his wife is tending the children “too much”

The first stage is going to be addressing her anger and hurt. Eliciting some expression of real remorse from him. Asking her if she has any unanswered questions, or needs more access to his devices. It depends so much on how he is responding. If he strikes a pose of indignation, it's probably over. I'm going to be warning him that if more truth trickles out, as we proceed, then that may destroy any chances of recovery.

Of course there is a lot of fact gathering. Has he spent a lot of money on the Other Woman? How long did this go on? Who knew? Who helped him conceal it? He's got to squirm . The only question I'm not asking, really, is why did you do it? Because he probably has no useful answer. What I most want to ask is, tell me about how you think she feels.

And maybe then, many sessions later, we can gently turn to the question of what the marriage was like before this happened? If they recover, how do they want it to be better than it used to be? How can we make it stronger? And that may involve both of them.

See less See more

Reactions: 2

so_sweet

· #17 · 15 d ago

Just a few words on being a mother and a wife...

I'm a mom of four and I have a happy husband (we're both happy). Though, if it matters, I was a single mom when my husband and I met, so he saw how I was as a mother before we got married.

I think it's about balance and also being on the same page when it comes to parenting. For example, for my husband and I, the kids come first (being on the same page), but also hubby and I spend quality time together and have regular date nights (balance).

As for cheating because a person thinks their spouse tends to the kids more than them, that's just an excuse. Maybe folks who use that as an excuse didn't really give much thought to having children because having kids changes a couple's relationship in many ways, especially when the children are young.

See less See more

Reactions: 4

Diana7

· #18 · 15 d ago

No one drives anyone to cheat. They choose to cheat.

Reactions: 5

Openminded

· #19 · 15 d ago

Diana7 said:
No one drives anyone to cheat. They choose to cheat.

Yes, they do choose that path. And they usually aren’t planning on divorcing their spouse either. They just want to do as they please. My exH fought the divorce and swore he loved me more than life. The first time I bought it but not the second time. They tend to run that game as long as they can.

Reactions: 5

Laurentium

· #20 · 15 d ago

Diana7 said:
No one drives anyone to cheat. They choose to cheat.

Serious question though, if you feel like that, do you think you could do what I do, help people recover from it if they both want to? I think if I felt like that, I would lose all hope for humanity.

Reactions: 1

1 - 20 of 118 Posts