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TL/DR - You won the battle but are losing the war. Negotiated sex rarely if ever yields desire. You want to show her love through passionate sex and she either does love you that way but doesn’t want to or she just doesn’t feel that way anymore and is doing it out of obligation. In the long-run it will destroy you emotionally so seek IC.

Would we be right in assuming that somewhere in the past you had a “spirited discussion” about your sex life and you came to some sort of agreement.

A couple of thoughts...

1. Looks like you negotiated twice-weekly intercourse. Not sex, not love making... intercourse. She really doesn’t want to but it is doing it out of obligation. The “contract” is you have but she sets the terms. As long as she doesn’t say no, she has the moral high ground and you have no reason to complain.

2. Once kids came along, my wife’s take of sex changed. Suddenly it was crude and something to be kept in a box that only comes out when conditions are right. If kids discovered their parents have sex it would be like metaphysical disaster. It’s like there’s some sort of shame in there. No more seducing, lingerie, sex “for sport” just another urge to be dealt with. Parents are just not supposed to sexual.

3. The abuse thing is real. Took 17 years for my wife to admit to a sexually traumatic event as a pre-teen when she had a panic attack mid-intercourse just because I said “it’d be nice if you gave me some attention for once.” To this day, and she will never admit it, really doesn’t like touching me sexually. She does it because that’s the cost of business but not thing she looks forward to. Sex is always a joint-thing. By that I mean, out of obligation, once a year she will surprise me and get me off with a manually or orally without her wanting and always tied to a birthday or Father’s Day. The healthy mindset is knowing your partner can only get pleasure and desire from you and you crave to give that to them. Abuse survivors equate pleasuring a partner with negative feelings.

4. Could be she has an avoidant personality. My wife does not like flirting, massage, making out, cuddling post-sex, talking about sex, being sexually aggressive, dressing up, fantasies, etc. At one point I told it her feels like Ike she just wants to get off. Once she climaxes first, it’s like watching someone anxious to flee a crime scene but knows they can’t leave their partner behind.

5. WRT to eye closing, most do this to focus as a fleeting thought about what you forgot to get a Target will ruin an orgasm. And a lot just aren’t turned on by seeing their partner naked.

6. Honestly, for some women sex just doesn’t mean the same as it does to a guy. And many wrongly think it’s solely about ejaculation. It’s how guys express love and feelings... it’s how we show passion. I think this is foreign to most women unless their partners are the ones not interested in sex. But one partner is put in an awful position. “I have no sexual desire for you, don’t want your expression of desire for me and oh BTW don’t you dare look for that somewhere else or I will burn you life to the ground.”

7. At her age, peri-menopause could be a factor. And could be she’s just not into that way anymore and that part of her life is over.

8. She does have an obligation to find her desire and not just go through the motions.

9. You can’t discount the kids and craziness of life but in my experience, some women emotionally prefer being moms more than being wives let alone girlfriends. They control the intimacy and vulnerability.

There probably is another side of the story and I think MC might help. Again, my wife had no idea what sex meant to me. She just went by what society. Getting negotiated sex can actually be worse and builds resentment. The message she needs to hear is that while she thinks what she’s doing is love is really obligation and a wife showing no passion makes a man feel like just a family member. Long-term its dangerous in a marriage to communicate the message of “I feel that way about you... just don’t make me show it.”

WRT to what you can do? I would look to move away from negotiated sex as you are really trying to negotiate desire which never works... ever. Your wife just has to have sex, she doesn’t have to get anything out of it. She’s doing it out of obligation. You want her to enjoy sex but just having sex is her limit. I would start IC, tell her you are and start working on yourself because this is the long-term and you need to get your head around it. Then after a few sessions I would be honest and say you appreciate sex but don’t feel emotionally-connected because of all the rules, boundaries and negative feelings. But she also needs to realize the effect her trauma is having on you and what you are not getting through no fault of your own.


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Ok so you say you want to increase intimacy. You know you can do that without sex right? Yea 4 boys home all the time has got to make her paranoid that you guys will be heard.

You can hold hands, snuggle while watching tv. cuddle at night, talk.
 

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I think 90% of this, including the OCD, can be linked back to the sexual abuse she experienced as a teen.

Has she ever had any treatment or talked to anyone about it?
 

