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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Was l having a real affair to her ?

We separated 4 mths ago . We'd had a very stressful 5 yrs and it took it 's toll on our moods and the way were with each other.
Now , l've realized l did handle the stress so wrong, l also blocked my wifes love and efforts to hold us together .
That eventually had her backing away and acting weird with me too and that , made me go even more distant from her.

In our last 12 mths together we'd bought our new place 6 mths earlier , it needed heaps of work , more money stress and too many other things going on to mention.
Around this time one of our friends was spending more and more time here and usually in week long stints staying over.
l got along with her much better than my wife did , my wife didn't even like her that much.
My wife had also changed jobs , lots more work , whole new crowd, on top of all our worries so she also got very run down , tired all the time and started going to bed at 7 or 8 every night.
she told me right through that's all it was but i was welcome to hang out with the friends.
Well , we usually stayed up till all hours , even all night , we had heaps of fun , lots of laughing and , yep she was damn hot too but - nothing ever touched. There were usually other people around too , lots of noise , music , laughing and yelling through the house.
l often went in to see my wife , make sure she was cool and we weren't keeping her awake- our room was away a bit and separate so pretty sound proof.

This was going on every few weeks over our last 12 mths and i must admit l could never wait for K to get back and see her again. l thought about her all the time and even thought of leaving to be with her - but l didn't !

Well, it turns out my wife was also in deep depression through all that time on top of everything else , about us. seeing shrinks and Counselors and in our last 3 weeks had met some shoulder to cry on too.
She told me she wanted to separate. She told me about us , the way l'd been with her for a couple of yrs now and that l'd lost it with her completely, the pain and hurt she'd been living.
She'd thought l wanted to move out for 12 mths. Told me about mr shoulder , the depression , shrinks. Then she told me she'd like to start spending time with mr shoulder . She said she didn't even think l'd care anyway and that l was so busy with K all the time and how she'd cry in bed listening to us laughing and partying for 12 mths.
She said K turns me on but she doesn't any more , and that l don't even wanna talk to her anymore let alone have fun with her
She said she'd been crying in bed for 12 mths over what we might be getting up to , in her house .
She'd even heard me dreaming about her . And admittedly l did deny any turn on and really nothing physical had happened anyway but deep down she was right about her , l mean if l was single !

But , despite everything , l had never stopped loving my wife also and if l'd had known what she was going through l would have done everything l could. It hurt soooo much to find out she'd been in that pain and so long, and that l'd been so insensitive and cold to us .
but it was too late , she'd cut off and checked out.

But , the one thing that kept coming back , above anything else through all our talks, AND fights, before she moved out, was K.
It kept coming back and up , l blew it off each time because yeah in a way she was right but l never touched.

So was that an emotional affair , a real affair- which l've never heard of before here 4mths ago . And the realizing that maybe she had something, maybe to the other person that is an affair or as good as cheating on them.
Can an emotional affair be so serious that it justifies separation or the right for them to start seeing someone else ?
The right for them to cut off and appear to be feeling no guilt about seeing someone else ?
Is it justifiably that bad ?

Please don't hesitate to delve or speak on this. To be honest, l know l'd been selfish and dumb but with realizations from around here, l need too dig at this to just maybe , find some peace and closure , figure out my anger .
 

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An EA is just as painful for the BS as is a PA. For some BS, they have found a EA to be even more painful.

Under the guise of entertaining in your home, staying up all night with the OW you were dating this OW in front of your BW in BW home for a full year.

And you need to be told what you did and why it was wrong.

Are you that dumb?
 

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Yes an EA is often, more often more painful than a PA. You are giving your deepest part to another woman, not just your flesh. That is more of a betrayal to some people. It is also psychologically more damaging.

You did betray your wife. Though your wife was in a deep depression she was needing you. You were not there for her. You were out having fun with K while she was burying her pain.

Now that your wife has separated you have a couple of choices, fight for your wife if you truly loved her or walk away. If you did truly love your wife, go fight for her. You have to understand what she needs and women's needs are different from men's so you have to begin to understand her. You married her for better or worse so go after her and let her know you love her and fight for her.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
An EA is just as painful for the BS as is a PA. For some BS, they have found a EA to be even more painful.

