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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi all:

I am new here but really need to get some advice form those who have had experience in dealing with potential infidelity in their marriages... I have a counselling appointment this week but need to talk about this...

I have been married to a wonderful man for 10 years and we've been together for 12. We have a daughter and I am currently 6 months pregnant with our second. I would consider us to have a very good relationship - we never fight and had complete trust between us until recently. I may be misinterpreting some of these signs due to my own recent self esteem issues and my snooping but I think we may be in trouble....

I just turned 40 and am pregnant so I am already a bit emotinal about these things. I started to feel a bit insecure about myself and that lead me to look at some aspects of our relationship I am not entirely happy with. I feel like we have been drifting apart as we do not spend time alone together and he is increasingly away from our family. We were sleeping in sep bedrooms as he snores veyr badly. We rarely have sex.
When we do it is me that initiates it and I am most often turned away. I feel like we lack real intimacy between us. He rarely compliments me and shows very little affection to me. He is a kind and considerate man but I am feeling like there is something wrong with me as he does not seem to desire me as a woman . We never had an overly active sex life but it has declined gradually to the point where I feel my pregnancy was the immaculate conception.... We could go months without and not for lack of effort on my part.

Due to these issues, I started to have fears that perhaps he was being satisfied elsewhere and that was why he had no desire to have sex with me. I never dreamt he would be unfaithful in any way but due to some stories ha has told me and some personal experiences I have had, I started to wonder more. He recently took a boys only sports trip where he confided in me that the purpose of the trip for most of the married men that go is ti have an opportunity to drink and cheat on their wives. He goes on many business trips where this behaviour occurs as well. I recently found out that his workplace is a hotbed of flirting and such between coworkers. I work in a male dominated industry and have had my eyes opened to the male psyche in a shocking way. I see what goes on with my male clients and am constantly being sent sexual jokes, sexual emails and worse. I do not send these type of emails and do not respond in kind to this kind of baiting from them. I have a very liberal sense of humour and know that men will be men. I am not a prude and am very accepting of what I would consider to me guys talking smack and joking around. I was very concerned when he announced he was once again going on the boys trip... knowing what I know from the last one... Not wanting to be the paranoid wife, I lied and said it was fine that he went. I had a bit of a meltdown before he went as he was away for my 40th, I was alone and I confessed I was feeling very lonely and upset about these issues in our marriage.
Due to all these feelings, I had an overwhelming sense of dread. I snooped in his personal email account only to discover some shocking emails about the trip. He made some very raunchy sexual comments about the goings on and I was completely shocked that this was coming from my wonderful husband. Comments like " don't worry, we got you covered, in bed with a good hooker. we got your back buddy", "this is a drink/sports/**** fest", "let's hope that 51 isnt the average age of the women in the bar" and "nothing wrong with a nice cougar". His profile for this trip stated some disturbing things too - like the movie that would best describe his life is Deuce Bigelow, if he had only $50 left to his name he'd get a rub and tug..... this was really shocking to me and over the top even for guys I thought.... This was really alarming to me since he never wants to have sex. I then discovered he went to a strip club while there. that would have been somehing I expected when out with the boys BUT he lied to me when I asked him and fessed up when confronted with a lame excuse that he forgot they went...said it was his friend who wanted to go and nothing happened. Said he lied as I would freak out just like I was already doing. Did not say he was sorry he lied about it tho. He is still upset I checked his emails and comments on changing his password. I told him that would seriously indicate he had something to hide if he did that. Now he deletes most emails, texts and BB messages after he responds. He does keep his phone pretty close now. I could not let this go with my gut screaming at me that something was wrong... I have since discovered he sent a very sexual joke to an attractive co-worker he denied working with. It was a picture joke showing a mans very large penis. She comments "you wish" and he responds back "no, YOU wish".... why would she wish his penis looked like that? The last straw was another email to an attractive female coworker he has talked about setting up with a friend of his.I had found rather sexual emails back and forth from them on occassion that alarmed me.. but this last one is way too far in my opinion. They have a businesss conversation about an account and she asks him to talk to them. He says" what am
I, your *****?", she responds "Yes, yes you are my *****, I thought you liked that, wink", he then I feel take it way to far and says "This is not exactly the way I had envisioned being your *****. I figured you'd be wearing a sexy s & m outfit or something along those lines, haha", she responds " Did you imagine the black or the red outfit?", he says " I had the black one with your blonde hair and the red one with a wig". she does not respond to this one. I am so hurt, mad and shocked... When confronted about it he says it was all a joke. Everyone at work jokes like that. There was nothing sexual about it , no sexual intent was there. Beside, he says, it wasnt meant for me to see..... WTF???????????????????????????????????
And to top it all off, he's on a business trip right now with this woman and others he emailed overnight for two nights..... HELP!
 

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Your suspicions are valid unfortunately you tipped him off when you confronted him with scant evidence and now he's going to cover his tracks and it will be that much more difficult to expose him.

Even if he wasn't cheating you've got big problems with the marriage, and with a second child on the way.. you've got your hands full.

Wish I had something more to offer in terms of advice but I'm coming up short.