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Discussion Starter #24
Hi all,
Thanks for all the great feedback!

aaarghdub - I appreciate the detailed response. It has been a while since we had a real chat about our relationship - it is time for another one to get her perspective on how things are going. I am also going to look into IC. When our relationship was in a tough spot, I was actively looking for IC and my wife was pretty upset about the idea. She would not entertain couples counseling and I felt she would have a bit of resentment if I went. I need to do me though.

Anastasia6 - I agree! We are both fairly affectionate people. We hold hands a lot and the family has been doing a lot of TV nights together with the quarantine. Back when we were dating, we used to cuddle a lot and we both loved it. Now she does not like it much as it make her too hot. No arms around each other during TV, no cuddling, I can't really touch her when in bed or she complains it raises her body temp too much. I really do get more sense of intamacy if we hold each other for a long time but we don't do that anymore -- we have not for a long, long time.

frusdil - We only talked about it a few times when we first started dating. She never had treatment for it and I don't think she ever will. We did try couples counseling about 3 years into our marriage when things were bad. After a few sessions she felt the counselor was "siding with me". We then tried IC. She did it for about 2 sessions and I stuck with it for about a year.

Not and Livvie - good catch, it is a retroverted not introverted uterus. I think it is getting better as she has not complained in a while. I used to have to be very gentle and hold back a bit but in the past year she seems more comfortable. I am going to try to see if we can a few other positions and spice it up again.

Aine - I would love to take back control! She is not a big fan of this as she likes/has to be in control of nearly everything. I may just try it though and see what happens. I love taking risks :) What is the worst that can happen?

Girl_power -
Have you ever tried joining her when she showers? Once or twice

Does she refuse when you initiate? We sort of have a groove where she always initiates. She knows I am ready anytime/anywhere. I would have sex 2X a day if she wanted to. So we let her control the tempo. A few times when I am really horny and want to be with her and not just take care of myself, I will initiate and she is usually open.

How does she like you to initiate? We just straight out ask each other for "closet time"

She seems to like to give more than receive, so does she like a dominant man to tell her what to do? This is an interesting question as I don't think it is as simple as it seems on the surface. She does not like dominant men in general. She always likes the nice guy. With the OCD, she feels she needs to be in control of everything inside and outside the bedroom. That said, I always wonder if she does not even know what turns her on and maybe if I took more control she would like it. She likes books like Twilight, and other books where the guys is a bit obsessive, brooding, and controlling. She also like books where the girl is the bad ass protagonist.

Has she ever liked to receive oral sex? She used to let me give her oral and she climaxed maybe 1 out of 20 times. It would take 20+ minutes. Most of the time she would get close but not over the edge and it would just really, really frustrate her. I think that is why she does not like it. She would prefer to not even get close to climax and avoid the frustration. If she does get really horny during sex, she will spend another 30 mins or so in the close with her toys.

What other positions were successful in the past? None really. Her on top is fun but she has body image issues and she is sensitive to being vertical vs laying down. Most other positions like Doggy, sideways, etc have typically been too painful for her.

I am going to start to look for a counselor once things settle down with COVID. I hope to have some deep conversations in the meantime.

Thanks again for the feedback - keep it coming!
 

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Discussion Starter #25 (Edited)
Good morning ladies!

I apologize in advance for the long update here, it is story time.

Last night my wife and I had a typical argument and I thought I would share how it went down to shed light on the dynamics in our relationship. As I mentioned before, my wife has mild OCD and likes to be in control. She likes everyone around her (mainly the kids and I) to live their lives around a set of rules. I could probably fill up a book with them. By contrast, I live my life around broad principles and values and as long as the behaviors of myself and the people around me are generally moving me in that direction, life is good.

That brings us to last night. My wife’s parents have been taking the kids every Friday night lately so we get some time for us. This time, I take the initiative and ask her if we want to have some “play time.” She graciously says she would rather wait until Saturday but she could give my a handy. I accept 😊. We make our way to the pleasure room (closet) and my wife looks for the lube and it is not in its usual place. I had left it in the toilet room from the last time I used it. Rule #568,898: Jason shall not masturbate while on the toilet – only in the shower (more on why later). As is typical with most of the rules, I take responsibility if I break them (after much huffing and consternation). It really is my bad if I originally agree to them and break them. It does have the appearance of sneakiness – which my wife detests. I have also had a history of not being totally honest with every detail (I could write another update on that). I have been trying over the last several months to be a completely open book, even with the little stuff and if it makes us uncomfortable in the moment. I have been pretty successful in that effort. I have been pushing back on the “rules” that seem unreasonable in my judgement. Back to rule #568,898 (being facetious here 😉); the other day I had already showered and did not take that opportunity to relieve myself. So I knowingly decide to break the rule, and, being the do-what-I-want kind of guy, I did my thing in the bathroom. Flash forward to last night, my wife blows up and throws a heavy guilt trip. I proceed to blow up, we return to our corners and sulk. Strangely enough, we make up fairly quickly and she offers to give me a hand. Only after some forced apologies before and after the deed.

