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What do you think?

  • Am I right in this and should run as far away as possible?

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  • Should I continue to try to help a man that feels he is perfect and needs no help?

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  • Should I stick it out too and hope that things get better?

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  • Should I become a lesbian after this experience? LMAO!

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Discussion Starter #1
Wow. I am married to a child. We have been married for 2 years and we got married for very unconventional reasons - not love - at least on my side. He knew this and didn't care. Now he's hurt because he just now learned of this????? Okaaaaay....

I am the type of person that likes to help others. The last 2 years of our marriage, that's all I have done - or tried to do. This man is irresponsible with money. He is an ostrich when it comes to conflict - sticking his head in the sand when any trouble arises. He comes from a very large family of arguers. He has a beast for an ex-wife who has beat us both now into a pulp financially and I was the one that had to handle the case as he hid his head yet again.

Lately - every discussion we try to have about anything turns into a screaming match. I already have very high blood pressure and am afraid this relationship will ultimately kill because he literally pushes me into rage with his ignorance.

He argues with me about stupid issues - swears at me, deflects everything I say to him back to me, everything is always my fault. He says I am mean to him. He actually told me on our anniversary that he demanded respect and kindness from me or he was filing for divorce. Then he follows with "I don't really mean that - I just know what else to do". or "I say that out of anger".

I personally believe that he has never grown up. He's a 43 yr old man that had been alone pretty much for 10 years before I came along. When I met him, his ex had him under her thumb, his kids controlled him, he had no direction in life other than what everyone told him was his direction.

Being as I am, I thought this an opportunity to help someone become strong and stand up for them self. Now, here we are 2 years later: his kids don't speak to him (because they hate me), his ex wife STILL harasses us for money constantly, and now he thinks he's strong in defending himself against the only person that has tried to give to him and not take; ME. I have created a monster that must have been hidden away.

There is no respect anymore in this farce of a marriage. I'm jumpin on the first train out - mainly to salvage my own health. I cannot possibly live with a man who will respect everyone else's opinion but mine.

We got into a fight sooo bad yesterday I lost my voice from screaming at him and almost went into a blind rage because I just see him as so stupid, dumb, deaf and blind. I should have sympathy for him but I just don't. The sad thing is he is a very kind, giving, caring man. But I can't respect a coward. Even after I told him yesterday that I hated him and want him to move his stuff out of the bedroom - he still said to me before he went to bed: I'm so tired, I'm going to bed. G'night. Like nothing had happened! He said to me that he's just going to keep doing what he's been doing and not planning on leaving or divorcing in "hope that things get better". WTF?! I've been sleeping on the couch for a long time because I can't stand him anymore. I want out! (I'm waiting to hear on an awesome job prospect right now).

I can feel my frustration building as I write this so I'll quit why I'm ahead.
 

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This couldn't be more one-sided. You sound like you feel completely justified in how you feel and what you want to do.

You said somethings that sounds pretty weird. First you said you married him for reasons other than love. Then later you said there is no respect in your farce of a marriage. If you married for reasons other than love the marriage was a farce to begin with. What is surprising is that you think, or thought, it could be anything other than a farce.

You also said he was alone for 10 years but his ex is ruining your finances and you had to take over the case? So for 10 years his ex was ruining him financially and you thought you could come in and control hi...I mean save him from this?

Judging by the tone of your post it really sounds like you got with someone you thought you could control and guess what, it turns out to be a little more complicated than that, and now that you know you can't control him, you want out.

I can only say thank GOD I am not this guy. lol...this forum at least provides relief in that sense.
 

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In trying to be responsible, rather than reading into this anything based on my own situation and marriage, I will refrain from voting in the poll or giving advice because there are questions that are raised. Particularly some of what "committed1" states above can ring a bell because of the way the post comes across.

I understand you may have been very very angry when you wrote the post and when that occurs it can sometimes come across differently than intended. Perhaps you can give some more detail or history here so we can responsibly advise and answer the poll.