You want more solid proof, there are lots of ways to get it.. phone tracking and a VAR in the car, for starters.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I feel I am justified in my feeling as this is highly innapropriate. He feels that it is just joking and not wrong at all..... After I stood my ground that I DID NOT agree, he said maybe it was not appropriate and he will be more careful twith his joking so there are no mixed signals going out.... He has asked me why I think he is cheating, what proof did I have and how long had I been looking at his correspondences.... He has since deleted alot of the emails I quoted... I can read this as he is very upset that I dont trust him (thus his anger, shock, and hurt) OR I can take it at face value and read it like anyone else would... that there is a strong possibility he has something brewing.... I may invest in some tools... what would you all suggest? The voice activated recorder or a cell phone spy app? He does alot of BBM so I dont know if that would work but it would allow me to access his work emails to monitor his emails with coworkers....
 

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I feel I am justified in my feeling as this is highly innapropriate. He feels that it is just joking and not wrong at all..... ..
You are completely justified and he is full of bullsnot. Joking around with close guy friends - sure but not to that extent. And there is no "joking around" with female acquaintances - just fishing.


After I stood my ground that I DID NOT agree, he said maybe it was not appropriate and he will be more careful twith his joking so there are no mixed signals going out.... He has asked me why I think he is cheating, what proof did I have and how long had I been looking at his correspondences.... ....
The bold sentence is chilling. He is literally challenging you to prove it. Very confident. Very c0cky.



He has since deleted alot of the emails I quoted... I can read this as he is very upset that I dont trust him (thus his anger, shock, and hurt) OR I can take it at face value and read it like anyone else would... that there is a strong possibility he has something brewing.... I may invest in some tools... what would you all suggest? The voice activated recorder or a cell phone spy app? He does alot of BBM so I dont know if that would work but it would allow me to access his work emails to monitor his emails with coworkers....
Try the VAR. But as far as I'm concerned it's just a game to him. He will tell you he knew you were snooping and set up whatever conversations you discover as a "joke" or a "test". He's a slimy slippery weasel. Talk to a lawyer to find out where you stand. Because you are standing alone.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
It's like he's two different people... It just doesn't add up to me or make any sense.... He wasn't sarcastic in his questioning about what I suspected but it still bothers me that he asked those specific questions.... He had deleted all of the incoming msgs about the S & m thing but forgot to get rid of his sent items... He clued into that while we were talking and was like "wow, you even went in my deleted items to look at that..." He got really upset when he looked n MY computer and saw I had sent the email to a close friend to ask her opinion... Stood my ground and said if it wasn't innaparopriate as he said, then why would you care that she saw it???? He dodged around that one...
 

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So sorry superspy! I completely agree with you and your intuition. NO ONE knows our spouses better than we do. If your radar is up, it is a sign. Don't take this lightly, do whatever you need to do to protect you and your child(ren). The fact that you are pregnant really complicates this. Your health is paramount here. How dare he do this to you while carrying his child. So selfish & unfair!! The whole situation stinks. All I can say is, if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, guess what it is a duck! Protect and defend yourself and gather the answers you need. I really hope things work itself out for you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks for the confirmation that I should keep my guard up. It's so hard as I love him more than anything and want to rationalize all of these clues. I almost believe that he is being truthful that he wold never cheat on me but then like you said, brokenearted, it doesn't seem logical to me. He is so convincing that I am constanly second guessing my interpretation of all these things.... He even said to me that I was taking this all out of context ... he is so vehement in his denials and profession of his love for me and our family.... I am so stressed out about this... I am having trouble sleeping.. I'm losing weight and am crying all the time. I appreciate the feedback from all of you and can hardly wait to see the therapist on Friday to speak to her about all of this.
 

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Superspy I can relate to your story. I am the guy who did this to his wife. Not the talking to other women, that never happened. My wife was pregnant with our second child found my skeletons in the closet. My secrets was porn and looking up females from my past. I did the erase my history, lock my phone, put passwords on things. All that made it ten times WORSE. Your husband has to become a open book. Full transparency from here on out if he wants the marriage to survive. He has to make a lot of changes. I have, while its been a bumpy ride I am embarrassed for my past. MC would be a good start. He is very defensive right now. He is going to fight you every step of the way but eventually he will get it, or should get it. Your not insane. You put your husband on a pedastel for a very long time and you are shocked he is not perfect. That's ok. You both can rebound from this. Good luck and don't beat yourself up. You have a baby inside you to worry about. Hopefully your husband wakes up quickly and gets it right.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Thanks richie33... it's nice to get a man's perspective on this too. My brother read the emails and feels he was way out of line talking like that. Hubby feels he has't done anything wrong and therefore can't or won't take responsability for his innapropriate actions it seems. He knows what he did hurt me but says it wasn't intentional.... again... because I was never supposed to see those emails.... It's like he doesnt see WE have a serious issue here.. it seems like I am overreacting to some harmles inter office joking.... funny, he never sent me emails like that when we worked together.... but he isn't like other men, he wouldn't cheat even if it is acceptable in his work and social environments.... YOU, richie33, see that even tho there was not a physical affair, this is only a hop, skip and a jump away from one.... Kudos to you for looking inward to try and rebuild your lives together... I hope that we are able to do the same.
 