The good news is that I stood my ground and decided this rule was unreasonable. The trouble with the rules is that many of them I struggle with the logic. That means it is hard for me to remember them if they don’t come naturally or are counter-intuitive. I will admit that I am quite the math geek so logical rules come easy to me and they stick in my head. These are different. Granted, I chose to originally accept this rule and chose to break it. Her reasoning is actually a bit logical in this case – she does not want me to make a mess with my “stuff” and there has been an instance or two where some dripped on the floor and I missed it during clean up. I stood my ground on this one last night. I suggested that I could do my business in another bathroom and take over responsibility for cleaning the bathroom on a regular basis. Eventually we agreed that if I can keep it spotless then I can do my thing in our bathroom but if she ever found evidence, I am relegated back to the shower.

I know in the big game of life, this is definitely part of the small stuff. But this is just one example of many that play a part in our relationship regarding rules and boundaries my wife sets. We are so different in this respect. I have two principles that drive every decision I make:
  1. Does it increase intimacy or is it fun for my wife and I, or
  2. Is it something that is going to make us and our kids proud on our death bed
Beyond that, I can’t think of one "rule" I have made for my wife. On the other hand, I have to wrap my head into a pretzel through a 6-dimensional chess game when I am going about my daily tasks to think if I am doing something that my wife would not approve.

Yes, I need to go to individual counseling, I know 😊

Thanks for listening.
 

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On the flip side. You agreed to something and then broke the your agreement.
it is good that you now are expressing your feelings and getting what you perceive you need. But not keeping your word no matter how trivial you think the matter is can be damaging.

Stop lying to her. If you disagree with something then disagree. Don't lie.

Do you lie to her often? Does she catch you in these 'white' lies often. This would build resentment and mistrust for me.
 

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Discussion Starter #28
Do you lie to her often? Does she catch you in these 'white' lies often. This would build resentment and mistrust for me.
I am as honest a person you can be. That said, there are two situations I lied to her. I cheated on her a couple months after we started dating (about 27 years ago). To this day, that is still the one regret I have and I wish every day I could take that back. I told her the next day and I have been trying to earn her trust back every day since. The other time is when her OCD was bad and she wanted me to spend several hours checking the house. At the time, I thought I was showing her love by enabling her. I was wrong and we are better now. However, there were several times when I would just pretend I was checking the house. That stuff is behind us now.

I think the issue is more about commitments I make. In the past, I would agree with most of her requests she made with regards to changes in my behavior. They were mostly around keeping the house clean and safe. Most of them I know we're unreasonable but I agreed. I have been working on renegotiating most of those over time. While I don't consider renegotiating prior agreements a lie, I can see her feeling resentment from the changes.

Thanks again for the feedback. I do think trust is an underlying issue and I will be sure to keep that in the front of my thoughts.
 

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I think the issue is more about commitments I make. In the past, I would agree with most of her requests she made with regards to changes in my behavior. They were mostly around keeping the house clean and safe. Most of them I know we're unreasonable but I agreed. I have been working on renegotiating most of those over time. While I don't consider renegotiating prior agreements a lie, I can see her feeling resentment from the changes.

Thanks again for the feedback. I do think trust is an underlying issue and I will be sure to keep that in the front of my thoughts.
Renegotiating happens prior to breaking agreements. You used lube in the bathroom BEFORE talking with her about appropriate new boundaries. That is still you breaking your word. The resentment for me would come from the lying not the renegotiations.
 