Like:

You said you married for other than love. What was the reason you married him?

You said he claims to know this only now. Was this clear to him prior to getting married? If so how? Was there conversation about it? Was there an agreement between the two of you about it?

You say he comes from a family of arguers yet he buries his head in the sand when it comes to conflict. Can you elaborate? When you and him argue, does he ignore the problems or does he try to find resolutions with you?

You say his kids won't talk to him now because they hate you. Why? What is the situation with the kids? Who has custody? Do they visit? What role did you take on with his kids?

You say you saw an opportunity to help him. To stand and be strong. You married him knowing he was under his ex-wife's thumb. What has changed? Is he still like that? Is he becoming strong, standing for himself? Is that only with or against you? Or is it in other instances too?

Is your saying you can't respect a coward because he doesn't stand up against his ex-wife? His children? Is it because he is not responding as you believe he should? Doing what you want or expect him to do?

It's just difficult to give advice based on your initial post because there are a lot of things that are just not clear. It does come across, maybe erroneously, as one sided and as you knowing what you were getting into and just simply not being happy with it any longer and wanting out because it hasn't change to what you thought it would change to.

Do you have, or did you ever have, any love for your husband? Was love ever a factor in this marriage from your perspective?
 

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No one can "literally" push you into rage, for 2 reasons. First, no one can literally push anyone into a feeling; into a wall, yes, but not a feeling. Second, no one can "make" you feel anything. You decide how to feel, based on how you interpret a situation. You have decided that his helplessness is more than you can take, so you feel rage. If you thought his helplessness was adorable, you wouldn't feel rage (I'm not saying you should think it is adorable; I'm just using this to make a point). Our feelings our completely of our own making, but you are not accepting any responsibility for this. You made choices and assumed those choices would work out. They have not. You either adapt to the new reality, or you choose to be angry and frustrated, or you choose to leave. Have you even tried counseling? You personally could really benefit from some cognitive-behavioral therapy, from the sounds of it. Then (or at the same time) marital counseling. What do you have to lose?
 

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I thought this an opportunity to help someone become strong and stand up for them self....I cannot possibly live with a man who will respect everyone else's opinion but mine.
So you benevolently set out to help this man stand up for himself, and then when he does, albiet against you, you think he's a big jerk/loser/etc and divorce him?
 

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Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
Ok, I guess I need to explain a bit more as i'm definitely getting some negative feedback here. And yes, i did write my post in complete frustration and anger. i can't help it. I'm living in a hell right now i don't know how to get out of at the moment. I'm just at a complete loss.

I met my husband first on MySpace. He really caught my attention when he sent me a Vermont Teddy Bear for Mother's day. At the time I was working in the mortgage industry with a salary and commission and had been with this company for about 9 months or so.

Shortly after we met - I was handed a paycheck at work and informed at that very moment that that would be my last paycheck and that the company was stopping all salaries for loan officers effective immediately. I tried to explain to my boss that I didn't have enough loans going to sustain myself and pay for my daughter's daycare so i would have to start working from home. he said absolutely not and that if i couldn't be there during the day, that I would be out of a job.

At this same time, my rent jumped 150.00 per month, my daycare provider wanted more money, and I had no clue what to do. I couldn't afford the daycare so i found another job where i could work from home. But it was commission only. My daughter was starting school so I could work in the office during those times. I was losing my apartment, no one could help me with a place to live except for my husband. He ironically had just rented a nice big 3 br place that he needed help with rent anyway. It started as a roommate situation.

In the meantime - i was having health issues - with no insurance. I was concerned about cervical cancer because 5 years before I had gone through 2 different treatments to remove pre-cancerous cells from my cervix and because of my previous divorce and mortgage job issues - hadn't had insurance for over a year.

