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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
father of 4 (54). Got divorced in 2009 after my wife had an affair, and she wasn't in a place to try to work on anything. Her head was somewhere else. I got custody of my 4 kids, and raised them. 2 were 6, and the other two 11 and 12. Shortly after I met, or connected with a high school alum two years younger than me. I didn't know her, but I fell in love with her very slowly and cautiously. I know what people are going to say already- boy are you stupid- but here goes. She had told me that she had dated her husband through all of high school and college, never partied and was the valedictorian. All true. She then told me in a round about convoluted way that she got divorced because her husband worked too much, and didn't have any time for her....The truth came out in pieces...She had gone away to a family reunion(his side) and her husband got drunk and went to bed early. She hung out with his cousins etc...no mention of what went on. Next day someone has to drive a cousin to the airport, and she gets elected. Husband too hung over. They drive, Have conversation, etc, and "a hug goodbye was not just a hug" She felt something. (I already feel so finG stupid). She continues a phone relationship with him, her husband taps the phones and hears a lot of sex talk etc and they divorce. SHE ENDS UP dating him, him living in her house for 10 plus years with her 2 little kids a mile from her ex. Horrid story, unless you met her. So sweet, so kind, compassionate, honest...well, maybe not.

I took it very slow. I had been through an ugly divorce. Very ugly, and she both helped me and watched my ex abuse everyone. We vowed to be faithful, but not marry. I gave her a ring, as a promise to stay together. forever She fell in love quickly. We had a great relationship for 5 years. I had dated a lot, been married etc, and when I say this relationship was the best I mean by a MILE. Many miles. after 5 years, She took a new job and worked over 100 hours some weeks, traveling up to 5 days a week, and the relationship cooled, but it was still great and I knew I could always count on her. She was supposed to move in permanently but never did. Always an excuse, when this one goes to school, when that one goes, etc. She did stay over a lot, but this always bothered me. Never sold her house, changed her address, license, mail, etc. Did not "move in". Although she claims she did.

My kids adored her, but my oldest girl started to get jealous and try to get her in trouble with me constantly. SO also seemed to have issues of jealousy toward my oldest daughter as well. There was always a rub. It grew into a huge problem so when my daughter graduated college and moved home, SO left and went to her beach house an hour and a half away. recipe for disaster. I knew it, and I predicted it. she worked a lot and i visited when i could. She rarely came home. We have been together almost 12 years now, and with the twins going off to college this past september, I believed it was OUR Time! Finally. I asked her to go away for her birthday in sept, she didn't want to. I thought that was very weird. She has been starting fights constantly for a few months at least, about nothing, and acting different. less intimate, hugging, etc...I had a scheduled trip to go on this late Oct/early Nov., and what do you know, she started a GIANT fight right before I left. GIANT, about Nothing. For no reason and about the past and decisions we made together she now resents, and she went to the meanest places she's ever gone(my ex). I was floored. She's never been a yeller but has developed this 'Im going to say the meanest sh** I can when I'm upset to get you mad. She even said "you want out of this relationship but don't have the balls to do it" I don't. I LOVE her to the ends of the earth. That has Never changed. While I was gone all i could think about was her. I sent her messages but she never replied. She sent me an email(weird) "I need to get coats from your house". She also texted my son, my best friend's wife, my mom and another friend "when is he coming back" but never asked me. I didn't know any of this, but had a serious gut instinct kick in when I was away and immediately came home. I f I'm being honest I had some signs over the past few months and they all started eating at me. I drove from Iowa to RI, to her house and she said this relationship has to end. I was pretty surprised but also not based on the recent crazy arguments we had had. I said I respect that, but I came here to look you in the eye and ask is there another guy. Her reply "yes but not on that level", then she started spewing a bunch of stuff about "meeting a lot of people guys and girls' and nothing physical, "get a lie detector test". I said no need for that, just go get me your phone. Her reply "Im not going to do that it would break your heart" We talked for a couple hours, she screamed and yelled and deflected from the elephant in the room as much as she could. I stayed calm and when about to leave I said, its been 11 1/2 years, I think you owe me the truth about the guy. she stared into space, her eyes welled up with tears and she said "i don't want this to be my legacy" and stopped. I said like because you did this before? She acted confused and started talking about a ton of other rubbish I redirected her and she pretended to not remember even saying it. It had been one minute. She asked me to leave, and I did. A day or so later she sent me a text "I did nothing wrong and I am tired of your insinuations, they are further dividing us". I said you admitted it. She is disagreeing. She did. 100% I have been sick for weeks. I couldn't sleep or eat while I was away, I have lost 19 pounds, had cardiac irregularities, can't sleep..shaking from anxiety...just really sick. I trusted her to the ends of the earth. She won't call, text, or reply. when there has been any communication she Is trying to say I made this mistake or that(and I made some mistakes but not infidelity or stuff like that) for many years and she's angry with me. Also says I am trying to make this about a guy, and it isn't -it is about how much I suck I guess, or what I chose to do for the kids in 2015 or something Don't get me wrong, I have admitted and apologized for my mistakes, lack of judgment, anger, immature handling of situations etc. I am human- and I thought we were in Love.. Funny she just wrote me a long email about "what a great man you are" a few months ago...She says she Needs time to sort it out....with her own therapist, and she isn't communicating with me but suddenly is reaching out to my kids and mom........THOUGHTS TBH, I am heartbroken, truly heartbroken. I trusted her, and I still love her, and I wanted our future together- to the end. I can't imagine this is just how abruptly our story just ends. Way too much good and way too many years of raising kids together, trips all over the place, vacations, and the best intimacy I have ever experienced. Im sick
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I am a realistic man. I understand and respect the direct responses, and that is what I believe too. But I am looking for all opinions, and maybe personal accounts of a similar nature that went differently. This isn't going to go differently but I'm not far removed from the shock, sickness, anxiety, palpitations, fear and sobbing...so.