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Discussion Starter #30
Renegotiating happens prior to breaking agreements. You used lube in the bathroom BEFORE talking with her about appropriate new boundaries. That is still you breaking your word. The resentment for me would come from the lying not the renegotiations.
Agreed
 

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Discussion Starter #31
This is kind of off topic, but given trust is associated with our level intimacy, what would you ladies expect in cases where your man forgets some of the little things. For example, my wife is very particular when it comes to cleanliness. Here are a few examples:
  • shoes must come off upon entry, we need to step on the designated "dirty" tiles and avoid the "clean" ones unti we wash our feet
  • no using hands to get ice, must use a cup
  • wash hands for no less than 20 seconds
There are many, many other preferences like these just in the cleanliness department. Sometimes I forget a rule or two throughout the day. In the spirit of 100% honesty, do I do a mental inventory at the end of the day and let her know the mistakes I made?


I actually don't mind some of these rules but some of them I struggle to make a habit.

At the end of the day, I just want us to be as close as possible and I find sometimes the "rules" create tension, resentment and distance on both sides. It is difficult to strike a balance.
 

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It all sounds more than constraining and I would not be able to live like that. For real. Express train to out of the marriage.

You asked the females their thoughts.

It's impossible to answer because your wife has you in a CAGE of rules and I can't even fathom doing that to another person.

Even the way you asked the question...I think your mental health has broken down living in this kind of environment.
 

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Discussion Starter #33
It is impossible to answer because your wife has you in a CAGE of rules and I can't even fathom doing that to another person.
Thanks for the response Livvie. I do think things have improved dramatically from the worst and I am 100% confident we will find a solution to our problems and things will get better each day. I mainly want to set some goals to stay focused on to continue improvement. I know setting boundaries, expectations and complete honesty are likely the primary objectives.

It also helps to get different perspectives here. My mental health definitely went through the ringer for several years and it is hard to rationalize what is reasonable anymore.
 

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  • shoes must come off upon entry, we need to step on the designated "dirty" tiles and avoid the "clean" ones unti we wash our feet
At the end of the day, I just want us to be as close as possible and I find sometimes the "rules" create tension, resentment and distance on both sides. It is difficult to strike a balance.
Oh my! I have so many thoughts swimming around.
I can not say enough how much I LOVE this community. WOW
I have seen myself, and my husband, throughout this thread.

I can be... high demanding. I know I can. Its something I REALLY try to balance. I was sexually abused as a child, physically and those always come with pure neglect. I have been and can me a hot mess. I def. have OCD at some level, and have dealt with anxiety and depression my whole life!

With that said, I had laugh a bit when I read "shoes must come off..." I have these "rules" but mines a little lighter.
I have a basket by the back door, I just traded it, per request, to a shoe shelf... no biggie, done. But I want people to put shoes the basket, or now on the shelf. Walk where you want, but I don't want to trip over shoes or look at 10 pairs onto floor. In my opinion, thats balance. But thats just my opinion ;)

You opening paragraph to the original post give me hope!! I couldn't imagine having sex every week! Hell, I would take twice a month.

This isn't about me, so I am not going to start adding about me, I would get too winded. But all I can say is, love her through her struggles (which it is obvious you do) but also you have rights, feeling and needs. Maybe "strike a new bargain". You get a few days a month that you choose where, how, etc. If the closet is needed, maybe a new position. There are many different positions. I have had uterine issues my whole marriage, which has given us some.. well, issues. But I was always willing to try this or that. Now 5 pregnancies later, I also have a dropped uterus. Thats not fun and makes for discomfort if we aren't careful. If I am really aroused, pleasure will overcome displeasure pretty fast. Maybe find a foreplay that excites her and suggest a new position.

Im new here, I dont know your history, This advice may not apply! I just wanted so share something thats worked for me :)
 

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Discussion Starter #35 (Edited)
Im new here, I dont know your history, This advice may not apply! I just wanted so share something thats worked for me :)
Hi Mary! I'd love to hear more about your marriage and how you find a way to strike a balance with your husband. It is impossible for me to share my wife's perspective and I am most certainly biased in how I present our relationship. My wife probably thinks I am a horny slob and I see her as a controlling prude at times. The reality exists somewhere in the middle.

My wife was diagnosed with OCD soon after married, but I knew about a year after we started dating. She saw a therapist for a year and was on medication that turned her into a zombie. She quit the meds and we worked through it together and she successful manages the intruding thoughts but I know she still struggles internally. Our marriage was sexless for about 10 years. We had great sex the first year. It came to almost an immediate stop when the OCD flared up. We did not have sex again until about 2 years after we married, she knew I was ready for divorce at that point. We are a million times better now but still have a lot of work to do.

