[northland]

Affair partners are never blameless.

It is the OM responsibility to make sure what he is getting into. Ignorance is no excuse. He went after a married woman with children.

Lets be realistic. A guy meets a woman, she tells him her marriage is over, a divorce is pending, and it's only a matter of time. What's he supposed to do, subpoena her for court records?

I guess he could DEMAND to see the divorce paperwork, and she could reasonably say it's none of his business, he can either trust her word or take a hike and I'd think most guys would shrug and say "ok, that's fine" and they wouldn't be out of line for doing so.

It's NOT the guys responsibility to do some sort of background check or hire a private investigator to ascertain that his new dating partner is telling the truth about her failed marriage and there's no law that says a guy cannot date a woman who is not officially divorced.

 

[Acabado]

northland, read this and OP's others threads.
It's very unlikely OM didn't know she was married and living with his husband. He likely knew from the very beggining. Indeed WS usualy bond by meeting the needs they say lack in the currrent relationship, BSs are demonized, they become saviors... He surely was perfectly aware of their living arrangements, their childrens lives... of course with the "filters" up.
It's not about seeing the D paperwork. It's about not intruding in a troubled relationship yo begin with, and this is a long marriage wich involve children!
Refusing to admit APs' accountability in the final dismissal of the marriage scapes me.
It's like letting a bank robber off the hook becasuse he had a "inside man".
Every relationship and a set of problems, ups and downs. You just don't intrude taking adventage of a "down", specially with children in the mix. It's not cool at all. It speaks about OM's character. No doubt.
They only AP who are blameless are the one completely lied to (believed they were single and free to date).

 

[sarcasmo]

Lets be realistic. A guy meets a woman, she tells him her marriage is over, a divorce is pending, and it's only a matter of time. What's he supposed to do, subpoena her for court records?

I guess he could DEMAND to see the divorce paperwork, and she could reasonably say it's none of his business, he can either trust her word or take a hike and I'd think most guys would shrug and say "ok, that's fine" and they wouldn't be out of line for doing so.

It's NOT the guys responsibility to do some sort of background check or hire a private investigator to ascertain that his new dating partner is telling the truth about her failed marriage and there's no law that says a guy cannot date a woman who is not officially divorced.

The bulk of the blame squarely falls on my STBXW's back. She is the one pursuing him, driving all over creation to be with him. That is a fact. Everything else is hearsay. Is POSOM getting divorced? Is his wife crazy? What does POSOM's family really know about my STBXW? What has STBXW told him? What has POSOM told her?

I have what my STBXW tells me, but as everyone here agrees, you can't trust any of that info. Any way you look at it, this POS sees the gray area and decides to live in it with my STBXW. He is responsible just by making that choice alone.

 

[northland]

^^ Exactly. Focus on your STBXW not the OM. He's not the problem, she is.

Although you meant to say "can't trust any of that info".

You mistakenly wrote that you CAN trust.

At least I hope that was a mistake

 

[sarcasmo]

northland, read this and OP's others threads.
It's very unlikely OM didn't know she was married. He likely knew from the very beggining.

This. The POS met me at my house. He knew we were married. Does he know the status of our marriage, no. Not like we tell every delivery boy that we are separated or divorcing, but the POS knew we were married when they started this bullsh*t.

 

[Entropy3000]

OM is not to blame if he didn't know she was married. If he knew she was married, then you have to look at it as a man trying to take your woman. However a man can't take your woman unless your woman allows it.

However how would you look at it, as someone who doesn't like you who gets your wife to betray you? Probably want to kick both of their a$$e$?

You can do whatever you want to do as long as it doesn't waste too much time in your life.

You have your thoughts and I have mine. My thoughts are that both are accountable. I am not so limited that I have to assign accountability to one person only. No way I am buying that the OM did not know she was married and that there were no kids. But it is on him to know what he is getting into. These are adults, not children.

I have no idea why some folks seem to think also holding the AP accountable is somehow letting the WS off the hook. That is their limitation though. Would not be mine. But this si why I said that exposure should have occurred long ago. Affairs die in the light of day. Plausible denial dies in the light of day.