In therapy this week, I told her you looked me in the eye and admitted it, TWICE, and let me be clear, I am not 90% sure, I am 100% sure. She sobbed and sobbed and deflected and said I was 1000% wrong. She said you want this to be about a guy. You want this to be that Im not strong enough to leave you on my own. You're wrong. I think she is trying t buy time so when it gets found out by more people, that we have been broken up for a while and it fits her narrative that she wasn't cheating, and it doesn't "become her legacy". She is really a sweet girl. Not *****y in any way at all. Easy to get along with, warm and affectionate. Our relationship went off the rails because of my daughter, and fights we had about her, and there were some other things as well I own, but I thought this was forever, even just a month ago.. On this forum I guess it is foolish to say I just can't explain how completely screwed up I am over this. I'm broken. You people know, some more than once(me)
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
It sounds as though you are asking members to give you hope. To come up with some believable scenarios where your girl is really the angel you believe her to be. I'm sorry, but that is not the type of advice that will actually help you.

Reread your own first post and ask yourself if this sounds like a woman who loves and respects you?

Have you had the talk with your daughter regarding interfering in your relationships? She is now an adult and doesn't get a pass just because she's daddy's girl.
I agree. She does not respect me and has gone all out offensive gaslighting whatever you want to characterize it as, certainly it is not humility, apologetic, its all self preservation. Worrying about her blessed reputation.

I have had many discussions with my adult daughter about her behavior. I made her move out in hopes my SO would move back in this past September. I WAS planning a Wedding, picking out music, locations etc and wanted to have that talk when we were to go away for her birthday 9/25. Its just so unreal to have been so duped. I wish I knew how long this has been going on. I will find out, but its going to take some work(yes I want to know for me). I just can't stop thinking how shocked I am. I will never get over this blindside. That bothers me because she can move on(has) but I, who had trust issues to begin with feel like I will never find a suitable partner again. And Im not 30. Fit, attractive, financially in a good spot, but I don't ever want to start dating again. Too much BS for me.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 · (Edited)
Why in hell's name do you keep referring to her as "a sweet girl" when she is the furthest thing from being a sweet girl??? She is a a deceitful, lying serial cheater who wil stomp on the heart of the one who loves her with no empathy, and then to continue the pain will continue to gaslight the guy. She has done this before. At best she is an accomplished actor.
For most f our relationship she was sweet, and warm, and kind. That has all changed over the past year or so. Maybe this kind of **** has been going on for longer or with more people than I know. She was so theatrical in the therapy session last week I found it embarrassing for her. Dramatic voice the entire time, giving bits of history with no context meant to make me look bad, sobbing, it was awful, and a great percentage of it was simply untrue, or stated in such a one sided way that the counselor would think it was true. Thankfully I got to clarify much of the misleading stuff
 