My gut is there are a few main problems today:
  • She needs to be in control of most everything. This gets in the way of her being able to let go and enjoy sex.
  • I am a more happy go lucky and passive person. My gut is she subconsciously wants me to be more assertive in bed, despite what she says to the contrary. Given our respective personalities, I struggle to push the boundaries with sex.
  • I think there are still trust issues she has with me.
There may be another issue that puts some distance between us. My wife is much more strict with the kids. It takes a lot to annoy me and even then, my response to the kids tends to be pretty restrained. My wife has much less patience most of the time will end up yelling at the kids. She probably yells at them a couple times a day. I have raised my voice with my 4 boys less than 10 times in my life. She feels guilty because she becomes the bad guy to the kids and she want me to step up my game. I feel that if I get to her level we will both be yelling at the kids - crushing their soul. The rational thing would seem to be that I become the disciplinarian and she lets me take over but I don't always pick up when she is about to lose patience and explode. I think this dynamic hampers the sex and intimacy levels.
 

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My gut is there are a few main problems today:
  • She needs to be in control of most everything. This gets in the way of her being able to let go and enjoy sex.
  • I am a more happy go lucky and passive person. My gut is she subconsciously wants me to be more assertive in bed, despite what she says to the contrary. Given our respective personalities, I struggle to push the boundaries with sex.
  • I think there are still trust issues she has with me.
This is what survivors of abuse or trauma want... control. They lost it as part of the trauma and wish to retain every possible defense to guard against vulnerability. I’m just like you... laid back... not wrapped up having my way. But here’s the construct I find myself in...

Due to my wife’s family-of-origin issues and string of various traumas, her comfort zone is the size of a baseball where mine is the size of one of those huge workout (Swiss) balls you see at the gym. Most of the things I want/need/desire/deal with reside outside her baseball (road biking, germs, sex talk) so I am confined to the baseball. While at the same time, she enjoys that I freely and lovingly operate outside the baseball but inside the Swiss Ball. If she can’t or doesn’t know how to do something, she just has to ask; regardless of how dirty, time consuming, technical. She’s spoiled by the fact that I’ll just figure it out and make it happen with her doing very little. Change the brakes and rotors... sure. Replumb, expand and install a new shower enclosure sure. Install new floors... sure. Always know where I’m going.. yep. Does it matter if I have ever done anything like that before... no... I have to teach myself. You get the idea. Now I can in NO WAY drop anything complicated on her and just tell her to figure out it. Due to such low self-esteem, the cost of embarrassment or failure is soooo great she’d rather pawn it off or drop it. Most “us” projects end up being “me” projects. She shows up for the shopping and at the most any painting. Other than that she tells me “have fun.” If she wanted a new light fixture I said hmm “have fun installing it” it would sit in the box in the garage indefinitely. She would not choose to teach herself how to do it. And she justifies this because “I like to do these things” so it’s really not an imposition or “that’s a guy thing.”

Now as for me, I can’t even ask for the basics like seduce me, wear something flattering, show some confidence, embrace your sexiness, take constructive criticism, love me how I need to be loved or even run to Home Depot and get me insert tool/part here. She is scared of looking like a fool so she puts up a wall.

Taking it every further, fighting/conflict means divorce which is what she grew up so she’s put in the minimum (within the baseball) to avoid the fight and maintain the high ground in a fight. Now when she does have to fight, her communication style is “win at all costs” in order to preserve the baseball.

My point is that, like you, your wife’s comfort zone is so small and she relies on you to do everything outside of hers. It’s sucks because you will never, ever get what you need because that means leaving the baseball. Our MC told me it is a form of emotional abuse in that they will use shame or other defense mechanisms to invalidate your needs to prevent operating outside said baseball. This is part and parcel of an avoidant attachment style or avoidance personality disorder which I’m sure my wife has. Will my wife make love to me... nope... but she can damn sure get off in about 2 minutes and move on to something else less vulnerable. She can minimize the vulnerability while gaining the ability to say “we have a great sex life.” She says its very emotional and not about getting off but her body language says otherwise.

Sorry to say but without any buy-in from your wife you are slowly drifting apart. I know we are. And it’s her choice because instead of her growing her comfort zone you choose to operate less and less in hers in order to preserve the “ability to breathe” in life. My wife has big dreams for retirement, big house, vacation home, travel, lots of grandkids. Guess what... who’s doing the work and providing the financial capital to make this happen.... you guessed it. She says we need to start planning. I plan to flat our tell I have no interest in planning the future as we’re living it now. Only difference will be more gray hair, wrinkles, more money, no grandkids to focus on and still the same emotional distancing.




