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The open marriage dilemma:

My question will come after presenting the background and current situation of our troubled marriage. Troubled that is from my vantage point. After being married for over twelve years I found out my wife was having sexual relations outside our marriage. I was shocked and couldn’t believe this at first because we got along so well, had frequent sex 2-3 times a week, two great kids and both had good careers with a household income around 150K a year. I was more shocked after finding out how many men she had sex with. I found out after hearing a message left on her cell phone from one of her coworkers which was the entry point into her world of infidelity.
Going back about five years after having our second child she got a new job at a large marketing firm near the city. At the age of 32 she was one of the older women who worked there and soon started friendly relationships w/ several of the other women there. Both single and married women alike from the firm routinely went out after work on Fridays for happy hour(s). I didn’t think much of it then & figured let her have some fun and free time but changes started happening around then. I didn’t think much of it because I liked the changes. Changes mostly in her wardrobe and attitude towards sex. She started wearing more skirts and dresses along w/ heeled shoes that gradually got taller. Her panty collection over a year or so went from mostly full normal coverage tanga cuts to thongs then to nearly all G-strings. The bras went from the regular style to the sheer and pushup styles. Again most changes any husband would like to see in his wife. She would wear more stockings of various types w/ sexier low cut blouses along w/ more jewelry yet still keeping a vogue professional appearance. Not overly sexy or ****ty in any way what so ever. Fridays was the exception to the rule. Over time I noticed the dressing was more geared towards slightly provocative on those days. The Skirts were always the shortest on Fridays. She often went without panties on Fridays if it wasn’t her period week and the shoes were more heeled on Fridays. Again I’m fine & thrilled w/ this because she would come home after the happy hour thing & jump on me like crazy.
The arrival time from her happy hour was usually around midnight, sometimes later & sometimes a little earlier. Yet she would come home and want sex w/ me nearly every time. I could tell she was drinking but I wouldn’t say she was drunk just a little buzzed. Probably no more than normal for anyone who was out at such a place for few hours with friends. She would go at me like a mad woman sometimes doing things most men could only fantasize about their wives doing. So why would I have suspected her of cheating? She dressed sexy, loved sex more than ever. Started doing things like giving me oral sex nearly every day & dressing very sexy when we went out together. So what man wouldn’t be estatic yet suspect she was doing things on the side?
The details of that phone call aren’t important so I‘ll skip them. I confronted her about the call and she was silent then came out and started crying telling me she loved me more than anything and it was just sex w/ other men that didn’t have any emotional involvement. It pretty much started w/ her friends from work hooking up w/ guys and her one night going to an apartment w/ them and after a few drinks getting seduced by someone there. Her friends all being very attractive like my wife didn’t have any problem drawing in men and it soon became a regular weekly thing. Sometimes twice a week as Wednesdays was also sometimes a toast night. She realized the guys weren’t looking for any relationships so it was just casual sex or as she put it great casual sex. She described it as a whole new life opening up for her and she still could come home to her grounded family safety net every day. I asked her how many men she slept with and the answer knocked me out. Over a hundred from the time it started up till that point. It was explained that sometimes she would hookup w/ a guy she slept w/ before, sometimes several times before. Other times it was someone new. Other times it was just oral sex somewhere. Her friends were doing the same thing & some of them were married to.
So now I’m saying it has to stop. She says ok but a few weeks later brings it up again wanting to discuss it. She tells me again she loves me more than the world but wants her second life to continue. I didn’t want to lose her and for the kids sake didn’t want a divorce. So I’m hesitantly saying ok (I’m skipping some details but try to follow with me). I got the feeling she would say divorce if I really insisted on her relenting to this swinging of sorts. Call me a wimp but I didn’t want to take a chance of losing her. She starts up again w/ my blessing if you can call it that and everything seemed to be back to normal. She’s out now most Fridays and occasionally Saturdays. I Know she screwing a lot of guys but our deal was I didn’t want to know any of the details. She assured me she was practicing safe sex (most of the time), being extremely careful and still always seemed to have enough energy to take care of me afterwards. I must admit the feeling of knowing my wife was f___ing someone else sometimes just an hour before we were making love was the strangest sensation a mind could imagine. Yet her passion never ever decreased and unquestionably grew greater along with our love sense opening up w/ each other. And she never seemed happier. The kids were still too young to catch any of what was going on and I’m at that point hoping she would either grow out of it or just get tired of it by the time they’re a few years older. As of that point there in bed by 6:30 every night.
So by now she’ been living the life style for about 5 plus years with me knowing and approving for about the past 2 years or so. Now it gets strange. I still remember the night we we’re home watching a movie. The kids are both asleep and it’s probably around 10. The phone rings, she answers it next to the bed. All I hear is a lot of yes, yes, yes, but, but, I will, yes sir then finally an ok. She tells me to please don’t be mad but she has to meet someone. She dressed in a flash leaving in a skirt, heels and a blouse. I figured in a couple hours she’ll be home again. Wrong. Morning light comes and I’m waking up alone. I get the kids up and dressed, fed and ready for the bus to pick them up. I’m worried now as it’s after 7am when she finally pulls in to the rear of the drive way which was unusual. Normally she always parked in front of the house. She comes in the back door looking like hell holding what was left of her shredded blouse against her chest. She gives me a kiss saying “don’t ask”, then runs upstairs to prepare for work. That was a Wednesday night. Thursday night we went out for dinner then once home in bed there was no love making. She was telling me her insides were to sore from the night before. This was a first for her. I ask what happened and she’s very evasive just saying she liked it and don’t worry.
So another week then same thing on Wednesday night. She leaves returning again at 7am only this week looking far worse than the previous week. This time I see marks on her arms around the wrists, elbows and ankles. I try to ask if everything was ok and what’s going on? She says “Don’t ask and everything is fine. I’m just trying something a little different. Trust me.” So what can I do I’m thinking. I’m living w/ it and just hoping it ends soon. Into the fourth year now and she’s gotten nipple rings. Very expensive rings w/ diamonds hanging off the bottoms of the rings. I find out (from her) the guys name is Klause and she now has a belly ring and two rings on her labs. Things seem to stabilize at that point for awhile w/ her telling me one morning she’s not seeing as many guys just a few. I gently pressed her for some details sense she started the conversation and almost seemed to want to produce some kind of confession. What little I got out made it clear this Klause has a lot of control over her and was routinely engaging her in extremely kinky situations. I suggested she tell me of her times which was going back on our original agreement of keeping it to herself. She just said he has me F___ other people besides himself and leaves it at that. Pressing her gently for more and I find out she gets brought places and is basically a F__k slave at the hands of this Klause and to make it worse she likes it! I came out and said “he’s prostituting you and I want it to stop. I don’t care if you like it or not”. Now she clams up and I can’t get anything out of her other than her saying “I knew we shouldn’t have talked about this”.
I know if I bring up her seeing a therapist it will get shot down and just make things worse. I still don’t want a divorce for the previously stated reasons. What can I do? I love my wife but seeing her routinely come home with marks all over her and knowing she’s getting sexually used & abused is really eating away at me. I’m open for suggestions……. Please.