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Discussion Starter · #22 · (Edited)
yes I guess I am. I would like to know if anyone had a SO get emotionally involved, F up their relationship, get crazy mid life type of nuts and reel it back in and save the sinking ship. All sorts of scenarios are possible, and I hear you, this is pretty far fetched. I think we all know what happened. Yes I was looking for some dissenting opinions if any, if not I completely understand.
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Most affairs, the vast majority, go undetected forever. Much like murders, most of which remain unsolved.
You now know of two for certain with this woman. What are the odds, particularly assuming she is roughly in your age bracket ( and even if not), that you just happen to know about the only two times she has been involved in this type of thing?
In my case, with both my XWs, I had formed relationships with their families and friends which were very close. They liked me a lot and were aghast at the cheating, although, apparently, not surprised. Many of these people came forward later to tell me of my XWs histories, which were far more extensive than the ones my XWs had coped to during courtship( done preemptively, as I was sure to have discovered the most blatant ones).
It was amazing. Siblings, friends, even in-law parents now came forward. Everyone had been reluctant before as they were fearful of interfering.
Affairs are like the ****roaches you see when you first come into a room. If you see one, there are many more that remain hidden.
50 year old woman with two known affairs( one even being with her husband's cousin)? Only two, though? I'll lay odds and bet a year's salary there is a lot more to her history. Run.
Ouch. well said though
 

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Discussion Starter · #34 ·
By chance did you ever contact her XH to ask him his side of the story? If not, if it would help to give you certainty now, perhaps you should. I bet your eyes would be opened….
No I would never do that. It has been a long time and I'm sure painful and personal
 

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Discussion Starter · #35 · (Edited)
The reason why I believe you will stay comes back to how you blame your daughter for her moving out because your daughter was jealous. I think your daughter was acting out because she sees her for what she is. I mean, look at cases where children are abused by step/biological parents. The kid rarely comes out and says it, but they find some way to fight against the dangerous person. You don’t seem at all concerned here, and largely blame your daughter. You chose wrong. I am aware of countless situations like this where a parent will blame the child for a relationship ending. YOUR DAUGHTER WAS A CHILD. You were the parent.

You made your daughter move out. Boy are you in so much shock, and have been for so long. I can’t really unpack this much, because I don’t see this ending favourably for anyone really.

How is this the best relationship you’ve ever had, by miles?
Harsh, but I don't disagree. I made some choices that seemed clear at the time. My oldest son doesn't speak to my daughter because of what he saw her do to the people he cared about for years. I pushed her to move out after paying for college, and two years of her applying, and getting into grad school and deciding not to go. I got custody of four little kids and did my best to raise them every single day. There's no manual. I made decisions I thought were in everyones best interest, except usually mine. She was tough- to everyone, and had something going on, I believe BPD.

Why was it the best relationship I ever had? I have never felt more loved. Things just flowed. She was not high maintenance, just the opposite. She did unexpected nice things all the time, she gave a hug that could change your life, she came to my room every morning to lay on top of me naked, just to be close for a few minutes, I felt she would have taken a bullet for my kids, she was interested in everything I did, she loves dogs, she's humble, we had many friends in common, we went to the same high school, she looked at me like no one ever has, she held my hand, she was thoughtful, and could express herself, she was cute, silly, sexy as F. We connected physically like in a spiritual way I have never experienced before. She took care of me when I had surgery or got sick, she added a woman's touch around my home, she planned parties and events, she was a good cook and a selfless partner. She was so easy to travel with, but didn't expect you to do all the work. We visited many countries and god I just f'ing love her. Why go on, I am emotional now I don't know how to deal with each day. I can't eat or breathe and often cry. This is what makes it just impossible to believe she just went and started a new relationship. Pulled the rug out from under the guy she promised "to choose today and every day" Her words.
 

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Discussion Starter · #36 ·
The reason why I believe you will stay comes back to how you blame your daughter for her moving out because your daughter was jealous. I think your daughter was acting out because she sees her for what she is. I mean, look at cases where children are abused by step/biological parents. The kid rarely comes out and says it, but they find some way to fight against the dangerous person. You don’t seem at all concerned here, and largely blame your daughter. You chose wrong. I am aware of countless situations like this where a parent will blame the child for a relationship ending. YOUR DAUGHTER WAS A CHILD. You were the parent.

You made your daughter move out. Boy are you in so much shock, and have been for so long. I can’t really unpack this much, because I don’t see this ending favourably for anyone really.

How is this the best relationship you’ve ever had, by miles?
I had three other kids in the household with far far different experiences. They all grew t love her deeply There ws never a sign of any type of aggression or violence, except- from my oldest girl toward everyone else.
 