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@hubby She was your first... what was her past? You mention sexual abuse as a teenager. What was the extent and how did she deal with it? Are you confident she's been an open book about her past, or is that something she's kept private? Is it possible her narrative was false and that she saw you as a chance to escape from a lifestyle she didn't like? What type of therapy has she had so far?

Lots of questions, I know. But it is so bizarre to think things from a very distant past can really wreck the present. But they assuredly can.
 

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Discussion Starter #38
This is what survivors of abuse or trauma want... control. They lost it as part of the trauma and wish to retain every possible defense to guard against vulnerability. I’m just like you... laid back... not wrapped up having my way. But here’s the construct I find myself in...
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Thanks for the background. There are a lot of similarities to our stories. I would say my comfort zone is pretty much limitless and my curiosity makes me crave new adventures and learn new things. My wife is odd in this respect. She also is curious, loves to travel and try new things. At the same time, she needs to be in control of her surroundings. She needs to plan everything out to the last detail and gets uncomfortable if we deviate from the plan to much. She detests surprises. I love a good surprised. It is odd.
 

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Discussion Starter #39 (Edited)
@hubby She was your first... what was her past?
She was my first. I was raised Catholic and went to youth groups thru my first year of College. In retrospect, I think that did our marriage a disservice.

She had three partners before me.

@hubby You mention sexual abuse as a teenager. What was the extent and how did she deal with it?
We only talked about it a few times and she never went into detail. I am not sure the age and it was a single occurrence. I think I am the only person she talked to about it.

@hubby Are you confident she's been an open book about her past, or is that something she's kept private?
She is a very honest person and I have no reason to think she is hiding anything from me. We went to the same high school and we had mutual friends. She always seemed like the good girl. Her parents were pretty strict. Not a big partier. She was valedictorian of her high school and top of her college graduating class.

@hubby Is it possible her narrative was false and that she saw you as a chance to escape from a lifestyle she didn't like?
Anything is possible, but not likely. My best friend knew her pretty well in high school and he was my best man at the wedding. He never raised any red flags.

@hubby What type of therapy has she had so far?
She had about 6 months IC for her OCD after we got married. We had a few MC sessions together before it got too intense for her.
 

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Hi Mary! I'd love to hear more about your marriage and how you find a way to strike a balance with your husband. It is impossible for me to share my wife's perspective and I am most certainly biased in how I present our relationship. My wife probably thinks I am a horny slob and I see her as a controlling prude at times. The reality exists somewhere in the middle.

My wife was diagnosed with OCD soon after married, but I knew about a year after we started dating. She saw a therapist for a year and was on medication that turned her into a zombie. She quit the meds and we worked through it together and she successful manages the intruding thoughts but I know she still struggles internally. Our marriage was sexless for about 10 years. We had great sex the first year. It came to almost an immediate stop when the OCD flared up. We did not have sex again until about 2 years after we married, she knew I was ready for divorce at that point. We are a million times better now but still have a lot of work to do.

My gut is there are a few main problems today:
  • She needs to be in control of most everything. This gets in the way of her being able to let go and enjoy sex.
  • I am a more happy go lucky and passive person. My gut is she subconsciously wants me to be more assertive in bed, despite what she says to the contrary. Given our respective personalities, I struggle to push the boundaries with sex.
  • I think there are still trust issues she has with me.
There may be another issue that puts some distance between us. My wife is much more strict with the kids. It takes a lot to annoy me and even then, my response to the kids tends to be pretty restrained. My wife has much less patience most of the time will end up yelling at the kids. She probably yells at them a couple times a day. I have raised my voice with my 4 boys less than 10 times in my life. She feels guilty because she becomes the bad guy to the kids and she want me to step up my game. I feel that if I get to her level we will both be yelling at the kids - crushing their soul. The rational thing would seem to be that I become the disciplinarian and she lets me take over but I don't always pick up when she is about to lose patience and explode. I think this dynamic hampers the sex and intimacy levels.
Sorry, my husband is home this weekend, and he has been working most Saturdays. I am not going to be on here much this weekend since he's home.
For now, I need this forum to be a me thing. I will one day tell him, but I need this and I dont want share it with him right now.

I am not sure where to start responding to this thread. wow. So many thoughts.
I will get back to this tomorrow :)
 
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