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Your counselor is correct that flaunting it is atypical behavior. Most are much more careful but narcissists think they can get away with anything. Maybe your husband fits in that category. Mine did. He was another who flaunted it — they were just good friends, according to him — and only ever admitted to what I could prove and even then tried to spin it. Cheaters lie.
 

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Every time he was caught it was because they flaunted it in public. My counselor indicated that is very atypical behavior. I am reading these stories and thinking... wow I guess I’m just kind of the same old story then. That’s disgusting and liberating all at once.
I think you have a huge advantage over most because you have no questions about what a jerk he’s been, and you have no doubt it’s in his DNA to cheat so he’ll keep it up with future relationships. You will, in short, have no reason to second-guess your decision to leave.
 

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Discussion Starter #23 (Edited by Moderator)
Your counselor is correct that flaunting it is atypical behavior. Most are much more careful but narcissists think they can get away with anything. Maybe your husband fits in that category. Mine did. He was another who flaunted it — they were just good friends, according to him — and only ever admitted to what I could prove and even then tried to spin it. Cheaters lie.
I’m unsure as to what category to put him in. I can’t say he fits any... he throws a lot of curve balls but is giving me everything I ask for. He’s told me he would like to tell me why he’s done these things and clear the air so that I know it wasn’t about me. But I said no thank you and he’s been respectfully distant since then. He’s been moving the money to my account as agreed, he’s paying all the bills and paid my car off, hasnt so much as tried to move one dime from our joint account. He is being decent and upstanding in this part of things. Yes already consulted the lawyer and separation agreement is being drawn up and he hasn’t fought anything at all. I’m also not asking for anything but what I feel is fair, half of the stuff we accrued in marriage and a reasonable sum of child support which is more than the courts would even award me in the calculations. I have nothing to complain about now but my severely broken as5 heart and my life in tatters. (And I cant move out for 4 months) It hurts like a mother****er. Maybe because he has this ability for kindness it makes it hurt more. Sometimes it felt easier those two days he was a total jerk after being caught.
 

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Discussion Starter #26
This morning he said out of the blue, “I just want you to know I will always love you and I know it’s not an excuse, but I just felt unwanted and it made me do stupid things.”
I think my brain had a mini stroke from trying so hard not to scream “I DID NOT CAUSE YOU TO CHEAT YOU B**tard! And people don’t do this to people they love! And you were a TERRIBLE husband!!!” So on and on...Instead I kept a straight face and said. “Mhm”. And then just let the awkward moment sit there like a rotting corpse. He finally sighed and said, “Just wanted you to know.” And went to work. I wanted to scream and set the record straight, to stand up for my unstained integrity...But then I just thought... why? There is nothing to fix here, it doesn’t matter why he thinks he cheated does it? He will never understand the depths of the pain he caused me. Ever. And then I went and cried in the toilet room for a few minutes. There isn’t a point in even engaging in these useless conversations is there? I mean... arguments are meant to fix a wrong. To balance a tipped scale. We share our emotions and pain with people that can be trusted not the people that caused it... right?
 

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This morning he said out of the blue, “I just want you to know I will always love you and I know it’s not an excuse, but I just felt unwanted and it made me do stupid things.”
I think my brain had a mini stroke from trying so hard not to scream “I DID NOT CAUSE YOU TO CHEAT YOU B**tard! And people don’t do this to people they love! And you were a TERRIBLE husband!!!” So on and on...Instead I kept a straight face and said. “Mhm”. And then just let the awkward moment sit there like a rotting corpse. He finally sighed and said, “Just wanted you to know.” And went to work. I wanted to scream and set the record straight, to stand up for my unstained integrity...But then I just thought... why? There is nothing to fix here, it doesn’t matter why he thinks he cheated does it? He will never understand the depths of the pain he caused me. Ever. And then I went and cried in the toilet room for a few minutes. There isn’t a point in even engaging in these useless conversations is there? I mean... arguments are meant to fix a wrong. To balance a tipped scale. We share our emotions and pain with people that can be trusted not the people that caused it... right?
Thst just makes me sick and shows he isnt taking responsibilty for what he has done and is doing what cheaters do, blaming you. My husband's ex did the same thing. Yet before you said he said 'He’s told me he would like to tell me why he’s done these things and clear the air so that I know it wasn’t about me'. So one minute it wasnt about you and the next its your fault. Sheesh.
I suspect he is going to try and win you round over the coming weeks. You may need to just say that you dont want to hear any more about it as the marriage is over.
 