My husband was enamored with me from the get go. I thought he was a very sweet man that seemed to be doing well for himself. he had a union job and had bought himself a new truck recently. He would tell me all the time after we moved in that he was crazy about me and wanted to marry me. I kept saying that i would never get married again and that he should stop thinking that way. I started having more and more pain and was scared to death to go to the dr. I was even more afraid of the bills if in fact they did find cancer.
My husband kept saying that his insurance would cover me, that i wouldn't have anything to worry about - but I'd have to marry him to get on the insurance. Things got worse and worse and I had decided at that point to take the plunge...after all - he was a Christian man who didn't drink and he was crazy about me. Situations worse than this have worked out right? People get set up in marriages all the time by family members in other countries and they used to in the past...he didn't seem to have a mean bone in his body and he was sweet and very caring - this could work - right?

So we did it. We got married. I was VERY clear with him from the beginning. I even told him ON OUR WEDDING DAY at the courthouse that if things didn't work out that we would get it annulled in 6 months. he agreed. He knew I didn't love him and kept saying "well my love is enough for the both of us". He claimed to have known and understood. I also had it in the back of my mind that I would do my very best to be a great wife and would do my best to love him - despite the fact that I was still heartbroken over my last divorce- which he also knew EVERYTHING about. he claimed to understand because he had gone thru the same thing 10 years prior. I never once lied to him, hid my feelings, or misled him in any way.

I don't have cancer - but still need to be checked every 3 months and have biopsies done because there are legitimate concerns. I also have dangerously high cholesterol and bp and have to be on many medications.

The first job I spoke of that I had shut it's doors shortly after I left there. The next mortgage job I took was going really well and then abruptly and without notice - shut ITS doors only a year after I started there. the mortgage industry came crashing down and I have pretty much been unemployed ever since. I did start my own biz that was going great until obama took over. Now it's completely dead. my husband has also been laid off over and over - at this time he's been laid off now for the past 4 months.

So we've struggled terribly financially. The problem with this is he wanted to sit around and wait to be called back to work. He fought with me about finding another for 2 whole months last year. And I mean we fought. he couldn't see how getting another job would solve anything. We had the same exact fight this year again - except this time he actually heard me and now is glad he took a limo driving job. He loves it and is making almost as much doing that just on the weekends as he does in a week with his union job - but it's not guaranteed and can vary greatly from week to week. But I had to cry for 6 months first while delivering pizza for Pizza Hut just to help him pay his support. he cried to because he couldn't stand to see me do that - but wouldn't do anything about it. The delivery job destroyed my car and when summer came and my daughter was off school - it didn't pay for me to work there anymore so I quit.

This year when he got laid off again - as I said earlier - he listened to me only after arguing with me for 2 weeks this time.

His ex wife controlled him when we first got together. She would call him on a daily basis threatening him if he didn't get her all the money she had coming to her for their one child. He admitted he was terribly afraid of her and would do whatever she asked so she wouldn't keep taking him back to court. He would fix her computer (even though she was remarried to the man she cheated on him with and got pregnant with this other mans child while she was still married to my now husband). He would do odd jobs for her and hand her cash for support - ultimately putting himself in arrears because it never got reported. I didn't start to see any of this stuff until 3 months into our marriage. Then his kids - I started to see how they walked all over him constantly. He had no control over his life, his kids, his finances, his job - nothing. I couldn't believe the messes I kept unearthing with every turn. it was like everyone that was in his life kept him under their thumb - and he allowed it.

I then heard a story about how he had this friend in his early teen years that would molest him. My husband stayed friends with this guy who was molesting him for like 3 years!!! when I asked him why - he stated "I don't know. I guess i just wanted him to like me and thought it would stop".

