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Whelp, Is he good with tech? You can get some if not all of those messages back.


Angry fights over money and a girl are never good. Also, I don’t believe their contact went down at all. He’s covering his tracks.

Anyway, why waste your time? I understand it is hard, I broke up with a fiancé, but my life was better for it. If this is what you are fighting over before marriage, it isn’t going to get better. It is going to stay the same, which is intolerable by your own standards or get worse.

Also, before it comes up, marriage is about compromise. Still, not everything has a middle ground. My wife suggests swinging I am out, that’s not something I want to do. He wants girl friends and you see them as girlfriends, you do not need to compromise.
 

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Why is he still talking with Sally at all? And why is he concerned about buying her a birthday gift?

He is disrespecting you by maintaining any contact with this woman. The "friendship" was dysfunctional from the get go from the first time you met her.

A huge red flag was her asking you if you minded if he had female friends. When you said "No" her response was that she would mind. The reason she would mind is because she knows that he and she are doing inappropriate things, probably sex. She was hinting to you that their relationship isn't something that you should approve of.

He deleted everything because he didn't want you to see it, since you would have proof of what is actually going on.

Believe your gut. Your instincts are telling you the truth, just like everyone here knows that things aren't what they seem just based on what you have told us.

You have to decide how miserable you are willing to live. It is almost guaranteed that if you stay with him you will continue to be miserable about his relationship with Sally, and there will be others.

He is gaslighting you, which IMO can be worse than what he is actually hiding, because gaslighting is using your own mind and trusting nature against you.

You already told him how you feel, and he lied to you and went underground with it. Now what are you going to do?
 

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And stop calling him your husband, it cheapens the meaning.
She is using the letter 'H' in referring to him. She has said that they are saving/planning to get married.

That makes 'H', her fiancee, and Sally's fancy.

............................................................................

'H' is no KISA, he is player.
He wants you to think he is a pushover and nice.

Actually, he is a card shark.
He has two women fighting over him, and liking it.

We would not be surprised if he is getting intimate with Sally.
Or, envisions that happening.

Dump this charlatan.


THM-
 

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There is a difference between being controlling and being permissive.
There is a middle ground, and you have muddled it.



THRD-
 

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When being nice gets you knicked, you need to knuckle down and kick away.

Nice gals finish last, get laid flat, fast.



The Typist I-
 

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IMO this relationship with Sally has been going on a long time. Someone suggested DNA test for her dd.
Sounds reasonable, not sure how possible it is.
Im worried for you. I suspect hes a player and cheating.
There are people here who can advise you on how to find the truth.
My only concern is that you will have children and 10 years from now will find out the truth.
 

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@Catas1,

Did you grow up muslim? You said you have had a muslim ceremony, but you did not want your husband to get sally a gift of the same value that she gave him, and this became an argument between you. So im guessing that you did not grow up in a muslim culture, but he did?
 

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Discussion Starter #48
And stop calling him your husband, it cheapens the meaning.
He is my husband. We were both born and bought up as muslim, we've had our Muslim marriage ceremony, we said our vows and signed the marriage contract, so what would you have me call him?
 

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Yeah, i would say he needs to break off contact with her...
 

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Discussion Starter #50
@Catas1,

Did you grow up muslim? You said you have had a muslim ceremony, but you did not want your husband to get sally a gift of the same value that she gave him, and this became an argument between you. So im guessing that you did not grow up in a muslim culture, but he did?
No actually its the opposite, I grew up in a Muslim culture, he did too but only until around the age of 12. After that he never really had an adult figure in his life that followed muslim religion/culture so neither did he.

Sorry I dont know what I'm missing here.. I dont understand how this relates to the gift buying?
 