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That‘s the No. 1 excuse in cheater-speak. They very rarely say they cheated because they’re a piece of trash. Instead, it’s because their spouse “made me feel (fill in the blank)“. And their first thought isn‘t to discuss that with their spouse. No, it’s to find some other piece of trash to have an affair with. Of course, he says he loves you. He may even be telling the truth. Most men who have affairs aren’t really interested in getting a divorce — it’s all about the excitement of that shiny new toy with no thought whatsoever to the devastation they’re causing. I like your response. I went bsc when I got that speech and scared myself as well as him. Calm is better.
 

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This morning he said out of the blue, “I just want you to know I will always love you and I know it’s not an excuse, but I just felt unwanted and it made me do stupid things.”
I think my brain had a mini stroke from trying so hard not to scream “I DID NOT CAUSE YOU TO CHEAT YOU B**tard! And people don’t do this to people they love! And you were a TERRIBLE husband!!!” So on and on...Instead I kept a straight face and said. “Mhm”. And then just let the awkward moment sit there like a rotting corpse. He finally sighed and said, “Just wanted you to know.” And went to work. I wanted to scream and set the record straight, to stand up for my unstained integrity...But then I just thought... why? There is nothing to fix here, it doesn’t matter why he thinks he cheated does it? He will never understand the depths of the pain he caused me. Ever. And then I went and cried in the toilet room for a few minutes. There isn’t a point in even engaging in these useless conversations is there? I mean... arguments are meant to fix a wrong. To balance a tipped scale. We share our emotions and pain with people that can be trusted not the people that caused it... right?
You did very well not to blow up in his face. In a way, that's what he would have liked, a show of emotion from you because that would have given him hope that you still love him. A cold and detached demeanor will deliver your message far, far better. His lines are total BS, a fishing for excuses so you won't divorce him.

Learn about the 180 and do it.
 

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Here is my problem. The sheer, soul shattering trauma of seeing him hug her, hold her, in that parking lot. Seeing him smile while he knowingly betrayed me for God and all to see. Seeing her smile while she acted like she had any right to be in his arms. (She is also married with children btw, classy af). On one hand it was the killing blow of the marriage which is what I needed.
This reminds me of something that happened to a guy I know. He is not an actual personal friend but a guy I know through the community along with his ex wife. We are friends on facebook but that is about it.

Anyway, they must have been having marital issues to the point that he hid cameras in the house and caught her on camera with her hand in the cookie jar. He actually posted the pictures of their tryst on Facebook with their faces and naughty bits blurred out. He posted the pictures along with the statement along the lines of "Let's see you deny your affair and say everything is my fault now!"
Of course the pictures were only up for a few minutes before Facebook removed them but I happened to see them during those few minutes.

The part that is haunting to me is even though the faces were blurred out, you could still see that she had the biggest smile and was very happy in the moment. That would have been soul-crushing for me if I had seen pictures of my wife smiling like that whilst in the middle of a tryst. She hasn't smiled or laughed like that with me in years and if I were to see that, there would be no coming back.

So what does this have to do with your question on how to cope?? You said it yourself up above that I quoted - it was proof of the death of your marriage. It is a death. It is the death of the future of the partnership. You are both still living as individual beings, but your partnership and marriage have died.

