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I agree with others there is someone else already or she would not want a open marriage . you better start digging my friend . she is keeping her phone on her for a reason and it's not good . get her phone when she is asleep and check it out . even look for texting app's .
 

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Discussion Starter #23
Thank you all for advice I will have to resolve this in a peaceful manner for the sake of my children investigate I will do but I cannot just turn theory into fact without the facts to back it up. I understand (evening thoughts) and that is why I can't just jump to a conclusion. Once again thank you all for the great advice. I'm sure the phone will conclude the story
 

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Is your wife cheating? Maybe. But I want to throw some other words out there. For now, all you know is

- You used to be not very good to her. You've made some progress.
- You had a conversation with your wife, albeit an uncomfortable one for you.

If your wife was an a corner of the internet far far away from here, she might actually get advice that if she loves you but is craving the love and attention she is and *and has been* missing, that one way to achieve this is an open marriage. Not good advice in this instance. But perhaps something that has tickled her mind. Don't assume she is cheating. And don't forget what your role in the dysfunction of the marriage is.

See withholding love, affection, kindness and one might even saying basic human decency, is worse than withholding sex. It can gut a core. By all means, GET COUNSELING, regardless. Investigate cheating, if you think that's appropriate. But ask yourself with full honesty, if she is cheating or contemplating cheating, what is your role? If you cannot look at that question honestly, then let her go.
 

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@Atemiwaza

Welcome to the forum.

You need to be strong, and do not blame yourself for all problems in your marriage. I understand that you love your family, and you fear loosing it, but your fear is your greatest weakness as well and your wife will smell it. Your wife should be equally concerned about the well-being of your family, and not only you. Put your foot down and say NO to open marriage. Now would be a good time for you and your wife to have some honest conversations, reading marriage-friendly books, consider counseling, and defining some boundaries for interactions with other people in the larger interest of your marriage.

Some members have already provided good advice. And remember this: women dig strong and confident men on average. Have some game.
 

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Is your wife cheating? Maybe. But I want to throw some other words out there. For now, all you know is

- You used to be not very good to her. You've made some progress.
- You had a conversation with your wife, albeit an uncomfortable one for you.

If your wife was an a corner of the internet far far away from here, she might actually get advice that if she loves you but is craving the love and attention she is and *and has been* missing, that one way to achieve this is an open marriage. Not good advice in this instance. But perhaps something that has tickled her mind. Don't assume she is cheating. And don't forget what your role in the dysfunction of the marriage is.

See withholding love, affection, kindness and one might even saying basic human decency, is worse than withholding sex. It can gut a core. By all means, GET COUNSELING, regardless. Investigate cheating, if you think that's appropriate. But ask yourself with full honesty, if she is cheating or contemplating cheating, what is your role? If you cannot look at that question honestly, then let her go.
If she is cheating, he has no role, that is ALL ON HER. I have a feeling there may be some rewriting of the marital history here by her... trying to roll the blame onto him because she wants to cheat, and wishes to absolve herself of guilt and responsibility. OP did not make clear whether these issues have been hashed out previously, or if they just suddenly came up when she decided it was time to bang other men.
 

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Is your wife cheating? Maybe. But I want to throw some other words out there. For now, all you know is

- You used to be not very good to her. You've made some progress.
- You had a conversation with your wife, albeit an uncomfortable one for you.

If your wife was an a corner of the internet far far away from here, she might actually get advice that if she loves you but is craving the love and attention she is and *and has been* missing, that one way to achieve this is an open marriage. Not good advice in this instance. But perhaps something that has tickled her mind. Don't assume she is cheating. And don't forget what your role in the dysfunction of the marriage is.

See withholding love, affection, kindness and one might even saying basic human decency, is worse than withholding sex. It can gut a core. By all means, GET COUNSELING, regardless. Investigate cheating, if you think that's appropriate. But ask yourself with full honesty, if she is cheating or contemplating cheating, what is your role? If you cannot look at that question honestly, then let her go.
The problem here, with your post, is the following...

1) He may have been inattentive, boorish, or just a general dumbass, OK I get it...
2) Even if the above is true, she had a choice... work on that or have an affair...
3) You and most adults know that open marriages, which can work for a lot of people, don't happen the way that she is doing it, with is the wrong way...
4) Deep down, you and most here on TAM know that she is already having an affair. He may need proof, but we don't. We have seen it a 1000 times here and else where... If he digs he will see what is actually going on...

