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Yeah, I think this thread is being diverted. My advice is this: OP, stop crying. Stop begging. If you love your wife, go after her. When you get to her, don't make up excuses and whine about what you have done. You did it because you wanted to. Crying about how bad you feel for having done so will probably make her hate you even more. You can apologize for hurting her, but don't pretend like you were not in control of your actions. Be a man. Say "Yeah, I went to prostitutes because I am horny and love blow jobs. I knew all along that it would hurt you, but I did it anyway. It's a terrible thing that I am so selfish, but it seems I am. Having now lost you, I feel full of pain. I feel so much pain that I would definitely never go to another prostitute again if you can come back to me. So, this is what I have to say. I am hoping you can see past this thing and find me in your heart, because you have always been here in mine."

And then don't try to be a cool guy and walk away. Stay there till she can decide on whether she wants to forgive you. I think it helps a lot to be visible when a woman is angry at you. But you need to be presenting your best side, not the side you've shown here.

So yeah, my advice in a nutshell: Take responsible and own up to the fact that you did what you did and loved every minute of it. At the same time, let your wife know that you really love her and that your love for her is much stronger than anything else. Tell her you just thought you could get away with it and have a little fun on the side, but you are caught and, now that you are facing the music, wouldn't risk losing her by doing something like this again. You're just some horny guy, but you do love her.
 

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OP you have already devastated your family through your selfish choices, don't make it 100 x worse by taking your life. That would be an incredibly selfish thing to do. All you would be doing is transferring your pain to them, and condemning them to a life wracked with guilt.

Man up, own your choices - you did NOT make a mistake, you made a CHOICE and you made it more than once. Own it. As others have said, if she files for divorce, give her whatever she wants, actions have consequences.

As for your children, they are naturally feeling protective of their mother. This is not their fight though, apologise to them, tell them that you know you hurt their mother and that you will do whatever she needs you to do, but remind them that this is between you and their mother.



This is absolutely NOT TRUE.
I so agree with you about that last quote.
 

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You have made a choice time after time after time for several years to cheat on your wife. I have no idea why you would think that your wife could possibly ever trust you again or have any respect for you. As for taking your life, you have devastated your family once and now you say you want to do it again? How completely selfish. Start thinking of them and not yourself.
If you are completely repentant then do what you wife wants. If possible move out to give them all space and accept that she will almost certainly want to end the marriage. If you make the effort for enough time, you may be able to rebuild some sort of relationship with the children.
 

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I think I just didn't understand it in your country's context. Where I live, many men go to prostitutes. Their wives know and no one really thinks much of it. Actually, I have friends from all over the world and most of them also have this in their cultures. I have friends from Russia, Ukraine, Pakistan, Morocco, all over. My Russian friend told me when he lived in Australia, they would go get oral sex every day during lunch. Personally, I don't have such a strong sex drive and find the idea of these women a bit gross. However, I have never considered my friends to be cheating on their wives with their actions. Also, so long as it does not become a problem, their wives' don't seem to care too much either. Even my own wife knows I have gone with friends to the brothels and she has never been upset about it.

-edit for clarity, I went and had massages while my friends took advantage of the other offerings. I've never slept with these prostitutes. I have no interest in this.-

Casual sex between a married man and some random woman is very different than casual sex between a married woman and some random man. It's evolutionary. Men provide protection and resources, women provide exclusive access to their wombs. This is the deal of the sexes. Many women would be angry with a man that didn't want a job, but far less men would be upset about a woman that wanted to stay at home. But, again, this may be cultural. I'm thinking you have a different idea of what the relationship between a man and a woman is. I don't think we should discuss this here. I have said what I had to say and will say no more in the OPs thread.
This is a second moderator warning.

The moderator Lila already posted a warning about continuing this thread jack. If you want to discuss whether or not using prostitutes is adultery, please start a thread on the topic. This this is for giving direct support to the OP, @ ImAnIdiot.

If you continue to ignore moderator warnings you just might receive a few days ban so you can contemplate how to pay attention to moderator warning and follow forum rules.

