I feel very undesired and taken for granted by my H, and I would appreciate any comments or advice.
My H is an admirable person, a great housemate and father, loyal, reliable, hardworking, mature, and extremely attractive to me. Everything about him is great except that he is not affectionate (to anyone really) although he is respectful, gentle, polite. He also isn't very interested in sex. He doesn't have any hangups, but he is very LD.
He really enjoys sex once it has started, but the thought of it isn't appealing ahead of time. In other words, he can get aroused and has no erection issues, but rarely feels any craving for it.
He was only initiating once every 3 weeks or so for many years. I stopped initiating about a decade ago since I was tired of being turned down so often. However recently he actually asked me to initiate. So I started initiating but it didn't end up being much fun because he would usually turn me down. Then he stopped initiating himself. So I suggested we take turns. I then initiated 3-4 days after our last intimacy when it was my turn (just to give him a break, I'd rather have sex every day), and then I'd wait 7-12 days for him to initiate when it was his turn.
I would try to make it interesting by initiating in the day or in different rooms, but when it was his turn, always at night in the dark in bed. Finally, he told me he didn't want to have sex in the day. He comes to bed so late that I'm usually asleep or very sleepy (no, he's not watching porn, he only has a stone-age computer and phone which won't play videos), and he never thinks to come to bed early just to be with me.
He does not like me to flirt, proposition him, or wear sexy clothes or lingerie because it 'puts pressure on him'. The only way to initiate with him is to touch him directly.
He seems to love sex when we are having it. However, he always keeps his eyes closed the whole time. He must not be one of those 'visual' guys. But for some reason, he procrastinates or avoids having sex since he has a hard time imagining that he will get aroused (even though he always does if I touch him directly, there is no ED issue).
He expects me to be the 'active' one in sex usually, and 'new things' don't really appeal to him. Sex is usually great in spite of my having to provide most of the passion. He has great control and always waits for me to finish (which I do easily). I do oral on him as foreplay every time but I don't really like oral on myself, so he doesn't have to expend much time or effort. I'd be happy even with a quickie.
He thinks I should be happy with sex once a week (given that it used to be only every 3 weeks). I'm not though, because he turns me down so often, expects me to do the work being on top about 70% of the time, and he restricts our sex life to late at night in the dark, much later than I like to stay up.
He never tells me I'm pretty or flirts with me (he will yell out a sexy proposition if he happens to drive by me when I'm out running or flirt with me at the airport when I'm leaving on a business trip, but when I get home, nothing.) He might say 'I love you' a couple times a year, and never wants to go out with me. In 15 years since we had kids, we've never even gone out to dinner or to a movie alone, only with kids or friends or extended family.
We get along pretty well, no big conflicts, no 'rough patches' or drama in our marriage, and we usually agree on most things. Neither one of us has a temper or says hurtful things (except that he is brutally honest about what he likes and doesn't and would never tell a white lie).
Our anniversary fell on a Saturday a couple weeks ago and I dragged him out to a restaurant. He just complained about the menu and said 'You know I don't like going out to eat'. Then he said he just doesn't like celebrating holidays like Valentine's or anniversaries because it feels like he is 'expected to act a certain way'. The sex that night felt like duty sex. It's always been like this, we never went on a honeymoon because he said he didn't want to go on a trip right away, "We'd go on other trips later" (but we never did go anywhere without the kids.)
For years, I maintained a good mood by focusing on my kids. They gave me plenty of touch and affection when they were small. Now the youngest is 10, and they aren't in my arms or lap anymore and they don't need as much of my time or attention.
This year I've started trying to 'rekindle' my marriage, wearing new nicer outfits, trying new sexual positions/rooms, initiating, more kisses good morning, good night, more hugs. Mostly it hasn't made much difference and there have been many awkward failures when he doesn't like what I've tried or suggested. He will hug me back and initiates pecks good morning and good night nowadays (which is progress compared to the last few years), but he still treats me mostly like a roommate.
I know there's no OW (he works at home on our property and barely touches his computer or phone). He is self-employed so doesn't have external work stress. He is very fit and healthy and runs every day for exercise, and has a great diet.
I'm not unattractive (still a size 4 with pretty long hair). However, I think I am boring to him.
He won't even watch TV with me, and even if he would, he has to sit alone in his recliner. We go on trips as a family and do things like hiking as a family, but nothing just the two of us. If I suggest a 'date night' or doing something alone, he is very uncomfortable and says he doesn't want to. I can't even remember doing anything alone with him in years except driving to school events or going to the hardware store.
