You're kidding, right? Your husband is a serial cheater; he doesn't deserve to heal from the very same hurt that he's repeatedly visited upon others.

And for the rest of it...?

HOLY. CRAP.

Please... whatever the two of you do, please just stay together forever, and for no reason other than the fact that no sane person would wish either of you on anyone else.

 

Best Advice Ever!!!

 

I would venture to say you don't believe that people can change.

 

Ah... this same sad riposte, more often than not spoken by those who refuse to change.

Tell you what: change FIRST, then talk about how "people can change".

 

I was referring to the fact that my husband cheated repeatedly on his first wife, but did not cheat on me.

 

And you know this how? I doubt he is totally reformed just had lots of practice and hid it from you.

The problem is karma's a *****, you suit each other tbh. What goes around always comes around and the only ones I feel sorry for are the poor children from the first and second marriages, they do not have a choice, you and your H had many choices and chose to make the wrong ones, sometimes you have to live with the consequences.

Now, what gives you or him the right to demand fidelity when both of you have been up to your eyeballs in infidelity, just saying :frown2:

 

I did not have any guilt at the time about being with a married man (shows a hint of what kind of person I am).

PLEASE do whatever you can to make these marriage work. No else deserves you except him and vice versa. I mean that with all sincerity. Why don't you just have an open relationship? Then there is no dishonestly and some poor soul doesn't have to get cheated on by the likes of either of you.

 

I appreciate your input, but I really have no desire to be with anyone else. I want to make our marriage a strong one where we find happiness together. He has told me that he does not have a desire to be with anyone else either. I know that both of us have made some really bad mistakes. I'm trying to get advice on how to help him heal from this blow to his self esteem and ego.

 

I appreciate your input, but I really have no desire to be with anyone else. I want to make our marriage a strong one where we find happiness together. He has told me that he does not have a desire to be with anyone else either. I know that both of us have made some really bad mistakes. I'm trying to get advice on how to help him heal from this blow to his self esteem and ego.

Would you say that his ex-wife is worthy of the same consideration from him?

 

Yes I would. I have thought about making amends with her as well. She did not deserve that kind of treatment and neither did my husband.

 

you say you tried counseling.

Did you only try one counselor? If yes, perhaps you could try a differenbt one.

Do you belong to a church? Any avenue of counseling available through that venue to you?

 

My husband is not willing to attend any kind of counseling. I wish we belonged to a church. We have kept this situation very private because my husband does not want anyone to know what I've done to him. We don't have anyone to talk to about this which I why I ended up here. It's private an anonymous so no one will know us.

 

Are you BOTH now in a place where you can be dedicated to change? I believe it is possible if you've both grown-up & are willing to work on things. Wow you've got a lot to work on! You were clearly too young to be in such a committed relationship but don't hold all of the guilt. You BOTH got in this mess!

I think you BOTH need complete transparency. Has your H written out a timeline of all his indescretions? it sounds like all of the focus is now on you. That's NOT going to work. Your behavior is so linked to his. I think you need honesty, transparency (NO secrets, all passwords shared etc), RULES on avoiding affairs...you can goggle that but having an available 'model' single lady in his car alone is AGAINST the rules!! You both need to avoid alcohol, bar hopping, girls/boys night out etc. you're not kids anymore you're PARENTS!

I'm sure others can advise you of some good books & programmes to follow. MC would be a very good idea (find one that's right for both of you. All MCs are not the same).

Best wishes. I DO BELIEVE anythings possible in a relationship if you both want it. Maybe once you've both done the hard work & reached a good place for a couple of years you could celebrate with a proper wedding.

 

BrokenLady

Your response brings tears to my eyes. I agree with everything you said. I feel so much more grown up now and actually know what hard work marriage is!

I didn't mention his indiscretions because I was trying not to place any of the blame on him for my mistakes. The things I did were selfish acts that didn't take his feelings into consideration.

I want him to be on the same page as me as far as rules on avoiding future marital boundary crossing. He does not feel like I have the right to expect anything from him right now because he is still so angry with me. We can have a few good weeks, then any small disagreement just turns into a bashing session about what a lying cheating ***** I am. I've tried not to throw things in his face because I can forgive him for things and move forward.

I have hurt him more than anyone ever has in his life. He trusted me and thought I would never do anything like that to him.

 

BrokenLady

Your response brings tears to my eyes. I agree with everything you said. I feel so much more grown up now and actually know what hard work marriage is!

I didn't mention his indiscretions because I was trying not to place any of the blame on him for my mistakes. The things I did were selfish acts that didn't take his feelings into consideration.