Point is, a) if she was actually unhappy, she could have talked to him... not had an affair. b) if she wanted to try someone else, she could have filed for divorce... not had an affair. c) if she actually loved her husband but needed something else, she could have honestly talked about an open marriage or swinging... not have an affair.

There is a right way, and a wrong way to deal with an open marriage...

The way that she is doing is the wrong way.

Further, men like OP are in general, not strong enough emotionally, and sexually to deal with an open marriage, and anyone with any sense could see that...

No, she I already having an affair, she was probably looking on affair sites or talked to her AP, and picked up on the idea about an open marriage...

No, she is cheating, and in a little while if he does the work, he will find that out...
 

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Thank you all for advice I will have to resolve this in a peaceful manner for the sake of my children investigate I will do but I cannot just turn theory into fact without the facts to back it up. I understand (evening thoughts) and that is why I can't just jump to a conclusion. Once again thank you all for the great advice. I'm sure the phone will conclude the story
Buddy I’m getting the feeling that you are going to bury your head in the sand and hope this situation just goes away.
Living happily ever after belongs in fairy tales.
You need to proactive rather than reactive.
In other words don’t wait for a problem to arise and try to deal with it,prevent the problem from occurring or at least don’t let it get any worse.
 

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If she is cheating, he has no role, that is ALL ON HER. I have a feeling there may be some rewriting of the marital history here by her... trying to roll the blame onto him because she wants to cheat, and wishes to absolve herself of guilt and responsibility. OP did not make clear whether these issues have been hashed out previously, or if they just suddenly came up when she decided it was time to bang other men.
<Shrug> His call. Blame has nothing to do with it.
 

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The problem here, with your post, is the following...

1) He may have been inattentive, boorish, or just a general dumbass, OK I get it...
2) Even if the above is true, she had a choice... work on that or have an affair...
Sure. I am not saying having an affair is a good by any stretch. I am not sure how one works on a marriage by oneself. The OP clearly stated that he was not in it. I will never understand why folks on this board can so easily advise well you were pretty horrible with your emotional behavior but you are getting better now but if someone makes a physical move it is soooo much more horrid.
3) You and most adults know that open marriages, which can work for a lot of people, don't happen the way that she is doing it, with is the wrong way...
What way is that? With a conversation? Do you know another way?


4) Deep down, you and most here on TAM know that she is already having an affair. He may need proof, but we don't. We have seen it a 1000 times here and else where... If he digs he will see what is actually going on...
Well I guess he digs on then, if that is what he wants to do. But I don't know deep down or any other way that she is having an affair. There is a good chance.

Point is, a) if she was actually unhappy, she could have talked to him... not had an affair. b) if she wanted to try someone else, she could have filed for divorce... not had an affair.
Yah she could have, assuming she is having an affair which is not known yet. For some reason, his being bordering on cruel is instantly forgivable. Hell it is even understandable how one's head could get so wrong. But posters here cannot see how a person's head could get wrong by being consistently and systematically not only denied affection but put down? As soon as their is a **** involved, the equation becomes quite linear.

I read recently the percentage of marriage that have experienced affairs. I don't remember the number. But it was big. I simply cannot believe the TAM party line that this is uniquely a massive character flaw. It is no more of a character flaw than any other human flaw that we have. Something like 40% of US humans are just evil dirtbags? I don't think so.

People don't work that way.


c) if she actually loved her husband but needed something else, she could have honestly talked about an open marriage or swinging... not have an affair.
Well that may have been exactly what she is doing. OP just does not know.

There is a right way, and a wrong way to deal with an open marriage...
Oh don't I know that. I certainly would love to see your book on it some day. :)

The way that she is doing is the wrong way.
The post that she has brought this up to legitimize an existing affair was not seen by me. I think it as yet does not exist. So I don't know what you mean.
Further, men like OP are in general, not strong enough emotionally, and sexually to deal with an open marriage, and anyone with any sense could see that...
It does not have much to do with strength. But that is beside the point. OP does not want it. It conflicts with his value system. Full stop. I hope he communicated that to her.

No, she I already having an affair, she was probably looking on affair sites or talked to her AP, and picked up on the idea about an open marriage...

