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Going to dinner with your husband is not following the 180.

I've been thinking about your son. I hope that doesn't sound weird. I'm a stranger on the internet. But I truly hope he is getting better each day. He is lucky to have such a great mother.
 

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Whose idea was it to close the marriage? If it was yours, do you think he prefers it to be open? If it was his, do you think he wonders if you’d still prefer an open marriage?

The reason posters suggest cheating is because that’s very often the answer to changes in a spouse. I still think it’s a possibility but it’s obviously not the only reason people change. Sometimes relationships just have an end date. What you once loved is not what you love now. Unfortunately, he’s the only one who knows what’s going on and he’s not talking. I drove myself crazy questioning every detail of my life when my husband was cheating. Sometimes there are just no answers — at least none that make sense to the spouse. Hang in there. I know this is tough.
 

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Why am I here on this site? To try and gain insight, advice, moral support etc.

Let's be honest here, if my marriage was in a good spot I wouldn't be here, which means for 24 years, through all the ups and downs, it never got to this point to where I was at a real loss for how to deal. That means, that I was content and happy for most of 24 years with some tough patches, but those were and seemed manageable and something we could work through.

For 24 years, I have been one of this man's most favorite people, needed, wanted, desired, complimented, given lavish gifts, a trusted business partner, encouraged and admired by him etc. Right now you are only getting one tiny view of him and our marriage, not the whole story. I wouldn't be trying to be patient if I didn't think I had something worth fighting for.

That's why I am here, on this site.
That's why I am not ready to snoop and may never snoop.
That's why I am not sure cheating is a deal breaker.
I am at 24 years too. I completely understand the “long game” approach. I am taking it as well. I have not updated my thread yet because it is still too early to determine where things are going, although based on last night, I like my chances. Our problem was (in its simplest form) a true lack of emotional connection, which led to a very terrible sex life (in a nut shell). I came here, like you, four years ago semi desperate - the only difference is I took everyone’s suggestions to heart and really acted on them.

One question I have — were you all swingers at an earlier stage? Don’t be surprised if he comes out as bi or something down the road is my hunch. Sounds like you are willing to have an open marriage too?
 

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I thought about this. But he said there was nothing I could do to "fix" what was wrong right now.
Is there a way to tell if my car has a tracking device on it? Since we quit location sharing on our phones and he said he didn't need to know my location, AND THIS IS REALLY opposite from who he normally is, I was wondering if he already has a tracker on the car.
He may not care where you are because he is done with the marriage but too chicken to exit. Or he's having an affair so you are no longer the woman he's worried about someone else having sex with.

It's the old I love you but not in love with you. And there is nothing you can change because we don't usually know what makes us fall in love. Once someone is done and turned off that switch it can be hard for it to turn on again. Especially if there is someone else involved even if that is an emotional or hopeful involvement.
 

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Yep, and once you allow anyone to think for a minute they can disrespect you and have little or no consequences ...they tend to think you’re ok with that level of disrespect.

a better approach is to address the change and make sure he knows it’s unacceptable and must stop if you are expected to move forward in the marriage.

stand up for yourself and what’s right! Start having a voice and speaking your truth! It’s perfectly expected to say to him “the way you’ve been treating me has changed and I don’t like it a bit! And I expect you to treat me with kindness and love!” Then I’d add - “now what’s going on with you that caused you to be so grumpy to me?”

start asking!
 

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Discussion Starter #248
Going to dinner with your husband is not following the 180.

I've been thinking about your son. I hope that doesn't sound weird. I'm a stranger on the internet. But I truly hope he is getting better each day. He is lucky to have such a great mother.
Thank you, he's supposed to come home today. My daughter helped me cleaned his room and got him a new bed set (the washer is broken of all times) and we pampered his hamster with a clean cage and fun treats. The facility is making sure he's got appointments lined up with his therapist (who's been texting me) and his psychiatrist. I'm just scared that he won't follow the plan. He's almost 22, so I can't really force him to take his meds. I was told I would be given lots of instructions when we pick him up.
 

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Discussion Starter #249
I am at 24 years too. I completely understand the “long game” approach. I am taking it as well. I have not updated my thread yet because it is still too early to determine where things are going, although based on last night, I like my chances. Our problem was (in its simplest form) a true lack of emotional connection, which led to a very terrible sex life (in a nut shell). I came here, like you, four years ago semi desperate - the only difference is I took everyone’s suggestions to heart and really acted on them.

One question I have — were you all swingers at an earlier stage? Don’t be surprised if he comes out as bi or something down the road is my hunch. Sounds like you are willing to have an open marriage too?
I'll go back and read your thread this weekend. I have a feeling I will have a lot of "alone" time.

I guess you could say we were swingers. If anyone leans towards being bi, it would be me and he knows this, and if he came out and said he thought he was too, I don't think that would be an issue we couldn't work with considering ALL we have already conquered. It's been about 10 years since we had an open marriage.
 

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Discussion Starter #250
He may not care where you are because he is done with the marriage but too chicken to exit. Or he's having an affair so you are no longer the woman he's worried about someone else having sex with.

It's the old I love you but not in love with you. And there is nothing you can change because we don't usually know what makes us fall in love. Once someone is done and turned off that switch it can be hard for it to turn on again. Especially if there is someone else involved even if that is an emotional or hopeful involvement.

I think you may have hit the nail on the head. #1. Too chicken. or #2. There is at least an emotional or hopeful involvement. In one of our very brief and unsatisfying "talks" I reminded him that even though his first marriage had been on the rocks for quite some time, he didn't actually LEAVE until I came along, he had said that I gave him hope that he could be happy again. He tried to argue that fact, but I cut him off because he was trying to avoid answering my question "Are you interested in someone else." Now I wish I had let him continue talking.