charles
 

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Hey Charles,

Sorry to hear this dude...

First your wife has a sex addiction. She needs counseling.

She has also entered the world of SBDM or S&M for short.

She has a master and she is the slave.

Klause is her master and she has to do whatever he dictates. There are many forms and fashions of this.

Some are quite abusive and painful, some involve some really gross stuff like poop, pee and vomit. They also have machines that do certain things to females

I imagine she has signed some sort of "contract" and has a rule book to follow.

I knew of one girl that was into this life style, she to was married to someone else but was anothers "slave" and she did whatever the "master" asked her to do, some trival stuff, some weird sick stuff, I was utterly shocked at what this woman was willing to do for her master.


Anyway, your wife needs help, tell her if she does not get help, you will divorce her and take the kids.

She has an addiction and has lost control. It is starting to ruin your home life.

Do some internet searching on this stuff, there is a whole underground world of this lifestyle.
 

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andylee-

GA is absolutely correct. You also run the risk of catching an STI. The only thing I can suggest is telling her that if she will stop seeing the klaus, you will be happy to spank her etc - assuming you would enjoy playing that role.

But, she could end up dead, these people don't know when to stop. Her career will go downhill, and she will regret it. She may have well singed a contract, but she signed a marriage contract with you prior to that. The rules of open relationships are: there must be no emotional involvement. She is being stupid.