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Discussion Starter #51
A lot of you are suggesting he's having a physical affair. I have a few reasons to believe that he isn't having a physical affair... but an emotional affair could be possible. If thats the case then it means he's doing a real good job hiding everything from me. I mean I trusted him before but if he deleted the Facebook messages then what else is he deleting?? So I have no real proof and I dont know how I could now go about getting that proof. I already tried to see if there was a way I could retrieve his deleted facebook messages, I cant find a way that would definitely work and I would also need to have access to his phone for quite some time. Having said all of this I would prefer not to snoop, I'd rather just call him out on his behaviour and tell him why I feel hes been lying to me. But that means he could just continue lying.

I feel like I've been so naive and I really need to think things through and try and get two steps ahead of him before I confront him.
 

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No actually its the opposite, I grew up in a Muslim culture, he did too but only until around the age of 12. After that he never really had an adult figure in his life that followed muslim religion/culture so neither did he.

Sorry I dont know what I'm missing here.. I dont understand how this relates to the gift buying?
I had a friend who married a muslim man from syria. He was always big on reciprocity, which she didn't really understand at first. Whenever someone gave them gifts, he felt compelled to give one back.

He later went on to become an atheist, but he still always feels compelled get a gift for anyone who gives him one. She now knows that its just the way he was raised amd accepts it.

I was wondering if something like that was going on, but obviously not.
 

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Discussion Starter #53
I had a friend who married a muslim man from syria. He was always big on reciprocity, which she didn't really understand at first. Whenever someone gave them gifts, he felt compelled to give one back.

He later went on to become an atheist, but he still always feels compelled get a gift for anyone who gives him one. She now knows that its just the way he was raised amd accepts it.

I was wondering if something like that was going on, but obviously not.
Ah yes that's very true, I was bought up like that too. If I have the money, if I can afford it then I will reciprocate the gift to the same or similar amount. But I also understand that if I'm struggling for money then theres nothing wrong with lowering my budget for a gift. And no it's not a cultural thing for H. He's just overly generous like that. I had to explain the same thing to him when we were buying a bday present for my niece.
 

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He is my husband. We were both born and bought up as muslim, we've had our Muslim marriage ceremony, we said our vows and signed the marriage contract, so what would you have me call him?


It seems strange to me because you guys don’t act like your married. You guys don’t live together, and your having sleep overs with his girlfriend. It’s all strange to me.
 

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A lot of you are suggesting he's having a physical affair. I have a few reasons to believe that he isn't having a physical affair... but an emotional affair could be possible. If thats the case then it means he's doing a real good job hiding everything from me. I mean I trusted him before but if he deleted the Facebook messages then what else is he deleting?? So I have no real proof and I dont know how I could now go about getting that proof. I already tried to see if there was a way I could retrieve his deleted facebook messages, I cant find a way that would definitely work and I would also need to have access to his phone for quite some time. Having said all of this I would prefer not to snoop, I'd rather just call him out on his behaviour and tell him why I feel hes been lying to me. But that means he could just continue lying.

I feel like I've been so naive and I really need to think things through and try and get two steps ahead of him before I confront him.


It’s not about a physical affair, it’s his sneakynsss and dishonesty that is the problem. It’s disrespectful.
I was married to someone like that and there was no convincing him that his behavior was wrong, these people have a way of turning everything around on you.

It’s not normal to not trust your husband. It’s kit normal to hide things from each other. It’s not normal to feel like he is doing sneaky things behind your back. It’s not normal to have to be 2 steps ahead of your husband.
 

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I am well acquainted with the Muslim faith and also the attached cultural nuances for different regions - Meditteranean Middle East, Gulf Middle East, North Africa, Africa, Turkey, Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, India, Far East, Balkans, East Europe etc

All of them forbid friends of the opposite sex - especially if you are married.

I am not Muslim, but I do agree that opposite sex friends do not work over time. I have seen time and time again, an attraction form between the two regardless of religion or race.

I see that you are in the UK. Nothing to do with reciprocity, he should not be buying gifts for women - period. A £40 Harvey Nics voucher should be your decision not his. If anyone buys her a gift it should be you. Deep down I am sure you know that what I am saying is true.

He should not have ANY female close friends - the two of you together can have female close friends.

You are not crazy or paranoid. He needs to put an end to his pervy, scummy behaviour.