You cope and deal with it as you do the death of someone close to you. Initially shock and horror. Denial. Depression. Anger, Negotiating etc etc all the regular stages of grief.

And then in time acceptance and moving on with your life without them.

Life does go on and in time it becomes a good life. But not with that person any longer. Eventually the hole left by their absence fills in.
 

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This morning he said out of the blue, “I just want you to know I will always love you and I know it’s not an excuse, but I just felt unwanted and it made me do stupid things.”
I think my brain had a mini stroke from trying so hard not to scream “I DID NOT CAUSE YOU TO CHEAT YOU B**tard! And people don’t do this to people they love! And you were a TERRIBLE husband!!!” So on and on...Instead I kept a straight face and said. “Mhm”. And then just let the awkward moment sit there like a rotting corpse. He finally sighed and said, “Just wanted you to know.” And went to work. I wanted to scream and set the record straight, to stand up for my unstained integrity...But then I just thought... why? There is nothing to fix here, it doesn’t matter why he thinks he cheated does it? He will never understand the depths of the pain he caused me. Ever. And then I went and cried in the toilet room for a few minutes. There isn’t a point in even engaging in these useless conversations is there? I mean... arguments are meant to fix a wrong. To balance a tipped scale. We share our emotions and pain with people that can be trusted not the people that caused it... right?
A good response is - "Yep this is how your love works. You love me but if I am not everything that you feel you need you will do the most hurtful thing possible, without a thought." Dudes love is worthless. It's crap, It's worse the worthless because it does the opposite of what love does, it actually cause pain not joy.

It's like a Bank that steals from you.

That is the lesson for today that both WS and BS need to understand.

- Being loved by a cheater does the opposite of what love is supposed to do, it causes pain not joy.

Which is why it's silly to pine after them like something of value has been lost. You're better off without them.

It's like Bezaro-love.
 

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Discussion Starter #34
Thst just makes me sick and shows he isnt taking responsibilty for what he has done and is doing what cheaters do, blaming you. My husband's ex did the same thing. Yet before you said he said 'He’s told me he would like to tell me why he’s done these things and clear the air so that I know it wasn’t about me'. So one minute it wasnt about you and the next its your fault. Sheesh.
I suspect he is going to try and win you round over the coming weeks. You may need to just say that you dont want to hear any more about it as the marriage is over.
Right! He thinks in that sick little brain that he is actually saying all the right things. I’m so grossed out.
 

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Discussion Starter #35
That‘s the No. 1 excuse in cheater-speak. They very rarely say they cheated because they’re a piece of trash. Instead, it’s because their spouse “made me feel (fill in the blank)“. And their first thought isn‘t to discuss that with their spouse. No, it’s to find some other piece of trash to have an affair with. Of course, he says he loves you. He may even be telling the truth. Most men who have affairs aren’t really interested in getting a divorce — it’s all about the excitement of that shiny new toy with no thought whatsoever to the devastation they’re causing. I like your response. I went bsc when I got that speech and scared myself as well as him. Calm is better.
Did he ever change history on you? I swear he’s convinced himself and twisted conversations from 10 years ago to fit his “I’m unloved” mentality. Said we have had conversations for 10 years about this, and no... we didn’t. We had conversations every so often like,”I need to feel affection when I come home”, I hug and smile at him when he comes home every day, then it’s “I’m not getting enough kissing” I give him more kissing, “I don’t think you actually WANT to be intimate with me you just are doing it like it’s a job.” Seriously?!?!? None of this matters. I just find it interesting that history suddenly became completely different... I have ignored his desperate pleas for affection for a decade and he tried so so hard to fix it! And it’s complete and utter fallacy. I’m on an angry and resentful rant today. I apologize. Lol
 