{Speaking as a moderator - EleGirl}
 

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People (rolleyes) It is the flag of China, but Frithy already said he goes to torrents so just by deduction, I suspect he may use a VPN or TOR to disguise his location. It's not so much sneaky as a way to remain private: you log in--it bounces you to any number of different countries--it looks like you're logging in from Carjackistan.

Now...back on topic, hey?
 

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Yeah, I think this thread is being diverted. My advice is this: OP, stop crying. Stop begging. If you love your wife, go after her. When you get to her, don't make up excuses and whine about what you have done. You did it because you wanted to. Crying about how bad you feel for having done so will probably make her hate you even more. You can apologize for hurting her, but don't pretend like you were not in control of your actions. Be a man. Say "Yeah, I went to prostitutes because I am horny and love blow jobs. I knew all along that it would hurt you, but I did it anyway. It's a terrible thing that I am so selfish, but it seems I am. Having now lost you, I feel full of pain. I feel so much pain that I would definitely never go to another prostitute again if you can come back to me. So, this is what I have to say. I am hoping you can see past this thing and find me in your heart, because you have always been here in mine."

And then don't try to be a cool guy and walk away. Stay there till she can decide on whether she wants to forgive you. I think it helps a lot to be visible when a woman is angry at you. But you need to be presenting your best side, not the side you've shown here.

So yeah, my advice in a nutshell: Take responsible and own up to the fact that you did what you did and loved every minute of it. At the same time, let your wife know that you really love her and that your love for her is much stronger than anything else. Tell her you just thought you could get away with it and have a little fun on the side, but you are caught and, now that you are facing the music, wouldn't risk losing her by doing something like this again. You're just some horny guy, but you do love her.
For a prostitution apologist this really isn't bad advice. Maybe not in such stark terms, maybe a little more contrite and humble but it's a good thing to be honest and not make excuses. The truth is you did it because you wanted to get off. Your wife knows this so crying and making excuses isn't going to work. It's your wife's call if you are worth it.

I wouldn't tell her you loved every minute of it though. Try to respect the pain it has caused her and will always cause her to some extent.
 

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Discussion Starter #51
Thanks to all the advises, I found some were very helpful, helped me understand what I should be doing and provided great encouragement for me to cope with it; however I must admit a couple of messages were a bit brutal which I don't think was much help (don't kick people when they're already down on the floor where they couldn't go any lower).
After 2 days of silence, we started communicating. At first, just her running in screaming, yelling then crying and left; after several times of this, we started talking, and talking, hours of talking. A lot of why? where? how?... On one hand, I felt horrible with great remorse to watch her going through all kinds of emotions during our conversations, but at the same time I felt a great relief that she was able to get everything off her chest instead of holding it in.
2 nights ago, I couldn't sleep, I think I had some kind of anxiety attack, I couldn't breathe, my heart felt tight. I wanted to see my wife so badly I went to our bedroom just to watch her sleep for a few minutes. I realized how I blinded I was, didn't realize until now that my true happiness is everything in this home. After about an hour, I got really tired and I was about to leave, my wife suddenly woke up, she asked what I was doing there, so I told her and apologized if I woke her up. She slowly moved over to her side of the bed and told me that I could lay down for a few minutes rest if I want. We talked a lot that night, then the next day all day. Last night, we did the same, lie quietly besides each other for awhile, then talking, and eventually fell asleep.
She was on an emotional roller coaster all day in the last couple of days, some time extremely mad, but no more screaming, just staring angrily a lot of times, some times just locked herself in a room, other times sobbing, and occasionally she hug me tight. She admitted that sometimes she really misses me, but as soon as she recalled the betrayal she just felt hatred. She said she can't forgive and will probably never forget, but she's giving our marriage a 2nd chance primarily because she's extremely concern about our kids and still have some feeling for me.
I tried to be as supportive as I can, I listened a lot, I answered her every time she asked. I'm not sure if it's part of a healing process or not, but I feel it's not helping, as she kept asking about details of those times I was unfaithful, then got angry after hearing the answers. I've been begging her to come with me to couple therapy but she flatly refused to do it. Not sure what else to do...
 

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When she asks those questions, be honest. Everytime, every bit of information. Do not leave anything out. No matter how many times she asks, no matter if she gets angry, sad or anything else, answer truthfully. And forget couples therapy at this point. Individual therapy for you should be step 1. She didn't F this up, you did.
 