It sounds like he is a Muslim when it suits him (and to be honest I could almost say the same for you).
 

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If you are married to him by simply exchanging vows without witnesses, then, well, he likely is married to this other woman too.

If this is not tolerable to you, then, move on, end your relationship.

Personally, I think your "husband" is a player. He keeps a string of women going at the same time. He may not have been intimate with all of them, but he is working on it.

This idea that they are all just "friends" is nonsense.

I'm not totally rejecting the notion that men and women can be friends. However, the context of such friendships cannot ever be talking about sexual things.
 

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Discussion Starter #58
I am well acquainted with the Muslim faith and also the attached cultural nuances for different regions - Meditteranean Middle East, Gulf Middle East, North Africa, Africa, Turkey, Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, India, Far East, Balkans, East Europe etc

All of them forbid friends of the opposite sex - especially if you are married.

I am not Muslim, but I do agree that opposite sex friends do not work over time. I have seen time and time again, an attraction form between the two regardless of religion or race.

I see that you are in the UK. Nothing to do with reciprocity, he should not be buying gifts for women - period. A £40 Harvey Nics voucher should be your decision not his. If anyone buys her a gift it should be you. Deep down I am sure you know that what I am saying is true.

He should not have ANY female close friends - the two of you together can have female close friends.

You are not crazy or paranoid. He needs to put an end to his pervy, scummy behaviour.

It sounds like he is a Muslim when it suits him (and to be honest I could almost say the same for you).
I agree with most the points you made. And yes Islam forbids anyone from having friends of the opposite sex, whether you are married or not. Its not that we are Muslim when it suits us. We have our faith but we we're not practicing muslims. Hence I dont see an issue with having friends of the opposite sex, but I agree after marriage there has to boundaries with these sorts of friendships and they should become our friends, not just his.. which is the case with his other female friends. Just not with this one so called 'friend'.

And thank you. I feel that when it comes to buying gifts it should be a desicion we make together. If it's a gift for a female then I should be able to choose. It's just preposterous to me that he can complain about financial stress and us as a couple are going out less, buying less in order to save. But he wont think twice about spending £40 on some woman who has no respect for his wife or relationship.
 

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If you are married to him by simply exchanging vows without witnesses, then, well, he likely is married to this other woman too.

If this is not tolerable to you, then, move on, end your relationship.

Personally, I think your "husband" is a player. He keeps a string of women going at the same time. He may not have been intimate with all of them, but he is working on it.

This idea that they are all just "friends" is nonsense.

I'm not totally rejecting the notion that men and women can be friends. However, the context of such friendships cannot ever be talking about sexual things.
No it wasnt the way you're thinking.. we were married in front of both our families and a couple of friends, had a small wedding party etc

And no it's unlikely that he's married to this woman. I know I should keep my wits about me but I'm not going to run off with the idea that he's married to her and hat her child is his. That's ridiculous. Like I said earlier I dont believe it's a PA, it's likely that its EA.

Also I dont see his other friendships the way you've described. I get your point. But those girls and H keeps within boundaries. Since we have been together they have taken a step back and put some respect on our relationship. Anytime we go out I'm invited without saying. Sally has issues and is toxic. Whereas his other friends come across as just normal, mature beings.
 

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It's difficult for me to wrap my mind around the fact that you and your husband put up with so much to have this woman in your life. I would not let someone invade my life like that. And I would not want to be with someone who requires that I tolerate it.

I used to think as you do now. I thought men and women could be friends. But there are some people out there who do not play fair and offering them friendship without knowing what they are really interested in isn't worth the problems that they cause. /being friends with my husband is not oxygen and even if it were, I do not owe any woman that friendship.

On the other side, while dating I looked out for that kind of behavior. Is this guy I'm dating wrapped up in one or more friendships that I am going to have to bow to? With my current / second husband, I asked him to get rid of a socalled friend or else I would start dating other men. He immediately dropped her.

This woman may have already decided that you amount to nothing in her friendship with your husband.
 
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