I know it is trendy these days to give predators a free pass. I would not. YMMV. I would go all revelations personally but that is just me.

Conflict avoidance is its own reward. No one is blameless in an affair. The APs own it and those that enable it suffer from their own inaction.

 

[Entropy3000]

Lets be realistic. A guy meets a woman, she tells him her marriage is over, a divorce is pending, and it's only a matter of time. What's he supposed to do, subpoena her for court records?

If he continues he does so with risk. That risk could be anything. He is not innocent. Let's not just be realistic but also be adults. It is on him. Wahtever she does is on her. This is not high school games. There are children involved. I am just saying that some of us take this very seriouly. Many do not. I am being pragmatic. It is not about right and wrong even. You mees with another persons spouse you run a risk. He is accountable for his behavior.

I guess he could DEMAND to see the divorce paperwork, and she could reasonably say it's none of his business, he can either trust her word or take a hike and I'd think most guys would shrug and say "ok, that's fine" and they wouldn't be out of line for doing so.

You could do anything you want. The risk is all yours.

It's NOT the guys responsibility to do some sort of background check or hire a private investigator to ascertain that his new dating partner is telling the truth about her failed marriage and there's no law that says a guy cannot date a woman who is not officially divorced.

Indeed it is his responsibilty. Life is full of choices. This is a proceed at your own peril choice.

Predators have an agenda to minimize and even glorify preying on married people. Some get away with it and some do not. Passive guys are not good at holding anyone accountable. But I repeat, the OP should have exposed long ago. Being up front and direct and having boundaries cuts through all of this mind game stuff. To be clear my point is that no matter what any internet forum polling or thoughts on this, the amount of risk that a person puts them in when they are a predator has to do with the BS view of right and wrong. No one elses. So a guy who picks out a married woman and intends to make this a way of life is sooner or later going to bang the wrong guys wife. This guy knew she was married. And he probably made a judgement on the risk he was taking.

 

[tom67]

Predators have an agenda to minimize and even glorify preying on married people. Some get away with it and some do not. Passive guys are not good at holding anyone accountable. But I repeat, the OP should have exposed long ago. Being up front and direct and having boundaries cuts through all of this mind game stuff. To be clear my point is that no matter what any internet forum polling or thoughts on this, the amount of risk that a person puts them in when they are a predator has to do with the BS view of right and wrong. No one elses. So a guy who picks out a married woman and intends to make this a way of life is sooner or later going to bang the wrong guys wife. This guy knew she was married. And he probably made a judgement on the risk he was taking.

How long before he drops her and on to his next "conquest".

 

[Entropy3000]

How long before he drops her and on to his next "conquest".

No telling. He may intend to keep her. Who knows?

He may just be getting off on taking her from the OP. But the carnage is the carnage.

 

[sarcasmo]

No telling. He may intend to keep her. Who knows?

He may just be getting off on taking her from the OP. But the carnage is the carnage.

I know this isn't the popular opinion around here, but I've met this POS. I truly believe she is pursuing him. He's just happy to have the attention from a hot lil chicky 8 years younger than him. I don't think he's going anywhere. His actions are deplorable, but I don't think he's the predator type.

Please don't look at this as me apologizing for him He is the scum of the earth and I'm going to treat him like that. I have no compassion for him.

 

[treyvion]

I know this isn't the popular opinion around here, but I've met this POS. I truly believe she is pursuing him. He's just happy to have the attention from a hot lil chicky 8 years younger than him. I don't think he's going anywhere. His actions are deplorable, but I don't think he's the predator type.

Please don't look at this as me apologizing for him He is the scum of the earth and I'm going to treat him like that. I have no compassion for him.

8 years younger, big deal. Thing about it, is if she is pursuing him, how in the hell can you stop her and why should you blame him, unless he is encouraging it, knowing she's married.

 

[LongWalk]

Lets be realistic. A guy meets a woman, she tells him her marriage is over, a divorce is pending, and it's only a matter of time. What's he supposed to do, subpoena her for court records?