No, she is cheating, and in a little while if he does the work, he will find that out...
And what he does with that information is up to him, should that come to pass. If he wants an R, and sits in front of a marriage counselor and will not even consider the role of his actions and seeks only to vilify her, it will not go well for him. Of COURSE if she refuses remorse and trickle truths, that will not go well for either of them. All of you helpful people will share that with him,
 

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Sure. I am not saying having an affair is a good by any stretch. I am not sure how one works on a marriage by oneself. The OP clearly stated that he was not in it. I will never understand why folks on this board can so easily advise well you were pretty horrible with your emotional behavior but you are getting better now but if someone makes a physical move it is soooo much more horrid.

Yeah, for a lot of us that is a line that you don't cross. Right or wrong, a lot of people feel that way.

What way is that? With a conversation? Do you know another way?

Well I guess he digs on then, if that is what he wants to do. But I don't know deep down or any other way that she is having an affair. There is a good chance.

Yah she could have, assuming she is having an affair which is not known yet. For some reason, his being bordering on cruel is instantly forgivable. Hell it is even understandable how one's head could get so wrong. But posters here cannot see how a person's head could get wrong by being consistently and systematically not only denied affection but put down? As soon as their is a **** involved, the equation becomes quite linear.

I read recently the percentage of marriage that have experienced affairs. I don't remember the number. But it was big. I simply cannot believe the TAM party line that this is uniquely a massive character flaw. It is no more of a character flaw than any other human flaw that we have. Something like 40% of US humans are just evil dirtbags? I don't think so.

People don't work that way.

Well that may have been exactly what she is doing. OP just does not know.

Oh don't I know that. I certainly would love to see your book on it some day. :)

The post that she has brought this up to legitimize an existing affair was not seen by me. I think it as yet does not exist. So I don't know what you mean.

It does not have much to do with strength. But that is beside the point. OP does not want it. It conflicts with his value system. Full stop. I hope he communicated that to her.

And what he does with that information is up to him, should that come to pass. If he wants an R, and sits in front of a marriage counselor and will not even consider the role of his actions and seeks only to vilify her, it will not go well for him. Of COURSE if she refuses remorse and trickle truths, that will not go well for either of them. All of you helpful people will share that with him,
I was waiting for you to come back at me... Glad you did.

Now we have talked some on the board. In some ways, we are not as far apart as you might think.

But here is the deal. His opening post is so standard, what his "wife" said, as to make you wonder if this guy was a troll. (He is not I think, but this situation has played out a 1000 times.)

But for you to equate, his being an emotional moron, which unfortunately is kind of standard for young guys, to her having an affair and then doing the "open marriage" question, is just beyond the pale.

I don't know why you won't just admit that.

Are you telling me, that deep down, you need videos from OP in order for you to accept that she is already having an affair? You know better than that.

Are you telling me, that both men and women, don't try the "open marriage" trick on a regular basis after already having an affair and hot sex, but still want the comfort of hubby's paycheck, or wife's home cooking?

Look, I personally have no issues with people that want open marriages (the real kind) because they want to have more variety, or they want more or stronger BDSM, and wife or hubby can only go so far, or for any other of a hundred reasons. I get it, I have not done it in a marriage, but I have had several, kind of serious GF's that were all cool with that. That is not the same as a marriage, at all, and I get that.

I am just saying that I get it...

But what I have a problem with is the "pretend" open marriage talk. No, that is crap, it is un cool in every way, it is dishonest, it is cheating...

And I give him NO PASS at all for being a moron and not treating her like he should have, none at all.

But I do see the affair stuff, cheating differently. If your H/W is not treating you right get a divorce. Talk to them, try to work it out. If that does not work, the have the balls to get a divorce, don't cheat...
 

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I was waiting for you to come back at me... Glad you did.
"Come back at you"? Have I been living rent free in your head? I did not know we were having an argument.

I have a different opinion for the OP. He may do with that what he wills.

Now we have talked some on the board. In some ways, we are not as far apart as you might think.
I am not sure how you know what I think. I have next to no idea how you think.

But here is the deal. His opening post is so standard, what his "wife" said, as to make you wonder if this guy was a troll. (He is not I think, but this situation has played out a 1000 times.)
But for you to equate, his being an emotional moron, which unfortunately is kind of standard for young guys, to her having an affair and then doing the "open marriage" question, is just beyond the pale.
[/quote]

Shrug. Different strokes. If that is what an emotional moron is, most of us would pass, thanks.