I want him to be on the same page as me as far as rules on avoiding future marital boundary crossing. He does not feel like I have the right to expect anything from him right now because he is still so angry with me. We can have a few good weeks, then any small disagreement just turns into a bashing session about what a lying cheating ***** I am. I've tried not to throw things in his face because I can forgive him for things and move forward.

I have hurt him more than anyone ever has in his life. He trusted me and thought I would never do anything like that to him.

LOL. That's the pot calling the kettle a pot.

 

Holy crap....I got nuthin....well, except maybe you both deserve the other, and karma rules.....

 

I could not get past the point where you were able to flip a switch, and go from sexless to porn star...Can and do most women do this?

 

I wasn't sexless, just wasn't enthusiastic. He had plenty of sex, just not the kind he wanted.

When the thought crossed my mind that I could lose him, I made a conscious choice to put more effort into our sex life. I realized how much it could bring us closer together, and you know what, it did. Until this ......

 

My favorite part of your story is where your husband- a serial cheater with no remorse who has a secret email account and who is most likely cheating on you tells you to get a second job to pay for his dream car.

The guy has got a real set thats for sure. He really knows how to play your guilt strings.

He's so manipulative it's scary, he's approaching the level of a sociopath.

You're no angel either but at least you've got remorse and no desire to cheat at the moment.

 

I really want to make him whole again. I just didn't ask for much from him when I found out about the secret email account. I only asked him to make me feel like he loved and desired me. I'm easy to please.

He is very rigid, but certainly not sociopath. He wants to be able to get over things his way and tell me what he needs. I understand that. I guess he feels like me working hard to give him something he's always wanted will prove that I'm truly sorry.

I don't think he has a desire to cheat on me, but on days that he is really angry, sometimes I question that. I think if the opportunity came along, he would take it and expect me to look the other way.

He does not associate his transgressions with anything I've done. He says that the things I've done are way worse and they don't even compare to anything he's ever done to me. In his mind, he thought he was in a relationship with a sweet, nice, naïve girl that would never do anything to hurt him. His entire view of me has been crushed. He says that I knew what kind of person he was when I met him, and he's never cheated on me, so he doesn't even take his **** into consideration.

 

You married a cheater and you expected...? What, exactly? :scratchhead:

I think I should point out I have been in your shoes. They pinch, don't they?

 

"If they'll cheat with you, they'll cheat on you."

 

So the guy you married who had cheated throughout his entire first marriage tells you he has never physically cheated on you. And you believe him? You just take his word for it?

Did his first wife ever suspect he was cheating and ask him? And of course, he told her the truth, right? He's an honest, upstanding kind of guy (with a secret email account just checking out the CL ads out of curiosity). BTW, if you are just checking out CL ads, why do you need an email unless you are posting or responding to the ads, right? And if nothing ever came of his CL adventures, why delete the account? Why not prove to your wife nothing came of his communications by letting you through the emails especially since there was only 1 he responded to?

Finally, your husband met you as a young thing willing to knowingly be the mistress of a married man who was cheating on his pregnant wife, and he is shocked that you are somewhat morally challenged in your behaviors during that time period?

 

Yikes.. Ultimately, if you have done absolutely everything you can do to show him your remorse, to rebuild trust with him, be completely 100% honest with him, etc., then I think it's fair for you to stop and ask him if he is going to be able to get over this or not. Being angry, saying things like, "you have no right to question me" or being mean or disrespectful is somewhat understandable in the immediate aftermath of an affair discovery, but any of that happening two years later is absolutely far too long and unacceptable. You absolutely violated his trust and hurt him, if the marriage fails it will largely be your fault, but after everything calmed down a bit, his actions, words, choices, etc. are his responsibility alone and you don't have to put up with it forever.

So... I don't know. I would consider talking to him and asking him if there is anything else you could do to help him get over this and leave it behind? I'm guessing there isn't anything more you can do, so then the question would be, can he forgive you and get over this? If not, then I'd say you should consider filing for divorce from him, because if after two years he still doesn't want a good healthy marriage with you, and can't imagine having that again with you when asked, then what are you waiting for? At that point, I'd just chalk the marriage ending up to a life lesson being learned, and move on.

Plus, the prospect of the marriage actually possibly ending my jar him awake as well, and make him realize that he doesn't want to lose you and that you've actually been as supportive and understanding as possible the last two years. It happens!

 

What a story.