His love language to me is 'acts of service'. He does lots of favors for me, cooks my favorite dinners, builds things for me in the garden, improves rooms just for me. He is so busy with household projects he rarely ever sits down (so I can't just sit down next to him). He does so much for the kids too. One other really nice thing he does is give me advice - I don't ask that often but whenever I have a problem, he is great at giving me wise advice. He is my rock in so many ways.
I know he 'loves' me in the same way he loves our kids and he wouldn't want a divorce. It seems like ideally he'd like to stay with me long-term sort of as non-passionate friends with occasional benefits. He is amazing in so many ways, especially as a dad, and everyone thinks I'm so lucky to be married to him. So do I in most ways, but I feel like my love and passion for him is unrequited, and that he just 'isn't that into me'.
Does anyone have any advice for me? I don't know how I could 'woman up' in any way that would make a difference. Dressing up has no effect. I'm already thin and fit. I never criticize, nag, yell, or tell him what to do - he is the leader in our family and I have the utmost respect for him (because he always does the right thing in all areas except for not showing love/affection). I have my own hobbies and when I've been really busy with them or the kids, it doesn't bother him one bit. I've gone for some years hardly touching him and it is just fine with him. I do not go out to socialize with friends or anybody very much (mostly because I work full time and want to be with my kids), and I know that's one area I need to work on. I go to various types of shows with my kids, but I will need to make more friends as they get older and leave home. I do exercise a few times a week, but I know it would be better if I did it every day, especially cardio to improve my mood.
My H said he probably wouldn't ever be willing to go to marriage counseling. He wants me to accept him as he is and not try to change him (note that I didn't do anything to try to change him for many years, so that can't be the initial problem).
His testosterone is low and I'd like him to do something about that, but he doesn't seem willing to go on therapy. I think it would help our sex life if he did, but I don't think testosterone alone would make him want to go out on 'date nights' or spend quality alone time with me.
I just feel lonely and like my life is going to be 'blah' and even more lonely after my children leave home. I often feel ugly and awkward since he obviously feels only 'meh' about me (although when I look in the mirror, I think I look pretty good). If nothing ever changes, I'll have to rely on girl friends for any affection or social life. I hate the idea of divorcing but lately I've started wondering what that would be like, whether it would be a good idea or bad. I wouldn't consider leaving until our kids all leave for college (about 6 years from now).
I was dealing a lot better emotionally in this situation when I wasn't 'trying things' to rekindle or improve our marriage. The trying and not having much success is just embarrassing and frustrating, and I'm starting to feel depressed.
My H is an admirable person, a great housemate and father, loyal, reliable, hardworking, mature, and extremely attractive to me. Everything about him is great except that he is not affectionate (to anyone really) although he is respectful, gentle, polite. He also isn't very interested in sex. He doesn't have any hangups, but he is very LD.
He really enjoys sex once it has started, but the thought of it isn't appealing ahead of time. In other words, he can get aroused and has no erection issues, but rarely feels any craving for it.
He was only initiating once every 3 weeks or so for many years. I stopped initiating about a decade ago since I was tired of being turned down so often. However recently he actually asked me to initiate. So I started initiating but it didn't end up being much fun because he would usually turn me down. Then he stopped initiating himself. So I suggested we take turns. I then initiated 3-4 days after our last intimacy when it was my turn (just to give him a break, I'd rather have sex every day), and then I'd wait 7-12 days for him to initiate when it was his turn.
I would try to make it interesting by initiating in the day or in different rooms, but when it was his turn, always at night in the dark in bed. Finally, he told me he didn't want to have sex in the day. He comes to bed so late that I'm usually asleep or very sleepy (no, he's not watching porn, he only has a stone-age computer and phone which won't play videos), and he never thinks to come to bed early just to be with me.
He does not like me to flirt, proposition him, or wear sexy clothes or lingerie because it 'puts pressure on him'. The only way to initiate with him is to touch him directly.
He seems to love sex when we are having it. However, he always keeps his eyes closed the whole time. He must not be one of those 'visual' guys. But for some reason, he procrastinates or avoids having sex since he has a hard time imagining that he will get aroused (even though he always does if I touch him directly, there is no ED issue).
He expects me to be the 'active' one in sex usually, and 'new things' don't really appeal to him. Sex is usually great in spite of my having to provide most of the passion. He has great control and always waits for me to finish (which I do easily). I do oral on him as foreplay every time but I don't really like oral on myself, so he doesn't have to expend much time or effort. I'd be happy even with a quickie.
He thinks I should be happy with sex once a week (given that it used to be only every 3 weeks). I'm not though, because he turns me down so often, expects me to do the work being on top about 70% of the time, and he restricts our sex life to late at night in the dark, much later than I like to stay up.
