[Mr. Nail]

Has any one ever, in the history of the world, given sex without the Expectation of affection?

 

[Mr. Nail]

Affection would be physical contact motivated by emotional attachment.

Getting closer to the truth with every post.
I like this definition of Physical affection
I believe there is non physical affection
For example verbal affection, and . . .
Body language affection (that one is hard to articulate)

So would your definition include sexual contact motivated by emotional attachment?

 

[Mr. Nail]

Now that we have nailed down what affection is,
And how common it is for it to be associated with sex,
Now we need a definition of manipulation.
Is seduction manipulation?
Is initiation manipulation?
Is self improvement manipulation?
And it just goes on.
If manipulation is trying to get someone to do something that they don't want to do, is it manipulation to get some on to want to do something they aren't doing? In other words to change their mind.
Is Conversation manipulation?

And Young at Heart we will get to the myth of the covert contract eventually.

 

[Mr. Nail]

OK, we are quickly running out of things that manipulation can be.
Time for a reality check.
Definition of manipulate

transitive verb
1: to treat or operate with or as if with the hands or by mechanical means especially in a skillful manner manipulate a pencil manipulate a machine
2a: to manage or utilize skillfully quantify our data and manipulate it statistically— S. L. Payne
b: to control or play upon by artful, unfair, or insidious means especially to one's own advantage; being used and manipulated by the knowing men around him— New Republic
3: to change by artful or unfair means so as to serve one's purpose : DOCTOR suspected that the police reports were manipulated— Evelyn G. Cruickshanks
For the purpose of this conversation we need to limit this to definition 2 b.
is there any objection to that?

 

[Mr. Nail]

Did Bad santa play upon his wife by artful means for his own advantage?

 

[Mr. Nail]

I learned at the tender age of 14 that intent is ethereal and impossible to prove. Long story short It turned a felony into a misdemeanor.
The problem here is that Badsanta the OP on this thread defined manipulation as the artful playing of another person. And, TexasMom1216 keep insisting on it being the insidious playing on of another person. They are Both right.
It is ok to manipulate a person if your intent is approved (I'm having trouble with the term good here because the level of approved is all over the place) Bad santa is not suggesting insidious or even deceitful playing, but, his intent is clearly more frequent sex. Despite the broadly accepted fact that frequent sex improves marriages, She's still lost it thinks frequent sex is somehow insidious.

Now If I want more frequent sex I have to go to definition 1 and physically manipulate Mrs. Nail's back and shoulders and often feet. I still do this even though she doesn't love me.

 

[Mr. Nail]

Why thank you for dismissing me as worthless, I've come to expect it. You can keep arguing with the original poster.

 

[Mr. Nail]

Dear Texas Mom 1216,
I have never and will never refer to you as She's still lost it, That is a different person.
I mention this not as an excuse or as a reparation, just as a clarification.