First you need to ask yourself do you love him ? In your posts you never said that and once you said you dont want to hurt your children. Let me tell you this,staying in marriage just because of the kids is even worse thing then divorcing.

Another point,both of you need to have some growing up. Your husband have 4 kids,two of them with you and he wants a Porsche with your money helping him out. Do you know why ? Because he wants to act like some kind of player or Alpha male and it is dangerous for your marriage because he is not 100% into this marriage. His ads to craiglist confirms that.

On the other side you are a wild lady who seems to me that she got no idea what she wants in her life. First you help him cheat on his wife,then you cheat on him over and over again and now you want to stay married with him.

If you are sure that you love him and he loves you then you need some help from therapist immediatly. If he keeps rejecting your offer then push him even harder.

You gave him your paswords,but he needs to do the same thing. Why keep something secret from your wife/husband if you love them ?

Also no more going for rides with this female coworker,she got her car or she can use a bus.

This all happend two years ago and you are in the same spot,like it was just yesterday.

You need to stop speaking with your previous boyfriends and one night stands. What are they doing on your facebook page ? Trust me on this one,they are not there to "like" your photos of your kids or your husband.


Stay strong lady

 

Thanks for your feedback. I appreciate people who try to at least offer something helpful instead of people just slamming both of us. We have made awful mistakes in ours lives, but show me someone who hasn't right?

I do love him. I absolutely would not stay in it for the kids. I realize a bad marriage can be more harmful than a divorce, so I am truly interested in making this right so that we can move to a better place in our marriage.

I certainly spent a lot of years being a selfish person that made a lot of bad choices. I have so many regrets about the way I have handled myself.

I would love nothing more than to be in marriage counseling together. I would never force him though. I've done that in the past and I feel like when you force someone to do something it just creates resentment.

I am no longer "friends" with any of my formers on Facebook. My boundaries were way too soft and I didn't consider how it would affect my husband for me to do that.

He never gives me any reason to think that he is hiding anything. He doesn't protect his phone and has no problem if a message comes through and I see it. I'm just not as skeptical as some people think I should be. I know it sounds crazy, but I trust him.

 

Sounds like he's got it made to be honest. Now he can keep you around AND cheat AND get away with it because you're too busy feeling guilty about your own affairs. I think he landed himself a cheater's dream life. Now he thinks he can manipulate a Porsche out of you and your guilt! Telling him the truth just gave him all the power in your relationship because he probably kept his cards under the table so you couldn't use it against him. He's a great manipulator.

 

Yeah... I have to really doubt that all he is guilty of since your marriage is setting up a couple of "Casual Encounters" posts or replies on Craigslist...

As you said, he cheated on his first one serially, for years. I know you say he didn't love her, and got married because of a pregnancy, but honestly only he can know that for sure, and it only makes sense that he would tell you that he never loved her. I'm not saying he's lying, but I am saying you just can't really know for sure. So if he cheated all those years and got away with it for the most part, and now we live in this technology age where finding affair partners, "casual encounters" partners, prostitutes, porn, etc. is 10x easier, I just really, REALLY have a hard time believing that he has been completely innocent aside from the secret e-mail account and craigslist sex partner hunting you already know about.

Ultimately, I would think that most people with a partner who cheated would eventually either want to reconcile and rebuild their marriage into a happy one, or after taking some time to consider and process the affair, decide to end the marriage and move on. Your husband seems content with leaving your marriage in a state of guilt, shame and emotional disconnection, with no effort or expressed desire to improve it with you. Why is that? I could imagine that he likes being in the position of power over you, having the leverage of your guilt to manipulate things the way he likes, get away with things you might not normally approve of, possibly including cheating himself.

That's why I suggested in my last post that at some point you just need to try to force a decision. The status quo is unacceptable. The marriage needs to either be moving in a positive direction towards recovery, or a decision should be made (at least initially) to end it and seek happiness elsewhere.

 

Thanks for your response. I appreciate the honest feedback from some people here. I realize that others like to pass judgment and throw stones.


I like to be a positive thinker and I do believe him. I will not give up on our relationship. I think we could move along much faster with a good marriage counselor. I'm really not into forcing anyone to do anything. I believe that if people want to do it, they will. Forcing them will just breed resentment.

I know I have made this bed for myself.

 

I'm not passing judgement. But I do believe you and your husband both have deep seatd issues that you both need to deal with separately.

You married a serial cheater. You yourself acted shamefully. So, that being said, the two of you have a choice... either both of you consider the playing field level and you move forward on a clean slate, or you part ways. Sounds to me like your husband is the king of hypocrites. I don't feel at all sorry for him. At the same time I don't feel sorry for what you are going through either.