This story goes on and on and on....do you want me to keep going?
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I'll keep going anyway because I want this out and I do need some honest feedback. I'm not a mean controlling woman. I am strong, I am typically very independent, and I'm pretty intelligent when it comes to life, people and so much more. I've been through the ringer and back before I had met my husband - but that's another book ;)

Ok....soooo.....his kids: his one daughter had a problem with me from day one. She was an adult when I came into the picture. During one of our very first conversations she made the comment to me (and I thought this very odd coming from a 20 year old) "well! You're very confident aren't you?" Like that was a bad thing or something. This same daughter was my friend on MySpace and started making rude comments (I think out of jealousy) about things my own daughter and I would say to each other on MySpace. So rude in fact, her father called her over here to work things out with me. She came on Christmas Eve - refused to speak to me at all - giving her dad the doe eyes the whole time. When he stood up for me in things she was saying, she then wanted to leave in which I blocked the door and told her that she was not leaving until we worked this out. She said "**** off" to me and acted like I was going to hit her. I let her leave at that point so bewildered by her actions and found out later she took out someone's mailbox out of anger.

His son is a very spoiled coddled 14 year old with little manners, very selfish, and also had made very rude comments to me, treated my 7 yr old like crap and whenever he was confronted on anything would throw a tantrum like a 2 year old. Since his mother lives 3 blocks from us - he would run away every time there was any kind of argument about his outrageous behaviors - like running through the house screaming like a girl when he got grossed out by something. He stopped coming over when his mother told him to tell me that she is a much better mother than me because she has so much more experience in it than I do. We had a talk with him and he decided he didn't like our rules or how we "treated" him. My husband admitted at this point he was never a very stern father. Everyone else tells me he always tried to be their "friend" as well. Not a good situation - for me, them, my kids, or him.

At this point, the ex got much worse. MUCH much much worse! One of the last conversations I had with her she actually told that she would rather see my daughter starve and us out on the streets then her son go without. Her son (also my husbands son) is in piano lessons, dance classes - they go on trips 4 times a year to Wisconsin Dells, they shoot off thousands of dollars of fireworks every year for the neighborhood, his son wears designer clothes and shoes, they just recently bought a house. All of this while she had my husband's unemployment wages intercepted by 50% to pay support: she gets 800 a month for their son, and we get 800 a month to live on (plus my support of 500).
Police are here constantly serving us with papers.
I worked on his case for 3 months straight to get all of his paperwork in order because he had no sense of organization at all. We couldn't afford an attorney and he had no clue what to do about it all - so it got ultimately put into my lap. I wanted to protect him, myself, and my kids at that point. the ex had shown herself over and over to be a liar, controlling, vindictive, nasty, - so much so that we had even tried to have a restraining order put on her. Because our county courthouse is extremely and popularly known for being biased - we got no where (there's some laws there I've been working with state reps on to change and have the courthouse investigated).

About 8 months into our marriage (jumping around here a bit) I started noticing that my husband loved to argue with me. I would say something about how things that he did hurt me. It started to become my fault.....more and more and more...because I'm so "mean" to him. Ultimately - as I see it now - it became a situation of me taking charge of a 43 year old's life because he has never learned to deal effectively with conflict and just lets whatever happen because it's simply too stressful for him. I've only ever had the intention of helping him to be strong and defend himself in these situations. But it's never turned out that way. Doubling my stress fighting his battles for him to protect my family from his self inflicted baggage.

And after all this - he bucks me off no matter what I say to him now.

Here's an example of what my life is like now: yesterday - you know - when I went into that rage? Yeah....imagine this:

He tells me because he's got this 2nd limo job that he hasn't even started yet - that is currently being bought out by another company - that he's now stopped calling around for union work again. I tried to explain to him that it's not good to put all your eggs in one basket and that he should always have a plan "b". He gave me that look of "you're on crack" again - which I absolutely hate - and said to me "I don't understand - that doesn't make any sense". that look that he gave me alone started to set me off because we had a huge fight just a week prior to this and one 2 weeks before that! So I tried to explain to him what I was saying and he still wasn't getting it and he gave me the usual "I don't know what you want me to do. Nothing is ever good enough for you - what you're saying makes no sense at all". My anger flares, then he starts the "**** you"s and then he ultimately becomes a parrot - mimicking everything I say to him. If I say to him "why don't you hear me? why don't you listen to me?" I get "why don't you listen to ME?!" and so on and so forth.