Under the guise of entertaining in your home, staying up all night with the OW you were dating this OW in front of your BW in BW home for a full year.

And you need to be told what you did and why it was wrong.

Are you that dumb?

Thanks for the honesty and making it through my post and yep , it seems l have been that dumb , with some selfishness and blind eye thrown in if l'm being really honest
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
Yes an EA is often, more often more painful than a PA. You are giving your deepest part to another woman, not just your flesh. That is more of a betrayal to some people. It is also psychologically more damaging.

You did betray your wife. Though your wife was in a deep depression she was needing you. You were not there for her. You were out having fun with K while she was burying her pain.

Now that your wife has separated you have a couple of choices, fight for your wife if you truly loved her or walk away. If you did truly love your wife, go fight for her. You have to understand what she needs and women's needs are different from men's so you have to begin to understand her. You married her for better or worse so go after her and let her know you love her and fight for her.

Thanks Moving and my God. lt wasn't until later , finding this place and reading , talking , realizations .
l mean it broke my heart when she told me what she'd been going through but yep , on the K stuff in my mind well , l didn't touch so it wasn't as bad as she made out but , well how stupid and wrong could l have been .

l wish i could fight for her moving , l tried for two mths , everything. She wasn't interested and just kept saying she was done, along with a hell of a lot of more colorful stuff.

She still seems as done and checked out as ever and seeing that other guy now .
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
She is seeing the guy now too. That's actually what got me digging even more than l already have over this 4 mths and why l'm digging here now.

Because l saw them today , in town, having coffee, main street, talking to locals passing by.
that's a tiny town , gossip , my daughter goes to school there , knows everyone.
Well l saw them also 6 or 7 wks ago for the first time .

The anger and pain l felt , seeing her doing this in such a small town , in front of it all so soon after our separation.
My daughters school and friends , me , l mean how the fk does that look so soon ?
How the hell could she have such no feelings for our feelings and so soon like that ?

That's why l'm here right now and trying to learn more and understand emotional affairs and their effects.

Because it's so not her to act like this but maybe , with what l've done and seeing how bad you've all said that can be , maybe she feels quite justified .

Maybe she's got every right to feel that way ?
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
So do you think that's what she's thinking then Matt and so then to hell with my feelings ?
Or maybe l don't have the right because of my stuff ?
 

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She has a right to her feelings and you to yours. She is done. She isn't thinking about your feelings like you weren't thinking about hers. For a long period of time you carried out an affair in her home with her there. I can't imagine the anguish she went through. Do you want your wife back or do you just want to move on? Be clear about what you want so the advice can be given accordingly.
 

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As far as what constitutes an emotional affair, everyone has their own opinions about where the line is that, when you cross it, you're having one. I don't think there is a dictionary definition anywhere.

I think it would be best for you to not worry so much about what term to use for your behavior and just focus on the behavior itself.

Your wife was going to bed at 7 or 8 every night. Meanwhile, you were partying, usually very late, sometimes all night, in the same house.

You don't say it, but I get the impression that you didn't exchange I love you's or any type of sex talk with other woman. I get the impression that your wife heard the tone of your voice, how excited you were, how enthusiastic you were, when you were with the other woman. And she contrasted that enthusiasm and excitement that you ALWAYS had plenty of for the other woman, with how you at the same time seemed to have NO CONCERN for her. Whether or not you did, or did not, ALWAYS or NEVER do these things, is not that important - your wife's perception is what is important. And I think your wife perceives that you had deep feelings for the other woman and no feelings for her.

It went on for a year - that's a really, really long time to be in bed at 7 or 8 each night listening to your husband whooping it up with another female. At this point, your wife feels that she heard what she heard, even if you tell her that you and other woman never touched, she knows the excitement in your voice and the emotion and enthusiasm you showed for the other woman. Your wife knows what she knows and you are not going to dissuade her that she is wrong.