I agree with Northland on this point. People are getting separated, married and divorced all the time. The idea that some people are off limits is much weaker today. A civil marriage ceremony probably includes no definition of what most people assume a marriage commitment means. Simply put infidelity is not a crime.

No one is arrested for adultery. Moreover, even the civil consequences are small. Fault is not an issue in many states and countries.

Therefore, the issue of married people being seduced, predatory, etc. is not that big a deal. As Mach likes to put it a husband can be retroactively divorced in the court of the rationalization hamster as OM slides his hand into WW's panties for the first time.

When someone is waiting for D to be finalized, sexual relations outside of marriage is no longer cheating to most people.

 

[Blue Firefly]

I know this isn't the popular opinion around here, but I've met this POS. I truly believe she is pursuing him. He's just happy to have the attention from a hot lil chicky 8 years younger than him. I don't think he's going anywhere. His actions are deplorable, but I don't think he's the predator type.

Please don't look at this as me apologizing for him He is the scum of the earth and I'm going to treat him like that. I have no compassion for him.

Who cares why he's doing it.

If he walked up to you and suddenly cut your arm off with a machete, would analyze why he did it, or would you take immediate action to prevent him from cutting off your other arm?

If he cut off your child's head with a machete, would you be looking to make excuses for him?

The damage he is doing to your family--you and your children--is no less real than the physical damage above. And (imho), no less serious. You and your children will be seriously scarred for life because of his actions.

...I don't think he's the predator type.

People are defined by their actions, not their intentions.

His actions are those of a predator--he is taking another man's wife away from him.

He's a predator--period.

I have no compassion for him.

Horse hockey. You've been making excuses for him all along.

You clearly don't have the one thing for him that is required to solve your problems: hatred.

Are you incapable of hating somebody? Literally, is there some voice in the back of your head that says "it's wrong to hate; everybody deserves the benefit of the doubt"?

It is not wrong to hate. God hates; the Bible instructs us that there are things in life we should hate. What he is doing is one of them; he deserves your hate.

It's OK to hate him.

 

[Entropy3000]

I agree with Northland on this point. People are getting separated, married and divorced all the time. The idea that some people are off limits is much weaker today. A civil marriage ceremony probably includes no definition of what most people assume a marriage commitment means. Simply put infidelity is not a crime.

No one is arrested for adultery. Moreover, even the civil consequences are small. Fault is not an issue in many states and countries.

Therefore, the issue of married people being seduced, predatory, etc. is not that big a deal. As Mach likes to put it a husband can be retroactively divorced in the court of the rationalization hamster as OM slides his hand into WW's panties for the first time.

When someone is waiting for D to be finalized, sexual relations outside of marriage is no longer cheating to most people.

Ask Mach what happens in that circumstance when a husband decides that it matters. Good luck.

Maybe this is a cultural thing. I am not used to this passivity in men.

 

[LongWalk]

Who cares why he's doing it.

If he walked up to you and suddenly cut your arm off with a machete, would analyze why he did it, or would you take immediate action to prevent him from cutting off your other arm?

If he cut off your child's head with a machete, would you be looking to make excuses for him?

The damage he is doing to your family--you and your children--is no less real than the physical damage above. And (imho), no less serious. You and your children will be seriously scarred for life because of his actions.



People are defined by their actions, not their intentions.

His actions are those of a predator--he is taking another man's wife away from him.

He's a predator--period.



Horse hockey. You've been making excuses for him all along.

You clearly don't have the one thing for him that is required to solve your problems: hatred.

Are you incapable of hating somebody? Literally, is there some voice in the back of your head that says "it's wrong to hate; everybody deserves the benefit of the doubt"?

It is not wrong to hate. God hates; the Bible instructs us that there are things in life we should hate. What he is doing is one of them; he deserves your hate.

It's OK to hate him.

:iagree:

This is completely sound. I am not certain that the word predator is right. It suggest images of a pedophile and there is no evidence of that, although you should always worry about the motives of any dude who takes over the children of another man.