He never tells me I'm pretty or flirts with me (he will yell out a sexy proposition if he happens to drive by me when I'm out running or flirt with me at the airport when I'm leaving on a business trip, but when I get home, nothing.) He might say 'I love you' a couple times a year, and never wants to go out with me. In 15 years since we had kids, we've never even gone out to dinner or to a movie alone, only with kids or friends or extended family.
We get along pretty well, no big conflicts, no 'rough patches' or drama in our marriage, and we usually agree on most things. Neither one of us has a temper or says hurtful things (except that he is brutally honest about what he likes and doesn't and would never tell a white lie).
Our anniversary fell on a Saturday a couple weeks ago and I dragged him out to a restaurant. He just complained about the menu and said 'You know I don't like going out to eat'. Then he said he just doesn't like celebrating holidays like Valentine's or anniversaries because it feels like he is 'expected to act a certain way'. The sex that night felt like duty sex. It's always been like this, we never went on a honeymoon because he said he didn't want to go on a trip right away, "We'd go on other trips later" (but we never did go anywhere without the kids.)
For years, I maintained a good mood by focusing on my kids. They gave me plenty of touch and affection when they were small. Now the youngest is 10, and they aren't in my arms or lap anymore and they don't need as much of my time or attention.
This year I've started trying to 'rekindle' my marriage, wearing new nicer outfits, trying new sexual positions/rooms, initiating, more kisses good morning, good night, more hugs. Mostly it hasn't made much difference and there have been many awkward failures when he doesn't like what I've tried or suggested. He will hug me back and initiates pecks good morning and good night nowadays (which is progress compared to the last few years), but he still treats me mostly like a roommate.
I know there's no OW (he works at home on our property and barely touches his computer or phone). He is self-employed so doesn't have external work stress. He is very fit and healthy and runs every day for exercise, and has a great diet.
I'm not unattractive (still a size 4 with pretty long hair). However, I think I am boring to him.
He won't even watch TV with me, and even if he would, he has to sit alone in his recliner. We go on trips as a family and do things like hiking as a family, but nothing just the two of us. If I suggest a 'date night' or doing something alone, he is very uncomfortable and says he doesn't want to. I can't even remember doing anything alone with him in years except driving to school events or going to the hardware store.
His love language to me is 'acts of service'. He does lots of favors for me, cooks my favorite dinners, builds things for me in the garden, improves rooms just for me. He is so busy with household projects he rarely ever sits down (so I can't just sit down next to him). He does so much for the kids too. One other really nice thing he does is give me advice - I don't ask that often but whenever I have a problem, he is great at giving me wise advice. He is my rock in so many ways.
I know he 'loves' me in the same way he loves our kids and he wouldn't want a divorce. It seems like ideally he'd like to stay with me long-term sort of as non-passionate friends with occasional benefits. He is amazing in so many ways, especially as a dad, and everyone thinks I'm so lucky to be married to him. So do I in most ways, but I feel like my love and passion for him is unrequited, and that he just 'isn't that into me'.
Does anyone have any advice for me? I don't know how I could 'woman up' in any way that would make a difference. Dressing up has no effect. I'm already thin and fit. I never criticize, nag, yell, or tell him what to do - he is the leader in our family and I have the utmost respect for him (because he always does the right thing in all areas except for not showing love/affection). I have my own hobbies and when I've been really busy with them or the kids, it doesn't bother him one bit. I've gone for some years hardly touching him and it is just fine with him. I do not go out to socialize with friends or anybody very much (mostly because I work full time and want to be with my kids), and I know that's one area I need to work on. I go to various types of shows with my kids, but I will need to make more friends as they get older and leave home. I do exercise a few times a week, but I know it would be better if I did it every day, especially cardio to improve my mood.
My H said he probably wouldn't ever be willing to go to marriage counseling. He wants me to accept him as he is and not try to change him (note that I didn't do anything to try to change him for many years, so that can't be the initial problem).
His testosterone is low and I'd like him to do something about that, but he doesn't seem willing to go on therapy. I think it would help our sex life if he did, but I don't think testosterone alone would make him want to go out on 'date nights' or spend quality alone time with me.
I just feel lonely and like my life is going to be 'blah' and even more lonely after my children leave home. I often feel ugly and awkward since he obviously feels only 'meh' about me (although when I look in the mirror, I think I look pretty good). If nothing ever changes, I'll have to rely on girl friends for any affection or social life. I hate the idea of divorcing but lately I've started wondering what that would be like, whether it would be a good idea or bad. I wouldn't consider leaving until our kids all leave for college (about 6 years from now).
I was dealing a lot better emotionally in this situation when I wasn't 'trying things' to rekindle or improve our marriage. The trying and not having much success is just embarrassing and frustrating, and I'm starting to feel depressed.