I'm sorry I don't have any advice for you. Has your wife moved out? Where do you stand with your wife? Heading for divorce? Drifting along in limbo?
 

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She doesn't feel special to you anymore. You put more effort into K, than you did the woman you took a vow to love,honor, and cherish. She probably thought you guys were a team, you could work it out, you would never do that etc... Instead you withdrew, that's extremely painful, especially when facing all of the stress. It was that bad, it is justifiable, and this new guy is making her feel special.
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
She has a right to her feelings and you to yours. She is done. She isn't thinking about your feelings like you weren't thinking about hers. For a long period of time you carried out an affair in her home with her there. I can't imagine the anguish she went through. Do you want your wife back or do you just want to move on? Be clear about what you want so the advice can be given accordingly.

Thanks Hopefull and neither could l until seeing how bad all that really was.

Well , first l wanted to know how bad an EA is and then , as compared to what she's doing now .
Because l feel so much anger now after seeing them today like that and that's going to seriously effect the way l am with her from here on. Yet we have a lot of money stuff to clear up for 12 mths and we have my daughter forever.

So firstly - do l even have the right to feel that anger after what l did to her ?

2ndly , yes l would want my wife back definitely under the right circumstances. We were repairable and before all this we were a really special couple but she's lost so l have no choice , l do have to move on.

And so again it comes back to do l have the right to feel that anger, it what she's doing justified ?
Because that anger effects me and moving on as l am trying not to but l'm carrying it around .
l also have to use that town so today is going to happen again and again.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
As far as what constitutes an emotional affair, everyone has their own opinions about where the line is that, when you cross it, you're having one. I don't think there is a dictionary definition anywhere.

I think it would be best for you to not worry so much about what term to use for your behavior and just focus on the behavior itself.

Your wife was going to bed at 7 or 8 every night. Meanwhile, you were partying, usually very late, sometimes all night, in the same house.

You don't say it, but I get the impression that you didn't exchange I love you's or any type of sex talk with other woman. I get the impression that your wife heard the tone of your voice, how excited you were, how enthusiastic you were, when you were with the other woman. And she contrasted that enthusiasm and excitement that you ALWAYS had plenty of for the other woman, with how you at the same time seemed to have NO CONCERN for her. Whether or not you did, or did not, ALWAYS or NEVER do these things, is not that important - your wife's perception is what is important. And I think your wife perceives that you had deep feelings for the other woman and no feelings for her.

It went on for a year - that's a really, really long time to be in bed at 7 or 8 each night listening to your husband whooping it up with another female. At this point, your wife feels that she heard what she heard, even if you tell her that you and other woman never touched, she knows the excitement in your voice and the emotion and enthusiasm you showed for the other woman. Your wife knows what she knows and you are not going to dissuade her that she is wrong.

I'm sorry I don't have any advice for you. Has your wife moved out? Where do you stand with your wife? Heading for divorce? Drifting along in limbo?
Thanks for your time Will.
She moved out 4mths ago. L've been rebuilding , getting my head around everything , seeing my daughter when l can, adjusting , clearing up all our crap, working and going on with finishing our house , deciding my future - all the usual it seems broken marriage stuff.

Hmmm , more bad news l'm afraid. Things did get often accidentally a little heated with K. Definite mutual attraction there that was sometimes hard to push aside.
Apparently it was getting pretty hot in my sleep too but l thought but hey we could dream anything we can't be responsible for that surely.
 

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Mr. Man, sorry but you failed the ultimate test of loyalty. When your wife was sending up smoke signals that she needed you you preferred to take care of you first. You bypassed her needs for K. Didn't K have something better to do with someone else? You have now experienced another woman the way you experienced your wife which nullifies your emotional relationship with her. The only reason you seem to be concerned now is because someone else got her smoke signals, which renders you a little too late...
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
She doesn't feel special to you anymore. You put more effort into K, than you did the woman you took a vow to love,honor, and cherish. She probably thought you guys were a team, you could work it out, you would never do that etc... Instead you withdrew, that's extremely painful, especially when facing all of the stress. It was that bad, it is justifiable, and this new guy is making her feel special.
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Hmm , l did offer to never see K again and when l'd realized what a mess l'd made l actually couldn't wait to show her love and start being with her again , sex to but especially our talking in bed and early nights we'd always done before all this.