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Thanks to all the advises, I found some were very helpful, helped me understand what I should be doing and provided great encouragement for me to cope with it; however I must admit a couple of messages were a bit brutal which I don't think was much help (don't kick people when they're already down on the floor where they couldn't go any lower).
After 2 days of silence, we started communicating. At first, just her running in screaming, yelling then crying and left; after several times of this, we started talking, and talking, hours of talking. A lot of why? where? how?... On one hand, I felt horrible with great remorse to watch her going through all kinds of emotions during our conversations, but at the same time I felt a great relief that she was able to get everything off her chest instead of holding it in.
2 nights ago, I couldn't sleep, I think I had some kind of anxiety attack, I couldn't breathe, my heart felt tight. I wanted to see my wife so badly I went to our bedroom just to watch her sleep for a few minutes. I realized how I blinded I was, didn't realize until now that my true happiness is everything in this home. After about an hour, I got really tired and I was about to leave, my wife suddenly woke up, she asked what I was doing there, so I told her and apologized if I woke her up. She slowly moved over to her side of the bed and told me that I could lay down for a few minutes rest if I want. We talked a lot that night, then the next day all day. Last night, we did the same, lie quietly besides each other for awhile, then talking, and eventually fell asleep.
She was on an emotional roller coaster all day in the last couple of days, some time extremely mad, but no more screaming, just staring angrily a lot of times, some times just locked herself in a room, other times sobbing, and occasionally she hug me tight. She admitted that sometimes she really misses me, but as soon as she recalled the betrayal she just felt hatred. She said she can't forgive and will probably never forget, but she's giving our marriage a 2nd chance primarily because she's extremely concern about our kids and still have some feeling for me.
I tried to be as supportive as I can, I listened a lot, I answered her every time she asked. I'm not sure if it's part of a healing process or not, but I feel it's not helping, as she kept asking about details of those times I was unfaithful, then got angry after hearing the answers. I've been begging her to come with me to couple therapy but she flatly refused to do it. Not sure what else to do...
That is how things will be for a very long time. It is how the betrayal is processed. It is so new and a shock. She can only process so much information at a time or she will break so she will ask again and again. Sometimes it is that she might stop being able to listen to anything you say after hearing something awful. Sometimes she will ask again to make sure the answers are the same. Answer truthfully each time and without annoyance, no “you already asked me this 100 times!”

It will take years for her to heal and I hope you have the patience for what is grueling experience for both the WS abs BS, but it is so much worse for the BS. To love and hate someone at the same time is mentally exhausting. When you show your WS anger you get scared you will drive them away. When you show them love you feel like you are betraying yourself and letting them get away with it. It is just truly awful.

I would caution you against recommending couples counseling at this point at all. You would think that most marriage counselors would be well versed in dealing with the aftermath of infidelity but most are clueless and cause more harm than good to a new BS. YOU go get counseling for you, by yourself. It will show her you are serious about changing.
 

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Healing from infidelity takes 2-5 YEARS. You haven't even scratched the surface. I'm 18 months into it and it's still a ****fest. So if you are in this for the long haul then buckle up, it's going to be a rough and bumpy ride that you will be begging to jump off at times.

Do you know why your wife comes to you then pushes you away? Because the ONE person she wants to be there for her and support her, is the one who hurt her and destroyed her world. It's very tough and mentally exhausting when the person you want is the person who hurt you.

You need to STOP asking your wife to go to marriage counseling. That is NOT what you need right now. You need to do individual counseling for a LONG time before MC is a good idea. You need to get to the bottom of why you did what you did, and fix those issues before you will be a safe partner. So, instead start searching for a good IC, and recommend she does the same. It would be good for her to have an IC so she can decide what questions she needs answers too and which are just for self-torture.

You need to keep telling her the answers and you need to be 100% honest. If she asks the same question 100 times, answer it every time. Do not leave any bits out to try and protect her, trust me it will do the opposite.
 

