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He’s not having sec once a month. His wife is attempting to step up, if he feels that an acrobatic initiating partner is the primary source of contentment than he should make a choice and leave. How long has this been dragging on?
FWIW, @Lawrence N wrote that he improved his attitude and that he and his wife were making progress and he was happy about that. He is optimistic and wrote he did NOT want to divorce his wife, was happy at progress. Maybe he will chime back in on his thread and clarify if I read him wrong. I suspect he is too busy enjoying his marriage to respond.

It was the people on TAM who are telling him he shouldn't be happy at the progress, that his wife was only stepping up because she was scared. That she is essentially lying to him. That he should just accept that a true turnaround has a miniscule chance, that they almost never happened and he either needed to accept his plight or divorce and go date, find some hookers, or whatever.

So the default TAM answer to any issue, especially sexual problems, is to just file for divorce. Because nothing else will make any real difference because most women don't like sex much with their husbands after first few years and certainly after having kids. And the old man can either live with whatever crumbs he gets or file for divorce and go back to dating.

I will admit this is a rather foreign concept, never having experienced a dead bedroom. And, thinking about it, if I had, would wonder what had changed and why.. But evidently any thought or attempt to rectify the situation is pointless. Forget counseling, reading books, or anything. Either accept the status quo or go find an attorney.
 

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FWIW, @Lawrence N wrote that he improved his attitude and that he and his wife were making progress and he was happy about that. He is optimistic and wrote he did NOT want to divorce his wife, was happy at progress. Maybe he will chime back in on his thread and clarify if I read him wrong. I suspect he is too busy enjoying his marriage to respond.

It was the people on TAM who are telling him he shouldn't be happy at the progress, that his wife was only stepping up because she was scared. That she is essentially lying to him. That he should just accept that a true turnaround has a miniscule chance, that they almost never happened and he either needed to accept his plight or divorce and go date, find some hookers, or whatever.

So the default TAM answer to any issue, especially sexual problems, is to just file for divorce. Because nothing else will make any real difference because most women don't like sex much with their husbands after first few years and certainly after having kids. And the old man can either live with whatever crumbs he gets or file for divorce and go back to dating.

I will admit this is a rather foreign concept, never having experienced a dead bedroom. And, thinking about it, if I had, would wonder what had changed and why.. But evidently any thought or attempt to rectify the situation is pointless. Forget counseling, reading books, or anything. Either accept the status quo or go find an attorney.
Why is it progress if he is getting more of the same? Also, I never said he should divorce, just to keep trying and to give himself a deadline. I did say that the chances are not very high. We don't really know why his wife has stepped up the frequency but the OP is still complaining that it's the same old boring sex and that she is doing it for him, not because she wants to. Divorce in this situations should be the last resort, IMO. If he values his sex life more than his marriage, then he will file. I know that it's very difficult for people who have not experienced a dead bedroom to understand what's it like. I don't wish it on anybody.
 

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Honestly, I feel bad for people who are trying to sexually please their spouse, but it's not good enough because they aren't as into sex as their spouse. If she loves him and shares intimacy with him, that should be welcomed, not criticized. If she gets the feeling that he is unhappy with her sexually, that can make things much worse. It can make it hard for ger to feel that she's enough for her husband when he's giving her the impression that she's not. That would make things a lot worse.
I guess this goes back to the old question then is bad sex better than no sex? And should one act like they were happy so as not to upset the other one's feelings even though the sex isn't all that satisfying?

I'm not really sure. I did ask that question as a post a few years ago and got mixed replies.
 

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I guess this goes back to the old question then is bad sex better than no sex? And should one act like they were happy so as not to upset the other one's feelings even though the sex isn't all that satisfying?

I'm not really sure. I did ask that question as a post a few years ago and got mixed replies.
Isn’t bad sex subjective? I mean people might offer multiple positions but no bdsm or anal. If that’s what good sex is to you, then anything other than that is boring. And likewise, some people want loud, screamers. Some aren’t wired that way. So to the point of a guy with 200 past partners, how was his wife ever going to measure up. She loves him. Personally 200 would men s red flag but whatever.
 

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I guess this goes back to the old question then is bad sex better than no sex? And should one act like they were happy so as not to upset the other one's feelings even though the sex isn't all that satisfying?

I'm not really sure. I did ask that question as a post a few years ago and got mixed replies.
With bad (pity) sex I would be out of the marriage. But as early as possible, so I can find a more compatible partner. Bad sex is way worse than no sex.
 

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Isn’t bad sex subjective? I mean people might offer multiple positions but no bdsm or anal. If that’s what good sex is to you, then anything other than that is boring. And likewise, some people want loud, screamers. Some aren’t wired that way. So to the point of a guy with 200 past partners, how was his wife ever going to measure up. She loves him. Personally 200 would men s red flag but whatever.
Very subjective. To me, good sex is when your partner is active and very involved. You can tell she is happy to be having sex with you. It doesn't have to be multiple positions. Bad sex to me is when your partner lies there like a corpse and there is no involvement and she wants you to get on with it and finish in 30 seconds so she can go back to sleep.
 