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Discussion Starter · #40 · (Edited)
Here is my input on your situation:

1. You need to sever all ties with this woman and gray rock her. She is a cancer. Make sure that all your family and friends know the real story from you. Let the cold, hard facts of the story be her legacy. She's a big girl. Actions have consequences.

2. Make amends with your Daughter. She may actually have been trying to tell you something back then. Remember, blood is thicker than water.

3. Take some time and really get your s**t sorted. Get some therapy. Get your picker fixed. Work on you. Redefine the new you. Be the person you want to be, not the pushover you present yourself as. It is much better to be alone on your own accord, than to be with someone who makes you feel alone. You can only be treated like crap with your own permission.

4. Your best path (as well as your best revenge) is to go out and be the best person that you can be and live the life you always wanted. Extract yourself from being the victim, and leave both #'s 1 and 2 in the dust, on the streets, where they belong.
i don't know what grey rock means?

I agree with 1above entirely. I have told one friend and blown his mind, but I will tell my other close friends as time passes. My son is probably going to get mad at me for the "truth", and he trusts her implicitly and she's lying.......no idea how to handle that. I don't want to hurt him and I don't want her to lie to him. Life is hard and the kid hs been through enough. My wish would be that he would think on it for a long time, and point blank tell her- you watched my Grandfather do this, you saw what I went through with my own Mom- and I trusted you. She will lie, but I never lie to my kids. I would have no reason to tell them something untruthful that I know will hurt them. I love my boy way too much.

2 We have been doing better, both working at this. I told her about SO and she apologized for "her part" in that but the catch 22 is when I do better with her, my son gets mad says "i'm rewarding her bad behavior again" mad about 20 years of my decisions. so hard to get it right honestly. I love them all.

3 Getting therapy a lot right now. not sure how I get my picker fixed. I really thought I had this one nailed down as nearly perfect for the duration. I am FAR from a pushover. I have tried to respect everyones position in this mess that was created when I divorced. It wasn't my kids fault and I tried to give them the best. I hold anger, and suppress it fairly often and fairly well, but when I am attacked, I just shut down because I am afraid to inappropriately blow up. If you keep pushing, like the SO had been doing to try to get me to blow up and break up with her, I often can't help myself. i work on it every day, and think I manage well 99% of the time. "Better to be alone than with someone who makes you feel alone", is well said. She was away. She moved away. I begged for us to close the distance, buy or build our house together. I have told her I'm lonely for years...no changes. She may have had another life. Shut me off the security cam access, and told me I don't give her enough notice when I'm coming to see her. Weird. Like calling your wife and saying just want to give you a heads up I'm coming home.

4. Impossible to even think of right now. Hard to get off the couch and if it were up to me I'd sleep for a month. Dreading Thanksgiving etc... But I appreciate your point
 

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Discussion Starter · #43 · (Edited)
You go on because you have four children and a life that is worth living to the fullest. This woman isn't the end all, be all and there is life outside of her. Adults or not, your children still need and want you to be present, happy, and healthy.

For the holidays, can you make plans with your kids?
I am pretty beaten down. I have lost 19 pounds since 10/4. I am not ok physically or emotionally. can't process this yet, and I'm not much of a cook. The other problem here is my EXW has a big family, and they will certainly be doing something big(assuming without my son). That leaves me and him. My Mom just had surgery. Used to be SO and her Kids and Mom and an occasional kids friend. Prior to my parents divorce in 2005 it was 40+ people. My kids have been through a lot of difficult changes
 

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Discussion Starter · #46 · (Edited)
I notice two things...

1. You blew past a red flag when you decided to start a relationship with a known and admitted cheater.

2. You didn't "mate guard" very well by allowing her to be traveling so much and working so much, that setup never helps a relationship.


The other guy is likely a co-worker, hence the long hours and traveling. The fact that she wouldn't give her phone up and its' contents "would break your heart" per her own admission is all you need to know.

It doesn't matter who he is, tell her to go be with him.
True. on one. Took it slow, had a lot of common friends, went to HS together, most people didm't know about her divorce, maybe none Im aware of, but it is a fact. I thought she learned a lot from it. She said she learned that she could never cause that much pain again. She seemed to have learned enough anyways and people do stupid things. I forgave her, but here I am.

I definitely did not mate guard. Too torn between going to see her and being a Dad. And I believe in freedom in relationships- but this amount of distance and the irregularity with which we saw each other was always on my mind, especially because I had been cheated on before. Would definitely do that differently today

"break your heart" Is all I can think about. I just can't wrap my head around this...
 