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@ImAnIdiot

I realize that you think you are the one who is "down" but we are hoping to wake you up to reality rather than minimizing and euphamisms. Okay? Remember...I was where you are and I don't judge you, yet I also don't make the words softer because the damage that was done was NOT SOFT. I don't want you to fall into thinking from the point of view of yourself and you and what you need, because that is the kind of thinking that got you here. In order to heal and do better, your way of thinking about marriage has to change. So I do get it--it sounds harsh, but sometimes reality is HARSH!

Next, I have some good resources for you. This first one is a PDF very short booklet to help you understand what your wife is going through: https://www.emotionalaffair.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Understanding-Your-Betrayed-Spouse.pdf . The second one is on my own blog and it lines out things that the cheating spouse can do to help their spouse and their marriage: What the Disloyal Spouse Can Do to Save Their Marriage

P.S. to add: There is a reason why she asks you the same questions over and over and over again. I use the example of a puzzle to explain it. Envision a 1000 piece puzzle and the image on the puzzle is one of you cheating on your wife--literally a picture of that. Now, YOU have all the pieces and you know that when the pieces are put together, the image will be you cheating! But your wife DID NOT have all the pieces and was not sure what the image was going to be. She maybe had the straight edges of the puzzle to frame in the image, and she had some pieces that were making an image that she THOUGHT was the image... but then she found several pieces that she knew where NOT part of the puzzle she had in mind!!! Now she is frantically trying to put the puzzle together and each time she asks she's getting another piece of the puzzle and seeing the image more and more clearly. If you hide the image from her, she will be gone--it's as easy as that. If she gets all the puzzle pieces she needs and sees the image clearly, she may decide to leave too, once she knows what she's dealing with. But right now, she asks over and over because she is gathering puzzle pieces. Do not hide them from her.
 

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My advice? Get used to the questions. The same ones over and over and over — maybe for years. And get used to the anger. She’ll be dealing with that for a long time. Maybe she’ll forgive you. Maybe she won’t. At this point, she probably has no idea what the future holds. Even if she does decide to forgive you, she may decide years from now it just doesn’t work. For sure she’ll never again trust you 100% so be prepared for that.

(And, BTW, when you throw out your problems on a public forum? Be prepared to hear it all.)
 

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Discussion Starter #57
Talk about a roller coaster ride!
First, when she found out, all she wanted was a divorce. Then after a week of emotions and countless hours of talking, she decided to give our marriage another chance. This evening she suddenly started asking more detail questions about the various times I betrayed her, and at the end of the night she said she was so disgusted she can't forgive me, we're done, but further told me that if I sincerely want to show my remorse, then sign the divorce papers agreeing to walk out with nothing (leaving all assets worth about 2Mil to her). I'm dumbfounded, I don't know what to think anymore.
 

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Talk about a roller coaster ride!
First, when she found out, all she wanted was a divorce. Then after a week of emotions and countless hours of talking, she decided to give our marriage another chance. This evening she suddenly started asking more detail questions about the various times I betrayed her, and at the end of the night she said she was so disgusted she can't forgive me, we're done, but further told me that if I sincerely want to show my remorse, then sign the divorce papers agreeing to walk out with nothing (leaving all assets worth about 2Mil to her). I'm dumbfounded, I don't know what to think anymore.
First off, welcome to the rollercoaster. Who knows if she's being serious or not. She probably doesn't even know. IMO, it is far, far too early for her to be making decisions either way. I cannot tell you how many times I went back and forth and told my wife we were divorcing, and each time I was so sure. We're 18 months in and I feel like I'm about to walk out the door, for the thousandth time.

Right now, give her space and leave her alone. If she decides to divorce, then give her that. You did this to yourself.

Second, your wife is probably reaching if she thinks you would walk away with nothing. I assume you are in Canada, based on your flag. They divide marital property evenly and no judge will let one spouse walk away with nothing. Postnups with infidelity clauses are generally not enforceable because Canada has no fault divorce.
 

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@ImAnIdiot sorry if you feel some of us are harsh but you are the one who has to suck it up and realise that you caused the damage, now you have to go through the process if you have a remote possibility of saving this marriage. You think that her asking so many questions is not a good thing, probably because it picks at the wound which is also very uncomfortable for you too. But you have to consider this, is your discomfort more important than her pain at this betrayal? If you want to save this, then your discomfort at the harsh realities of the fall out should not be a priority to you cause it shows that it is still about you.
 
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