He told me yesterday that he just doesn't know what to do with our marriage anymore but he's just gonna keep doing what he's doing work wise and hope everything gets better. WTF? I told him I hated him yesterday in my rage because I really am feeling that way now. He walks around in complete denial of this - thinking that I say this out of anger because he says things like that out of anger. I mean this ****! when I scream in someone's face that I hate them - chances are I mean it! I can't stand to be around him anymore. I have lost any respect I've had for him. I've told him that I've tried to love him but he makes it very difficult. He doesn't want to be treated like a child - yet acts like one. I have literally become this man's mother and I deserve so much more than what I'm being given.
I've tried to tell him that maybe he has some unresolved issues from that relationship with that guy or maybe his marriage before - but then the mimicking comes out again. I'M the one who needs help - I'M the one who causes his behavior - I'M the one who starts all the fights - I'M the one that is ungrateful - I'm constantly "trying to control him" and I'm always being so "mean" to him. WTF?

We've established this: he wants me to stop being so uptight about everything and be like him....ummm...NO and i want him to be a man in this relationship and to handle conflict more productively!!!

I gotta say - the past 2.5 years with him have literally drained me. Emotionally and physically - I am just freakin tired as all get out. Just plum wore out!

I am a patient woman, I am a giving woman - but I feel he's exhausted all resources available. He actually told me on our anniversary - after he said "**** you" to me and then 5 minutes later asked me to wash his pants - that he wanted more respect and to be treated kinder or he wanted a divorce. THEN he turned around and said he didn't really mean that - that he was angry when he said that! OMG?????? Seriously????? Wow.... Hope that gives y'all a little more insight to my frustration.
 

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Brattyx2-

I read all of that and now it does seem allot less one-sided. Sorry if I came off as harsh before, I am with someone that is controlling but wants me to take control at the same time so there was frustration in my post also. In my case, it is just a matter of overpowering her with sheer will.

Ok, it really sounds like both of you come into the marriage thinking the other would take care of them and now that is turning out to not be the case. You obviosuly love your husband even though you say you don't- (grain of salt time, just my observations) and you are hurt by things he says and does.

I want to say that your hubby needs to man up, come up with a logical, acheivable plan for making things financially right, and carry it out, period. On the other hand, I have personally been in situations with my W where she doesn't want me to do what is nescessary to make things right, but she also doesn't want things to not be right.

Like, "we need to make another $1,000 a month? Ok, I'll work the overtime and spam my resume + salary requirements to every employer in my field until I land the job that is + $1,000 what we are making now, then I can stop working the OT at this job." Then shes like, "But I don't want you to work all that OT, theres no time for me worked into that..."

Our situation is somewhat similar because when my wife and I got together I owned a growing business and was doing very well financially, we had two kids and the economy went into tank, my customers went belly up (it was a business to business company) and as a result my company went belly up. So things have been very rough financially since then though for the past 6 months they have been much much better (promotion at work) but not quite where we want things to be.

I hope your not doing that to your man. Does he have a plan? Is it at all realistic/do-able or is he saying stuff like he is going to become a ninja and work as a secret-agent for the Russians and you'll be millionaires?

Wish I had some productive advice for you, but I don't. Some strong vibes from your post though- you DO sound quite mean :p but also full of life, a good sense of humor, very articulate, probably a generally cool person....on the other side, you say you hate him but really why are you posting here if you don't care? People you don't care about don't affect the way you feel...you care about him in some sick way, it really shows through your words...its cliche and maybe kind of corny too, but love and hate are flip sides of the same coin.

You are there and I don't see you going anywhere, and for as much as you tell yourself you didn't marry from love, I really think that is just something you talked yourself into believing- for whatever reason, I don't know, but the way your post comes across, that is what I get out of it.