She said she just can't there was too much hurt and she was done.
 

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You have a right to your anger, of course. Anger is a natural feeling that comes when it comes.

You don't have any moral high ground, though.

The thing is, when people are in EA's and deny the affair because it didn't go physical, they miss the most important element that distinguishes a serious commitment, the emotional connection and intimacy. It's often only when their spouses ask them how they would feel if the tables were turned that they start to understand the reality.

So now you've had the tables turned. You see your W with another man, happy and not putting you front and center. You haven't seen them having sex - you may have no proof that they are - but you see the connection and you are very angry.

So now you know what it feels like. If you love your W, you messed up in a huge way. A full year with her in bed like that. Didn't it occur to you that something was seriously wrong? To me it sounds like you were happy to tuck her in so you could play with K.

Sorry, you blew it in a very big way & really, really hurt your W.

So, you can be angry, but it can't be self-righteous anger.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Mr. Man, sorry but you failed the ultimate test of loyalty. When your wife was sending up smoke signals that she needed you you preferred to take care of you first. You bypassed her needs for K. Didn't K have something better to do with someone else? You have now experienced another woman the way you experienced your wife which nullifies your emotional relationship with her. The only reason you seem to be concerned now is because someone else got her smoke signals, which renders you a little too late...
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Well no not only , the anger l feel , do l have that right to feel it though after the mess l made.
lt will effect everything and l don't know how l should be treating her after today.

yeah l missed them alright and selfishly . but now not that l'm defending what l did but she had been also missing my smoke for 2 or 3 yrs .
l'd been to hell and won the battle for her . Our finances were coming good , we got a beautiful property for my daughters home , l started a business and coming good . lt was a fight and a 1/2 and there were so many times along that l needed things from her that she just didn't get either you see.
 

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My STBXW had an EA which morphed into a PA. Long story, won't re-hash it. Bottom line is that I found out about the EA and had no clue about the PA. It didn't really matter. The EA was devastating to our marriage because of the betrayal of trust involved and the lies. My STBXW was sharing thoughts and secrets with the POSOM which she previously shared exclusively with me. She was complaining about her marriage and me to the POSOM. She was expending ALL of her emotional energy and a LOT of her affection on her EA. it was during this time when my gut told me something was wrong, but my sense of denial blinded me to the truth.

The betrayal of trust, the stealing of emotions, the feeling of being blindsided, stabbed in the back, the anger over the lies were greater (for me) when I discovered the EA than when my STBXW finally confessed to the PA.

After an EA is established, moving it to a PA is just a tiny step. The betrayal has already been done.
 

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I guess the one defining difference between an EA and a PA that we can all agree on is that the EA lacks physical sex, or for some more specifically genital penetration.

These are the problems that I see in a relationship that I call an EA
1. misplaced loyalties. You trust your EA more than your spouse whether it relates to trustworthiness or ability to do something.
2. Your EA affects your mood more and it shows. You're up when she's up; you're down she's down.
3. You're more generous to your EA than with your spouse. that can be with money, buying her gifts; taking her to expensive places, even if your wife joins you, if your EA weren't with the two of you, might you have chosen a cheaper restaurant.
You're more inclined to do more favors for your EA either around her house, for example, or professional favors, networking and what not.
4. You use the EA as a sounding board for important decisions within your marriage. For example, every time you and your spouse, argue, you may look to your EA for her opinion, whether it's forgivable and so on.....


Maybe I can think of some other things.

the other problem with an EA is that it can be a prelude to a PA. Women would prefer it that way so that an emotional connect would already be established.
Men might prefer it that way so that they use the emotional connection as an excuse for going on autopilot and having sex.

But it is interesting, if you have not been burned by an EA,you may not give it much thought. I was looking at another message board where some women were defending going out with their ex for dinner despite having a current boyfriend. their attitude was, we're not having sex, so what's the problem?
 
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