Oh well.
 

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Discussion Starter #251
Yep, and once you allow anyone to think for a minute they can disrespect you and have little or no consequences ...they tend to think you’re ok with that level of disrespect.

a better approach is to address the change and make sure he knows it’s unacceptable and must stop if you are expected to move forward in the marriage.

stand up for yourself and what’s right! Start having a voice and speaking your truth! It’s perfectly expected to say to him “the way you’ve been treating me has changed and I don’t like it a bit! And I expect you to treat me with kindness and love!” Then I’d add - “now what’s going on with you that caused you to be so grumpy to me?”

start asking!
I had a voice yesterday morning. I asked him to fix the washer. Then I came back and asked him if he would look at something in our son's room, and his answer was "aren't you capable of making that decision on your own?" I stomped out of the room and said over my shoulder, "I'm perfectly capable of all sorts of things without your help." and he could tell I was fed up. Went upstairs and I was stewing, I was going to give him a piece of my mind, went back down to actually do it, and he had totally backed down and was helpful and nice. In the past, if one of us gets worked up, so does the other one... Soooo....that sort of took the wind out of my sails. However, I do feel that I am on the verge, close to the edge of letting some stuff OUT.
 

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I care if he's tracking my car because how the hell can I be unpredictable and mysterious and vague if he knows exactly where I am all the time?

Also, we invited both.
If you want to know if there's a tracker in your car take it to the dealer service department and ask them to check the car for trackers.
 

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I think you may have hit the nail on the head. #1. Too chicken. or #2. There is at least an emotional or hopeful involvement. In one of our very brief and unsatisfying "talks" I reminded him that even though his first marriage had been on the rocks for quite some time, he didn't actually LEAVE until I came along, he had said that I gave him hope that he could be happy again. He tried to argue that fact, but I cut him off because he was trying to avoid answering my question "Are you interested in someone else." Now I wish I had let him continue talking.

Oh well.
Some men need the idea of someone, more or less, waiting in the wings in order to escape an unhappy marriage. It’s interesting he tried to avoid answering that question. He may not be cheating, yet, but that doesn’t mean he‘s not considering it. If he were not, the answer should have been an immediate “NO.” Trying to dodge the question says to me he has someone in mind. Hopefully, I’m wrong (I’d love to be).
 

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I agree he likely has someone in mind.
However, there is nothing wrong with having a boundary and a voice. Saying to him when he has an attitude “Lose the attitude” - that’s calling it what it is and puts a spotlight on HIS behavior. That’s a boundary designed for YOUR mental health.
 

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Discussion Starter #257
My son appears to be in a much better head space.
He's got follow up appointments with his therapist and psychiatrist. I know my husband is concerned, so at least there is that. Three of the kids plus an SO over for dinner. Not unpleasant.

Had a talk with my husband this morning when it all got to me and I was overwhelmed for about 30 minutes...crying....it happens.

AGAIN he said he didn't want to argue, but I've figured out it means, he doesn't want to feel guilty. I called him on it. He admitted he's irritated by me and sometimes "feelings change." OUCH again, nothing new. I asked him if he had a plan, he said no. I suggested that at some point, he might want to come up with one.

I asked him to look up male menopause. I asked him AGAIN about another woman in any way shape or form, again No. I suggested that he's given up on people before, just cut them out when it got too much and now I was one of them, and he agreed, perhaps yes, and I got MAD. He could see I was mad, and he said, "I didn't want to argue"
and I said to him.. I am getting ready to walk away. I am not arguing with you. I am responding. My feelings are hurt, I am allowed to have an emotional reaction but that does not mean I'm arguing. He acknowledged, and I walked away.

Oddly enough, the rest of the day he's been decent. Probably because the stress of "fixing" is off the table.

I get it.


I need to do more self evaluation and planning.
What do I really want?
What is my end goal?

Again, what do I want. I am in it to save my marriage, but also, I can't do that alone.

Am I ok being a roommate for a while for the sake of my son? YES.
Am I ok being a roommate for a while for the sake of our finances. YES.

Honestly, this is just so far outside of my wheelhouse....I have been#1 for EVER.
How am I now the enemy?

DAMN...this is a hard thing to swallow.

Thanks for listening....appreciate all of you.

I've got two workouts tomorrow
a late lunch with a close friend
attorney & hair appointment the next day followed by dinner w/ a friend.
Workout again on Friday....nieces and nephew visiting this weekend...

a husband who claims he's annoyed by me, but who wants to know why I am not watching "my show" right now as he heads off to bed.


this is confusing. LOL
 

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Well, the difficult truth is that you were No. 1 until you weren’t. That happens more than you might think, unfortunately. For some, love lasts forever but for others it doesn’t. He might not even know why (or, more likely, he does know and just “doesn’t want to argue”). I do think he’s telling the truth about not having a plan at this point.

Could he change his mind and fall back in love with you? Maybe but I wouldn’t really count on it. What could happen next is that some female may catch his attention and he‘ll find himself interested. He’ll tell himself it’s not cheating because he’s in a “bad marriage” and he’s already told you it’s not working and he just wants to be happy again. That’s one possibility. There are others.

He’s going to do what he wants to do so you need to do the same. Focus on you and what’s best for you. Ignore him for now because he obviously doesn’t want to discuss this. I know it’s tough but you’ll get through it.
 

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Glad to hear your son seems to be in a better place. Thank goodness.

What a rough conversation with your husband. And good for you for showing him your true emotions. You generally come across as "careful" when it comes to your husband and I get why but it's nice to see you telling him how you really feel-- that you're angry and you're allowed to be.

I know this is really hard. One foot in front of the other.
 
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