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Discussion Starter · #49 ·
This is the toughest period, the initial shock period. It is pretty brutal. You are on the "High Impact Infidelity Diet". Many go through this( I lost 47 lbs. from a fit, lean body in about 3 months. Folks thought I had cancer.).
Eat what you can. Exercise and hydrate. Easier said then done , but try.
I am 15 years post the second marriage discovery. And, my XW( both, actually), is a narcissist for sure. On some level, the cheating was a relief, my golden ticket out from an abuser. Yet, the betrayal still affected me. You are ,probably, not ready to accept or understand what many here can see and are telling you about. But you really, really dodged a bullet here. Does not reduce the initial pain, though.
Odds are high your girlfriend has a history of cheating far beyond what you know. As I said, that cousin deal alone has her many standard deviations from a normal person. Throw in that she then lived with the guy( a man who she knew for certain was immoral and a snake) exposing her own kids to him. That behavior is so astronomically repugnant it should, by itself show you what you were dealing with. But, it will take time for this to dawn on you.
I think, with time, various other strange, abusive behaviors of hers will be recollected, stuff that you glossed over, not realizing its nature.
One that jumps to my mind is how she interacted with your daughter. Any empathetic, compassionate ADULT, would have realized the trauma your daughter went through as the result of her mother'infideliy and the resulting divorce. Naturally, any child wants its parents together and has issues with the replacement. This was your oldest, right, the one with the greatest consciousness of what your first wife did. The one with the longest history in what she thought was a stable family.
Your girlfriend ( and my opinion is, of course, biased because she is a known serial cheater), should have bent over backwards to try to help your daughter adjust. I cannot imagine how your daughter felt being kicked out for a person capable of what we know your girlfriend has done.
I made a similar mistake with my son, the one now fighting heroin addiction. I tried to shield him from his step mom's antipathy, but was nowhere near assertive enough. To this day, it is a huge source of shame for me. My son loves me and I have apologized, but this still haunts me.
In any case, know that the massive weight loss is common. Anxiety, lack of concentration, forgetfulness, sleep disturbances - all par for the course.
They subside gradually over time. Hang in there. Rely on trusted friends and family. Let work know if it is affecting performance, assuming you have decent bosses etc.
Thank you very much for the lengthy thoughtful reply. I wish you luck with your son. You never know, sometimes these things work out.

I have all the symptoms you said and a few more. Can barely walk around I'm so weak. confused often, tired but can't sleep, shaky af, I'm usually outdoors every day in November but can't get off the couch, and if it weren't for my dogs I'd be in bed. Down 20 but hasn't been that long and I only started at 178# When I originally got divorced i was 192# and lost 24. Worked hard to keep it off, and changed my workouts Unfortunatey I have an injured neck and shoulder right now or workouts would be the plan to bring me back from hell. I can't work out.

One thing that keeps ringing in my head is "how long until I feel normal" And "will I ever trust again". And how long until I date ANYONE? I don't know. Its depressing to think I will never look into someones eyes and trust them with my soul again. This is the third big betrayal if I count what happened to me in HS, which was awful. I know no-one can provide a timeline, but I sure wish they could. I can get through anything if I know how long I have to buckle up for.

This forum is great. I don't know what I would do without it in the state Im in right now. A lot of people have shared personal things and given bits of hope for future happiness. That means a lot to me. more than you know Thank you and thank everyone.
 

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Discussion Starter · #54 ·
What you are feeling has been felt by most people on the this board. You are not alone.

However, you are co-dependent in the extreme.

You want us to reassure you that it is possible she will return to you and all will be well. Our lying to you will not make you better, but only give you false hope.

You need to reach down and find strength for your children (all of them). You need to show them how to deal with a terrible situation. Unfortunately, you are choosing to do the opposite,

You put her on a pedestal. Nobody is worthy of that. All of us are capable of terrible things. Its human.

Find strength not only for yourself, but your kids (all of them).
I believe everything you say here is correct. I am still in shock and still want to believe some couples therapy and hard work will right this ship before it sinks. I want to believe she hasn't gone too far emotionally. I know both of these things are unlikely but I just can't give up on her. Its been 9 days since I found out. About 6-8 weeks since I had reason to suspect. Still can't process. I have periods of strength and acceptance and a firm feeling of the need to close the book and not look back, but it happened so fast I feel like I have no closure, not all the facts, or at least not enough, and that's bad for the way my brain functions.
 