If you are broad minded, you could even say that you were OK with what she was dong with her workmates, but this new development has crossed the line. If it were me, I would insist on divorce if she does not cool it with him.

The other thing you did wrong was to tell her you did not want to know details. If you are skilful, you can get her back on side bit by bit. But you have to realise that she has lost her mind. You are going to have to pull out all the stops. As a last resort, if she won't listen - the threat of losing custody of her kids might be the final sanction, but let's hope you don't get that far.

This is why my wife and I aren't swinging - we don't need the chaos. But as a fantasy it's great :)
 

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Why are you with this person in a marriage? This is sick.

Your wife is very disturbed and you are confused and not assertive enough about your needs.

You need to find a doctor for her and a counselor for yourself. End this sick marriage. Protect your children from your excesses.
 

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This not an open marriage or anything resembling a marriage. She is engaged in a dangerous life style which you are opposed to. She is taking huge risks in getting an STD and I would guess it is just a matter of time before she gets one and passes it on to you. I agree your wife needs help but feel you need a divorce.
 

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Your wife can do anything she wants and you get nothing like a open relationship for you? Don't you see how one sided this is.

Think about the STDs, or if clause comes to the house and endangers you or your children. Or if she is all beat up and blames you, you lose everything on a lie, and you do jail time to boot.

get a private eye and a lawyer. Protect yourself.

She is obviously more willing to do what klause wants than what the marriage or family wants or needs.

draconis
 

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Here is a pretty good read if you want to know what is going on in her head.

SM slave contracts
sound like this klaus guy is pretty, um, thorough in his work. i'll bet there is some videotape of your wife somewhere, based upon the info in the link above. ask her if she knows she's been recorded. that might scare the crap out of her. maybe shock her into quitting? who knows
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I kind of figured she is into the B&D scene. I'm not that foolish. He calls, she runs out the door. Seeing the marks in those obvious places didn't leave any open mysteries. I'm not posting to titalate but having had to retrieve her in several precarious situations also left that very apparent. Do I need a shrink too? Perhaps when all is done and said. Long and short of it is - When she's not out on a date or with her Klause she is perfectly normal, a great mom and still thriving in her career. Actually got a promotion last month to Asst. Dept head. She packs their lunches most every day and helps w/ the home work the two little ones get. If it wasn't for her dissapearances at night you would never know.
I did ask a couple weeks ago about pictures and videos being made of her during her engagements as a poster mentioned. I kind of asked in a spiteful way adding that her appearance arriving back home on occation looked like the aftermath of an adult video shoot. She looked back and said yes. I didn't take it any further.
Previous points were she's a sex addict. Thats probably correct. Now whats the cure? She won't see a psyco-therapist. I did edge towards that suggestion once a ways back. I don't want to toss her out because I still love her dearly. She's never once let me down and shows her love every day. We've all sceen what happens to kids when mom & Dad divorce.
Anything like a therapist thats not a therapist out there?
 

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andylee-

I don't think you realize the severity of the situation. If she has a good job, the pics could be used for black mail. But far more interesting is that if she goes round with visible bruises, people are going to assume that YOU inflicted them on her.

I think you have become understandably addicted to her sexuality, and fear putting your foot down for fear of being put on short rations. If you don't act soon, she will "damaged goods" (as we say in the UK), my friend, and no one will want her, including you.

You need to start reeling her back in. Be inventive, pull out all the stops. If you can't protect her from herself, you are not being a good husband.
 

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Put your foot down hard or walk away. Not only could these pictures surface at her work place but what if they get to your kids???? No spouse should put the one she “loves” through this.
 

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she doesn't want help...

you don't want to get her help...

Seems you are afraid of her...

She is a addict. Plain and simple.

If you have zero problems with her behavior, then there is no problem.

But If you do have issues with it, well then it needs to be corrected.

Maybe setting some boundries with her will help.

Maybe you two need your own contract in terms of what she is allowed to do and not do.
 

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Im so sorry for you.

I know the last thing you need right now is pity but thats all I can give you.

Whats gone on in your past that you think that her sleeping with other guys (hundreds) will keep you together.