I prefer the word "competitor".

It is alright to hate a competitor. After all this is not darts, whist or basketball, we are talking about. He is stealing your mate and children to boot.

You may not hate him now because you are not a hating kind of guy, but you will hate him when your children call him "daddy" and you "father".

The hatred will be even worse if you pay child support but are not allowed to see your kids 50/50.

 

[Entropy3000]

:iagree:

This is completely sound. I am not certain that the word predator is right. It suggest images of a pedophile and there is no evidence of that, although you should always worry about the motives of any dude who takes over the children of another man.

I prefer the word "competitor".

It is alright to hate a competitor. After all this is not darts, whist or basketball, we are talking about. He is stealing your mate and children to boot.

You may not hate him now because you are not a hating kind of guy, but you will hate him when your children call him "daddy" and you "father".

The hatred will be even worse if you pay child support but are not allowed to see your kids 50/50.

The dude that breaks into my home and threatens my family is not a competitor. They are a predator and are dealt with harshly.

So is a man who conspires to destroy my family. He gets treated with the same care. But there do seem to be a number of guys who post here who do not feel this way. LOL. I do not think that is a sample of your average husband.

But for this thread it really does not matter. So continue on.

 

[CEL]

This is kinda getting sidetracked on the whole predator or not thing and really it makes not difference what you want to call him just like it would not matter a hoot whether the OM's name is John or Bob. Simple questing have you filed yet? If not why? You marriage is gone, dead, buried and the bones have been gnawed on by dogs. File the papers just like in a fight better to get the first punch in she has had you on the ropes and you have taken some mighty big blows but nows the time to do some dirty boxing with a good elbow to the face. FILE the PAPERS.

Hope you see the other end oh and I also hope you give as good as you have gotten.:smthumbup:

 

[ThePheonix]

Predators have an agenda to minimize and even glorify preying on married people.

Here's the reason I don't recommend worrying lot about the other other man (woman) and holding the other accountable. A person that pursues married people are generally POS as most say. I ran with married women for years and "bagged" a number of them. But for all my indiscretion, not once did I chase them. They let me know they were seeking attention. If you don't think women send signals they a open to approach you are wrong. Believe me, you seduce single girls. The married ones seduce you.
I started out when a female co-worker who set me up with several of her married female friends. A couple of these girls would invite me to go to Panama City Fl with them on a girls weekend out with full knowledge of the other girls on the trip.
One girls husband came down on one such outing and the other girls covered for her saying I was with one of them who was divorced.
When you have a wife that's on the prowl, can you really put a lot of accountability on the guy. Isn't she the one, and not him, that is betraying you. If a married girl want to play, some guy within her reach is going to oblige her.

 

[LongWalk]

This is kinda getting sidetracked on the whole predator or not thing and really it makes not difference what you want to call him just like it would not matter a hoot whether the OM's name is John or Bob. Simple questing have you filed yet? If not why? You marriage is gone, dead, buried and the bones have been gnawed on by dogs. File the papers just like in a fight better to get the first punch in she has had you on the ropes and you have taken some mighty big blows but nows the time to do some dirty boxing with a good elbow to the face. FILE the PAPERS.

Hope you see the other end oh and I also hope you give as good as you have gotten.:smthumbup:

:iagree:
File asap

 

[sarcasmo]

This is kinda getting sidetracked on the whole predator or not thing and really it makes not difference what you want to call him just like it would not matter a hoot whether the OM's name is John or Bob. Simple questing have you filed yet? If not why? You marriage is gone, dead, buried and the bones have been gnawed on by dogs. File the papers just like in a fight better to get the first punch in she has had you on the ropes and you have taken some mighty big blows but nows the time to do some dirty boxing with a good elbow to the face. FILE the PAPERS.

Hope you see the other end oh and I also hope you give as good as you have gotten.:smthumbup:

Monday. We are meeting with two Divorce Mediators. I assume we'll just start the process with the first one and get this over with.