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Discussion Starter · #57 ·
What is she admitting to at this point?

What is she denying?
She is admitting to going out and "having new friends" Admitted there is a 'guy but not on that level" on the first day when I asked. Since the first day's admissions, she has denied any involvement with "a guy" whatsoever and in our counseling appointment, 2x went pretty hard on "there is no guy" Clearly she has a safety net and someone/people talking in her ear. She never did this to me before, as in will not answer a call, meet, and will answer a text sometimes but only after several hours. I hadn't texted her in over a week until yesterday. I haven't called her in over a week. I have asked her to meet via text that she never answered. She agreed to couples therapy, I set a date and now she is waffling a little bit saying she wants to get with her therapist first. Problem there, as I see it, is she will more than likely say the same things to this woman that she recently has to her friends- and in our therapy session, creating a fictitious past, and making things that were off a little bit look like she was with Hitler himself. We had some issues, most I would consider minor I did NOT see this coming. but you already knew that.
 

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Discussion Starter · #69 ·
Hi OP. Sorry for your pain.

Does she still travel 5 days a week, working 100 hour weeks? Difficult to repair a relationship with someone with that work life.

Hindsight and all that, but sounds like when she took that job it was the beginning of the end of your relationship. It's great to be a hard worker, not great to be the significant other of someone working that job.

All the stalling on her end when you were trying to make your relationship closer were red flags, she was wobbly on your future together.

Cheating on her husband with his cousin, then lives with him. Oy, who does that OP? Your lady has a selfish cruel streak that most people don't.
No she stopped traveling a few years ago, but the hours never lessened. She's Up every day at 3;30 am- or 4 if she was lazy. Used to drive me nuts. (now she's closing bars and sleeping to 7:( Try being woken up every day at 330-4 then again after she worked out at 5;30. When I complained I was a di*k. But I used to say not many people could deal with that. Am I wrong? She'd also go to bed by 8 or if we were lucky 9, and shed be upset that I didn't come lay with her for at least a little bit before she fell asleep. My kids were doing stuff, and If I laid down I'd fall asleep, and miss what they were doing. Works still 80 hours a week, and calls and emails almost alway take up significant parts of the weekend. The job was the beginning of the end for sure. I begged her to quit, change etc..said I would pay any difference in salary. She is caught up in the titles and rhetoric of "that's not a heavy lift" and all this stupid jargon that makes smart people look really dumb. But she feels important which is good but at what sacrifice. She barely saw her kids, and manages to blame spending time with mine for that. I always told her- priorities- get to your house.

The stalling, or as it you said wobbly made me nuts. I guarantee when I do recover that I could get a woman to live in this house in short order. or marry me. But she won't be a cheater! @Megaforce. It is one of the nicest houses in my town, 8 acres, full gym, she paid zero dollars for anything too. And we are all easy to live with most of the time. We really never had any issues.

When I found out about the cousin. I was literally sick for weeks. I questioned my own sanity several times a day for a while. She seemed so remorseful that it almost seemed as if she'd take her own life before cheating again. She seemed like a young lady that had worn the scarlet letter and learned more than most. It was forgiveness, or move on. Perhaps I chose wrong. The selfish cruel streak has returned. And as bad as it sounds, I'm still in love but I am working every day to pull my head out of my a**, and you guys are an immense help. No sugarcoated BS.
 

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Discussion Starter · #73 ·
Right, many of us made mistakes in overlooking stuff like you did. You are not a bad person, just a guy brought up in an era where males were indoctrinated with a lot of bogus crap as regards the nature of women. Flip the genders. Do you think a decent woman would have overlooked a guy having cheated on his wife and kids with his wife's cousin and shacking up with her exposing his kids to her ?
Infidelity has led to many men educating themselves on the true nature of women and the red flags indicating you have found a bad one.
Best way to heal fastest is no more contact of any kind. Frankly, the way you describe this woman, her work habits and values, she is no p
no p? please explain
 

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Discussion Starter · #74 ·
You are not listening. You still hope to save this. You will continue to torture yourself. Why do you value yourself so lowly? She was not who you thought she was. Move on with your life!
You are right. I am not listening. I am hearing, but I am not listening. I am still squarely in disbelief, and the fact that she went off in therapy and swore up and down she isn't seeing someone, although I believe ZERO of that charade still screws me up and makes me feel the need to ask her questions. And she isn't talking to me. Strangest thing ever, just cut off. So frustrating and mean as F***
 
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