I think you should divorce and stay single...for a long long time. You have some work to do on yourself. You have sh!t for boundaries, and you need to set some standards for yourself and stick to them. You cannot change your husband. He will either fix himself or flounder in the white trash-bin for the rest of his life. If he cannot pull himself out of the gutter, then you need to move on and become the best person you can be.

 

Some of these comments are real smug.

It's like someone saying you should have had an abortion, while you are holding the baby.

Well, the baby is here, now what?

Their relationship didn't start off ideal, but they are married, now what?

 

Now she figures out what she wants in a marriage. Then, she needs to understand the boundaries needed to ensure her marriage becomes successful and set them in place. She then, takes her needs to her husband and talk to him about what it will take for her to become happy in this marriage. Listen to what he needs and work from there.

If he is unwilling to listen or change, then she either stay and put up with how they are living now. Or, she leaves.

 

Just want to get my head around this, so a summary of your story as I see it :

* You dated a married man for some time as a 'friend with benefits'
* You started dating him properly when his marriage broke down
* Your sex life has been good, with the stated blip
* You admitted, over time, of a number of times you cheated on him whilst you were dating, largely sexually driven encounters rather than affairs.
* As far as you know (or admit) you have both been faithful to each other since being married
* Due to your admissions, they often come out in arguments which is making you depressed

Counselling for you would be good, due to the whole history and how you feel when the arguments happen.

Sounds like you are both from similar stock, and bar the arguments recently, sound quite well suited. You admitted to some stuff pre-marriage which isn't good and would wind any spouse up but you either have to agree with him to end things now OR to draw a line under everything and move forward positively.

I'm not as anti-cheater as most on this site (even though it happened to me), as sometimes you do bond with someone who is married to the wrong person. Lets put the 'serial cheater' thing to one side and assume thats what it was. So, if this guy was/is your soul-mate then you should be able to move on from the admissions. Even the trickle-truth nature of you revealing them....it's human nature for that to happen which is why it's part of the cheaters script.

I've skipped past much of the detail in your post as there is a bunch of stuff there - but I would not entertain the idea of a post-nuptial (a concept, which I hate) or getting a second job to provide him a car. Take those things off the table completely.

If he is 'the one' he will allow you to clear the air and move on. If not, then he isn't and you should.

 

I just feel like she's been married for 17 years and there are some posters who are only focusing on the affair 20 years ago.

 

First of all, I don't think you can expect to cheat on someone multiple times and they just forgive you because it happened so many years ago. This is all new info to him. An affair is debilitating to a marriage and takes years to repair, I don't really believe an affair ever fully goes away. The trust is permanently damaged, and your husband may never be able to fully forgive you.

Second, you seem to give a lot of excuses for your behavior in your post, stating you were drunk, or your relationship with him wasn't perfect. This is frankly unacceptable. If you are dropping excuses to him like this, then it is no wonder he can't move on. Will you cheat again in the future when things get tough? If you get drunk again are you going to have sex with someone else? Even if you assure him you wont, he may not believe you because the fact you did it multiple times and held the secret in for so long shows you are capable of otherwise.

Third, you both need counseling. If he won't go to counseling then at the very least you need to go alone to work on you. You may gain skills on how to approach this situation, and eventually your husband may see the good in it and join you, which brings me to the next point.

Your husband doesn't want to go to a counselor because he feels the counselor wants to rug sweep, but isn't that basically what is happening now? I mean, that is why your husband is so resentful. He feels you had an affair with no consequences, AKA rug sweeping. So what does it hurt to see a counselor to help you both cope and work this out? It makes me wonder if he is hiding something in his past or present from you that he feels a counselor may uncover. What makes you think you are different than his ex wife, and that he will never cheat on you? The fact that he supposedly got married to his ex wife, who he supposedly didn't love, and therefore motivated him to cheat on her (and justified it, at least to him)? Who told you this, him? There are 2 sides to every story and I would bet his ex wife has a much different version than he does.

 

Third, you both need counseling. If he won't go to counseling then at the very least you need to go alone to work on you. You may gain skills on how to approach this situation, and eventually your husband may see the good in it and join you, which brings me to the next point.

Your husband doesn't want to go to a counselor because he feels the counselor wants to rug sweep, but isn't that basically what is happening now?

He could also be avoiding the counselor because he knows he will have an authoritative third person telling him he is not doing as well as he should - at the moment he can blame everyone else.