Ive got my own problems but I honeslty dont think. No sorry I know I wouldnt stick around for that.

Take the kids, call a lawyer and get the hell outa there. If she wants the marriage much less her kids she will stop.

By the way wheres your balls man. Meet dude and knock him the hell out. I know some will say violience only begets violience but dude needs to be taught a lesson.

Wow. Again Im so sorry for you and those kids.

By the way kids are more perseptive than adults give them credit for. Just remember the sins of the father. Well in your case the sins of the mother.
 

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This thread baffles me!

How in the world can you deal with this? I don't know what I would do in this position, but I do know that you are giving her WAY to much credit here. She is NOT, I repeat NOT, responsible for your happiness. Only you can dictate your happiness. She should not have this massive amount of power to have her cake and eat it too. I worry that you think so very little of yourself that you feel you need to put up with this. You fear standing up for yourself because you are afraid you will lose her. How about standing up for your marriage and your family? Your children? She needs help, but so do you. You are codependent on her and will allow her to do whatever she wants as long as she doesn't leave you! That's terrible. Eventually you will grow to resent and even hate her for what you are going through if this path continues.

I would suggest talking to your pastor, a counselor, perhaps her parents, anyone that can help end this self destructive behavior.

From what I see this isn't an open relationship or even a marriage. It's her getting everything she wants and then some and you enabling it.
 

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I thought aboutt his post yesterday. Often people that are like this were sexually abused as children, now I am not saying she was. But how is her relationship with her family? It could have been a family memeber, a neighbor, or cousin, uncle, etc. Someone she knew as a child.

There is a deep pain here that she has gone this far, she is basically throwing herself to the wolves and has zero self respect. She "needs to be dumped on"

There are very serious deep rooted issues here like Child molestation or sexual abuse as a child.

She really needs therapy, this is probably why she will not go to it.

I'm no professional, but defiantely a sign of a horrible past.

no one does this for fun
 

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Discussion Starter #16
GaSoccer:

No, as far as I know there has never been any abuse in her past at all. It’s quite a mystery to all who know of the situation. Someone related it to a person getting addicted to drugs. Once hooked your always looking for that little extra high and going a bit further each time. She has always enjoyed being the center of attention. Other than that I'm baffled. I suppose anyone can find a vice that others are unable to relate to.
I've talked to her several times over the past week but it's extremely difficult gaining information of these outings. She has been out three times this month so far. I've also stressed the impact it’s having on me and the potential problems it can cause for the families future. Information gained: Klause has a wife who is involved in these meetings or setups. Being brought to various houses where B&D and S&M activities are the norm. She still claims she very much enjoys the nights out as they push her limits of what she called rapture. She now has small tattoos around her ankels of chains and a small tattoo on her right upper back of the words "Property of Klause" surrounded by barb wire. It's not that big and can probably be either removed or covered over later - I'm hoping.
Only saving grace is she said something to the effect of "don't worry, it won't last forever". W/O saying anything further I sensed something in that saying "hope exists I won't go to much further". So how can I push this excursion of life a little faster to see that light at the end of the tunnel ASAP. I'm not leaving her or giving up. That’s for sure. She's too beautiful, both inside and out. Everyone goes thru some kind of turmoil in their marriage and life. This must be ours.
 

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Dude, she has been cheating on you for years it isn't like she is ever going to change she has everything she wants and you have to deal with her actions. Funny that when clause throws her away you'll be left to get the left overs. She is using you. How is your self esteem?

draconis
 

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I'm with mommy and Drac...

you must be a whipping boy, because she sure likes to stomp on you. Maybe you can join her and get your butt whipped by Klause and the same tattoo (being sarcastic here people)

Seriously man, what is wrong with you???
 

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Well, I’ve seen some twisted stories here and at other forums but this one takes the Oscar, (If it is indeed true). If so I don’t know who I pity more, you or your wife. One thing is for sure, I feel great sadness for your children who are being “brought up” in this kind of an environment. I think I will exit form this train wreck. Thanks.
 

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How can you be with your wife who is permanently marked "property of Klause"???? How does it feel to stroke her skin and run your fingers across SOMEONE ELSES MARK?

I'd have been freaked out long ago.

DIVORCE HER! This isn't healthy for her, you or the family.
 
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