So there you are, now you have to look at it from a really practical standpoint. One of you has to come up with a plan to make the finances work, and stick to that plan no matter what.
If he won't do it, you have to be the one to do it. Also, you have to consider your quality of life. I sense a twisted kind of satisfaction in your present situation. You are saying you are drained and unhappy, but really the way you express yourself indicates a person full of energy and life and flavor.

Yes you deserve better, but not from him, from yourself. Likewise with him. The difference is (from what you've said) you actually seem to want to improve your quality of life and he sounds content. Maybe find a way to shake him from that contentedness? The screaming won't do it. Screaming at someone...you might as well just tell them calmly they are so incredibly important to you that they are worth totally losing your composure over and focusing ALL of you most intense emotional attention on THEM. That is what you givee him when you scream at him, or when you two argue.

Don't argue, don't fight. Do what needs done and reward him with affection when he goes along with the plan and punish with total cold ignorance when he doesn't. Cold ignorance as in ignore him, don't give him attention.

Good luck!
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Thanks for your post Committed....

You mention sick and twisted quite a bit in your post. I find that funny. I look at it as merely a woman who is doing what she needs to survive.

The reason I'm still here is because I can't find work. I have a couple of prospects I'm working on now and praying for one of them to pay off - but for right now - I couldn't support myself or my daughter if I tried. I have no one else to help us out except my husband so I stay and tolerate as best I can the unhappiness I deal with here.

You mention that I'm mean. To some I suppose I can appear that way. To others I'm a strong woman who knows what she wants and isn't afraid to voice her opinion.

I don't expect anything out of my husband that is out of the ordinary. When I say he's a weak minded and weak hearted man - I'm not kidding. He is very irresponsible and the fact that I have to tell him to work at all when I can't find a job is beyond my comprehension. Bills have to get paid, mouths have to be fed, cars have to be tended to....and when your ex wife is taking 1/2 of your salary/income for child support - it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that something needs to be done!

You mention your wife wanting to have a certain standard of living and then complaining about the hours you'd have to work....I don't get that at all. She sounds just unhappy period and like she doesn't have a clue as to what she wants. I am not that way. If he's gotta work 80 hrs a week until I get a job because he's got a standard of living he wants (like a truck he can't afford) - then so be it. I have had to give up many things to adjust to my financial situation - it's just common sense. I never have a problem with him being gone. I help him out when needed and I take care of him when needed (which is most of the time) and that's fine. That's my role right now. It's not what I necessarily want right now but I deal with it.

He can be a very good man - no doubt about it. And I do care for him. Do I love him? No. I simply cannot love someone I have no respect for. Other women tell me he needs more time to be trained...HA! I've trained enough men in my life....now I just simply want someone to be my PARTNER in life, not my child or student. I'm just getting too old for this stuff!

I think my anger and frustration stems from sheer disappointment - disappointment in him for not being the man he told me he was. And disappointment in myself for settling for this. I'm better than this and I know it. But as my foster mother tells me "you made your bed, now lie in it". That's what I'm doing I guess. I can't help but dream about leaving though when I finally do get a job! The funny thing is Committed - you don't know this but MANY women feel this way in their marriages! I've heard it over and over for years in different conversations with others.

Christmas came and went without any gifts from him - nothing but lame excuses. Whatever.

When you say he needs to "man up" - you hit it on the head. That's the one thing you said that made the most sense. I've come to realize that some men - even though they say they don't like being alone - also don't want the responsibility of a family...And I guess I feel the same way now. I don't want the responsibility of a man any longer. I would rather be a single mom and have peace in my life than this. It would be a struggle financially, but being part of this emotional roller coaster and the sheer frustration of his ex wife and his own inability to handle conflict can be far too much to bear sometimes. There have been days....let me tell you.

It makes complete sense to me why studies show women who are single live much longer than those who are married. Sadly - the opposite is true for men. Just goes to show the imbalance and imperfections in most relationships. Men are better off married - where women are not. Crazy.... speaks volumes don't you think?:scratchhead:
 
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