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Did he ever change history on you? I swear he’s convinced himself and twisted conversations from 10 years ago to fit his “I’m unloved” mentality. Said we have had conversations for 10 years about this, and no... we didn’t. We had conversations every so often like,”I need to feel affection when I come home”, I hug and smile at him when he comes home every day, then it’s “I’m not getting enough kissing” I give him more kissing, “I don’t think you actually WANT to be intimate with me you just are doing it like it’s a job.” Seriously?!?!? None of this matters. I just find it interesting that history suddenly became completely different... I have ignored his desperate pleas for affection for a decade and he tried so so hard to fix it! And it’s complete and utter fallacy. I’m on an angry and resentful rant today. I apologize. Lol
Yep. Rewriting history is what they do. It helps them justify what they did so you can 100% be the bad guy. They’re just the unloved and unappreciated little victim whose zipper suddenly fell open around some woman whose panties suddenly dropped and they both somehow tripped and fell to the ground and, well… Doesn’t that happen to everyone all the time? Not their fault at all.
 

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I know you are in the most incredible pain. It leaps off the page as I read your posts. And I am so sorry.

But you know what? I don't even know you but I am so confident that you are going to come through this like a warrior. You have a good head on your shoulders and you aren't going to tolerate this crap.

You will be ok. More than ok. Life is fabulous on the other side.

If you feel your steely resolve weakening (and you will-it's totally normal), Google Chump Lady. She has a blog that is so helpful for those of us that have experienced infidelity. She parses things out in a straight-shooter yet humorous way.
 

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He is rewriting history - it's common. Most cheaters backfill to justify their actions because it doesn't compute in their brain that they can be this evil to someone.

These interactions are EXACTLY why you really shouldn't be living together. But I understand you can't do that.

So this is what you do.

Go up to him and say something like this,

"Husband, while we are forced to co-habitate, you are not to talk to me unless it is absolutely necessary to deal with one of our children, or financial business that requires my input. Do not speak to me about your affair, or try to apologize, or placate me, or try to explain yourself. Do not make small talk with me, talk about friends etc. You are no longer my partner and this is just a business relationship until I can settle into my new home. End of story."

Then walk away.
 

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Discussion Starter #39
I know you are in the most incredible pain. It leaps off the page as I read your posts. And I am so sorry.

But you know what? I don't even know you but I am so confident that you are going to come through this like a warrior. You have a good head on your shoulders and you aren't going to tolerate this crap.

You will be ok. More than ok. Life is fabulous on the other side.

If you feel your steely resolve weakening (and you will-it's totally normal), Google Chump Lady. She has a blog that is so helpful for those of us that have experienced infidelity. She parses things out in a straight-shooter yet humorous way.
Thank you! I have purchased her book and plan to take a look at that when it arrives. In the mean time I’ll be perusing her website.
it’s very hard to face this level of pain day in and day out. But I realize there is no way to do anything but live through it. Sometimes I feel like I’ve been punched in the stomach, and I can’t even breathe. And sometime I’m so righteously angry I want to kill with much bloodshed, and every once in awhile I feel hopeful. I keep living and hoping for my kids and for myself. I want us to be blissfully happy one day and I know I can get there.

He asked if we could “talk” tonight. The dreaded discussion is coming. The thought of it makes me sick right now, not going to lie.
 

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Discussion Starter #40
He is rewriting history - it's common. Most cheaters backfill to justify their actions because it doesn't compute in their brain that they can be this evil to someone.

These interactions are EXACTLY why you really shouldn't be living together. But I understand you can't do that.

So this is what you do.

Go up to him and say something like this,

"Husband, while we are forced to co-habitate, you are not to talk to me unless it is absolutely necessary to deal with one of our children, or financial business that requires my input. Do not speak to me about your affair, or try to apologize, or placate me, or try to explain yourself. Do not make small talk with me, talk about friends etc. You are no longer my partner and this is just a business relationship until I can settle into my new home. End of story."

Then walk away.
Funny, I’ll have the opportunity to do that tonight. I’ll let you know how that goes.
 
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