I don't know why you won't just admit that.
Might be because I don't think it. I don't feel it. I don't believe it.

Are you telling me, that deep down, you need videos from OP in order for you to accept that she is already having an affair? You know better than that.

Are you telling me, that both men and women, don't try the "open marriage" trick on a regular basis after already having an affair and hot sex, but still want the comfort of hubby's paycheck, or wife's home cooking?
I think it is MUCH more complicated than that. But since you already have a full handle on what I believe, I will smile and move along. Cheers.
 

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The best answer to a spouse who asks you for an open marriage is. OK then I will try it for a year and if I like it you can go if not then we won't. In other words me first.
 

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You said that you have only been thinking of you in your marriage. You wife in the background running errands, taking care of the kids etc., may have felt insignificant eventually. You don't know if she is having an affair, it is an assumption because she asked you a question about an open marriage- signs of the times we live in where all kinds of relationships exist and it may have been an innocent question out of curiosity after seeing something on TV/ reading something or one to explore your thoughts on it. Either way, it looks like you need to start working on bringing that spark back where she feels she matters, you see her, you hear her and she is cherished and likewise she should in return reciprocate that.

My husband has made me feel like that and from day one of our marriage, although I was loyal to him and never gave him a reason to, he always checked my phone, my phone bill, my emails and even had a tracker on my phone- that I never felt good enough, loved or trusted. There was no recognition for my contribution, it was never good enough. I couldn't remember the last time we did something fun or had a hearty laugh. I felt vulnerable and insecure so much so that in the end after 12 whole years during a traumatic time in our marriage I gave him a reason to deserve all that I went through. It came to a point that it didn't matter anymore since I was a cheat and criminal in his books anyway.


Don't get me wrong for saying this, cheating is immoral and wrong but most women only cheat when they crave deep emotional attachment to feel that sense of belonging, to be a part of a unit or when they don't care about their marriage anymore they press the destruct button. She probably told you this so that you can work on yourself. If you start showing that you are suspicious and that you don't trust her with a lot of questions you will push her away and cause more friction. Maybe explore the subject further ask her jokingly what brought it on? etc., and gently but firmly express how you feel and tell her how precious she is to you that you can't stand the thought of anyone else with her. Counselling helps a lot to get to the bottom of things and also to rebuild things. Good luck
 

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First of all, you have to decide if you really want to stay married at all costs.

Do you really want to stay with her while she bangs other men, and potentially gets and passes on an STD?

If your answer is no, you need to tell her that sharing her with other men is not an option to you. Then you need to do some investigative work on your own to find out if she has already had sex with someone other than you. The chances are high, since she openly brought up the idea of an open marriage.

She is going to deny that she's been with someone already even if she has. Cheaters always lie, and sometimes when the proof is staring them in the face.

What she did was a choice. She could have chosen not cheat, but suffer and try to work on the marriage with you.

Why does she want to open the marriage instead of divorce you and find someone new? Are you her financial security? Does she think that divorce will hurt the children, but cheating won't?

It is a shame that you neglected your wife, and it is a shame that she is a cheater. Neither is good.
 

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I'm a married man for 7 years with a beautiful wife that I love dearly we have 2 children and overall have had a healthy relationship. I'm here for help a few recent events that took many years for me to realize I put my wife in the background and made the marriage about me I came to terms and apologized for the heartache I put her through little attention always blamed her for problems and not ever helping with kids and house chores she did them all. I'm not a controlling person and have made improvements on where I lacked in the marriage. She now has come to me stating she feels like she wants her freedoms back and told me she loves me and would never hurt me but asked me for my thoughts on an open marriage and it was just a thought of hers but feel that is the freedom she wants back.how do I respond to this with a woman I am so dearly in love with I did tell her I can't share her with other men and that she means the whole world to me everytime I asked her questions on why she felt this way or any questions upon this subject she tells me I don't know. Please help don't want my marriage to end.

Uh oh.

I think I know how this is going to develop.

I can't think of the last time I saw a thread like this that didn't turn out that the spouse had already cheated, either physically or emotionally (and ready to go the next step to physical on the emotional affairs). Anyone remember a thread that didn't turn out that way?
 
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