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Doesn't sound like 'joking' at all to me. Saying "haha" doesn't make it a joke. If he's spending time with her right now, say ... in a hotel bar ... I'd say there is a better than even chance they move that party to her room. They are both talking the talk and they are both thinking about it. Let's hope he does the right thing.
 

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Wow, your husband sounds like he has a sharp tongue for breaking/testing boundaries.

Get every email, send it to yourself, get all evidence you can get. Put a VAR (voice activated recorder) in his vehicle.

Build up your little pool of evidence, especially emails and you can expose far and wide to whomever you please. Even HR at his work place. Surprise him and, let him know that married men do not do these things. Married men do not go out like single lads on BOYS trip. Leave the BOYS trip to BOYS, immature and, single. No more, BOYS nights out (BNO), no more strip clubs, no more Mrs Nice Superspy!!

Do not be afraid to nuke this little c0ckroach. He has gone far beyond the threshold of "sweet, charming husband".

This type of communication is outright vulgar, disrespectful, extremely unprofessional and, completely inappropriate and, unnecessary!!!!! Cease and desist are his next orders!

Expose, expose expose.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thanks for your input. I'm going to look into getting the VAR... I have sent some of the emails to myself as he has already deleted some of the incriminating ones. I am pretty laid back and never wanted to restrict his social activities with his buddies but cannot tolerate some of the things that are going on there, even if he isnt partaking in the physical stuff. I dont see how it is healthy to put yourself in an environment where half of all the people are openly cheating and the others are just watching it all unfold, protecting each other's backs... I cannot accept that he feels the last email to his coworker was totally fine as it was a joke and everyone at work does it. I will not accept that I am over reacting and reading it out of context. I could show that to any woman and they would be mortified if their husband had sent it... even the men are agreeing it was out of line..... I hope I am able to track if he is being true to his word in that he "wil be more careful what he emails so it isn't sending mixed signals" as he puts it..... seems like the signals were loud and clear to me and that other woman.....
 

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You should find some useful tools on this thread: http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/67661-become-spy-catching-them-technology.html

You also need to prepare yourself to put your foot down hard. If you find nothing further is amiss, the behaviour still needs to stop, yesterday. But what if you do find something. You need to steel yourself to take the actions you will have to take. You need to be prepared to lose your marriage to have a chance to save it. You need to be prepared to treat him as an enemy, a continuous liar, someone who must constantly prove himself with his actions, not his words. Most of all, you cannot allow him to use your love, and your desire to stay married against you. If he cheated, but you still want to try, you give him the choice to do the right thing. Then you make sure he knows he has one, single shot to fix things or he's gone.
 

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The point is

While all of the stuff about emails etc may be inappropriate, disrespectfull etc. etc.:

He has no sex with her.

No sex, no love.

He does not love you.

That is the problem.
 

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The point is

While all of the stuff about emails etc may be inappropriate, disrespectfull etc. etc.:

He has no sex with her.

No sex, no love.

He does not love you.

That is the problem.
No, that is not necessarily so. Lots of marriage relationships dwindle to roommate status, so much so, its s joke or stereotype. And it is a bad joke. I think it happens without the couples ever really realising exactly what it is that starts changing, and thus have no real idea how to stop it. This is exactly the premise of mmslp.
 

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Does he use the computer for his emails? Of so, get a keylogger on it.

I have known jokes and such like that get bandied around, but I would suggest that those who get involved in these either already have poor boundaries, or are degrading their own boundaries. I think people who engage in this type of chat are also on the look out for something else at any time. I would be very concerned if I were you, and you need to put your foot down, very very firmly.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
I don't want to throw away 12 years and all that is good about our marriage and family. I dont think he has taken this to the physical level but I do feel it could easily end up there. I agree about the boundaries and tried to have a conversation about what is and isn't appropriate. I tried to turn it around and say I was examining my own behaviour and what i was conveying in emails as i knew how easily this type of joking can send the wrong kind of message to the person recieveing it. If i didnt have the intimacy issues to deal with I might be able to look at all those emails a little less harshly (even tho I still feel they are over the line) but when I look at everything I am currently experiencing, his behaviour in hiding things and the content of some of these emails, I cannot help but be afraid that he is heading down a slippery slope. Many of the emails are all business, however, this is not the first email with sexual overtones that HE has sent HER. There arent alot of them but it always seems that he is the initiator of this kind of talk. He doesn't send all of his clients and coworkers these type of emails. Just a few of the females. I should ask him if his boss sends emails like this to all the women in the office... If I were a gambling woman, I'd say chances are no way in hell...Going to look at ordering the VAR online today as I cannot seem to stop obessessing about this. I guess it is due to the fact that i cnnot come to terms with the fact he does not see these jokes as wrong. He agrees that he hurt me "unintentionally" but that isnt really the point......
 

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Superspy how long were you snooping before you confronted him? The reason I ask is if it was over the course of a few months and he had no idea, if he was having a physical affair you would have found it. Now he knows he will try and go underground. Let him know the pain and hurt you feel. Right now he is going shift the blame on you evading his privacy.
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