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How do you interpret the OP's comments: My wife still does not initiate sex. We are increasing our sexual relationship, not because she really wants too.

She is scared she is going to lose him, so she is giving him more sex... pity sex. Unfortunately, that's not what the OP is looking for.
Would it be duty sex re scared he's going to leave, not really pity sex..?
 

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You’re getting more sex but it’s not good enough so leave. However, how do you know you’ll be guaranteed better and frequent sex? Sad that you’ll throw away a relationship for a maybe.
This woman isn't interested in sex with her husband at all. She has zero desire for him.

Would YOU stay with a husband who hated sex with you, had zero attraction to you, and only had duty sex with you occasionally to keep you from divorcing him?

Your posting history leads me to believe it would be the end of the world if your husband had no desire for you. Why does your advice differ so much to this OP than what you yourself would be able to tolerate?

??????????

This might be one is the biggest hypocritical posts I've seen in my 9 years on this forum, and I've read a LOT of posts.
 

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Bad sex to me is when your partner lies there like a corpse and there is no involvement and she wants you to get on with it and finish in 30 seconds so she can go back to sleep
Well for once we (maybe) agree on something.

But you acknowledged your wife gave much better until the kids reached majority and then totally stopped. She was an accomplished actress until then. She “petformed” well enough to keep her part in the play.

And several other posters opined that was just the “way of wives” and @Lawrence N had made no progress at all.
 

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Well for once we (maybe) agree on something.

But you acknowledged your wife gave much better until the kids reached majority and then totally stopped. She was an accomplished actress until then. She “petformed” well enough to keep her part in the play.
My story is rather complex (because mental illness is involved - and conflict avoidance), but I do agree that she managed to fool me very well. But I'm easily fooled because I do not tend to see malice in other people's actions.

And several other posters opined that was just the “way of wives” and @Lawrence N had made no progress at all.
We do keep "arguing" the same point, it seems. If you are saying that he's made progress because he is looking after himself now and he is happier, fine, but I do not see how you can call progress getting more of the thing he really despises, duty sex.
 

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You’re getting more sex but it’s not good enough so leave. However, how do you know you’ll be guaranteed better and frequent sex? Sad that you’ll throw away a relationship for a maybe.
This is THE mistake that many make when leaving a spouse.

One should leave because they will be happier alone rather than replacing one with the other, because alone is the only thing you are guaranteed when divorced.

Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk
 

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Absolutely this one. My wife did enough to keep me there because she didn't want a divorce with small children. When the youngest was 18, she dumped our sex life. Still not brave enough to divorce me and move out, mind you. So we haven't divorced yet, but living separate lives, waiting for my daughter's graduation this year.
I hope life is good for you once it’s all been sorted. I wish I could say your wife and OP’s wife and all the others here are rare cases but they aren’t. And obviously you all pay a huge price for that.
 

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I hope life is good for you once it’s all been sorted. I wish I could say your wife and OP’s wife and all the others here are rare cases but they aren’t. And obviously you all pay a huge price for that.
I'm good right now. Sad for the demise of my marriage, but mentally much better. We just have practical stuff to sort out.
 

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So what is the appropriate response? What should @Lawrence N do in his situation? What will you do?
I think he's doing great work and things have measurably improved.

Anything can worked on and improved and @Lawrence N is taking control of his own agency again which is 90% of the battle.

I know you were asking another poster but I'm impressed with Lawrence and how he stopped whining and took action.👍
 

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I guess this goes back to the old question then is bad sex better than no sex? And should one act like they were happy so as not to upset the other one's feelings even though the sex isn't all that satisfying?

I'm not really sure. I did ask that question as a post a few years ago and got mixed replies.
Didn't I reply to that thread?
 

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Isn’t bad sex subjective? I mean people might offer multiple positions but no bdsm or anal. If that’s what good sex is to you, then anything other than that is boring. And likewise, some people want loud, screamers. Some aren’t wired that way. So to the point of a guy with 200 past partners, how was his wife ever going to measure up. She loves him. Personally 200 would men s red flag but whatever.
I would say its only partially subjective. Anyone can idenifty bad sex when they experience it. I think In Absentia mentioned if someone is just laying there waiting for it to be over, I think most people would call that bad sex.
 

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Discussion Starter · #399 ·
This is THE mistake that many make when leaving a spouse.

One should leave because they will be happier alone rather than replacing one with the other, because alone is the only thing you are guaranteed when divorced.

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to answer your thought… “One should leave because they will be happier alone rather than replacing one with the other, because alone is the only thing you are guaranteed when divorced.”

Had I left my wife, I would go into the divorce knowing I needed to be 100 percent happier on my own. I am perfectly capable of finding my own happiness in solitude. I used to love being single as I had a lot of fun. When you’re single you have no one to answer too. You have zero obligations to anyone as a single person. You can live the life you choose. When you are in a relationship there are compromises. I know in my heart of hearts that had I left my wife I would have remained single for the rest of my life… and thoroughly enjoyed each day. The older I get… the less I enjoy compromising… so… I will never have a relationship again if that were to have happened.
 
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