Talk About Marriage banner
261 - 280 of 303 Posts
A no turn down policy would make a massive difference to our marriage and sex life.
It really wouldn't help at all.

The fact that your wife feels for the most part (as proven by her actions), that she needs to get drunk, in order to share sex with you. Ought to be enough to tell you that she doesn't want to share sex with you. All of which wouldn't be helped by asking her to never turn you down.

That said given your situation, I don't know why you think trying to push the overfilled cart, backwards against big rocks up the hill, is going to make this better. When it would be sensible, to just let that cart roll down the hill to its fitting end.
 
@BIL310 ,

You might Google for “sexual aversion” and “marriagebuilders”. There is an article on the marriage builders site that you might do well to read at this point. Also there is something like “policy of joint agreement” worth understanding.

You are between a rock and a hard place.

One thing I never thought to do, when it might have mattered, is explain — without showing her any “sad” emotion — my desire for her, my desire for sexual fulfillment in this brief life, the disconnected feeling, the sense of loss I felt for what we had, and put the ball in her court, saying “What do you propose we do? What would you do if you were me?”

I think the only way to win is to find it in you to be happy either way, with her as a loving sexual partner in life, or without (and perhaps with someone else later). Be determined to not waste time, if she has a different goal. Let her see your willingness to face making hard decisions, somehow without threatening divorce too soon.
 
@BIL310 ,

You might Google for “sexual aversion” and “marriagebuilders”. There is an article on the marriage builders site that you might do well to read at this point. Also there is something like “policy of joint agreement” worth understanding.

You are between a rock and a hard place.

One thing I never thought to do, when it might have mattered, is explain — without showing her any “sad” emotion — my desire for her, my desire for sexual fulfillment in this brief life, the disconnected feeling, the sense of loss I felt for what we had, and put the ball in her court, saying “What do you propose we do? What would you do if you were me?”

I think the only way to win is to find it in you to be happy either way, with her as a loving sexual partner in life, or without (and perhaps with someone else later). Be determined to not waste time, if she has a different goal. Let her see your willingness to face making hard decisions, somehow without threatening divorce too soon.
I don't think there is ever a winner in this game. When one partner gives up, but controls the relationship, it becomes the time when evaluating my happiness in this world, will it be with my partner or without. If we cannot share a basic fundamentals in a relationship, then it's a false relationship of codependency.
 
When one partner gives up, but controls the relationship,
Are you a man or a mouse?

C'mon man, surely you're better than this.

You control yourself and consequently control your marital relationship, just as much as your wife controls herself and her half of your marital relationship.

Seriously, for your own good. Please stop buying into this victim card nonsense, and stand up instead of wallowing in being pathetic.

So isn't it about time, you take responsibility for yourself? And stop with this idea that you're a victim, when you are a volunteer.
 
Discussion starter · #267 · (Edited)
my recommendation is to basically do the exact opposite and just drop the whole sex subject for a period of time.

part of the problem is you trying all the time which is just an annoyance and pressure for her which just becomes a bigger turn off for her and lowers your value and attractiveness in her eyes.

you’re like the rat that presses the bar for food.
If you want the rat the press the bar all the time, you only give him a food pellet at infrequent and unpredictable times.

the rats knows he gets food due to his pushing the bar but he doesn’t know when, so he just sits there and presses the bar all day long hoping that one of those times will dispense the food.

you’re doing the same thing and it’s pissing her off and making you look like… well a desperate, manipulated rat.

if you get turned down on Monday, one of the worst things you can do is to hit her up again Tuesday.

you gotta let this whole thing reboot. Back off and quit acting like a rat manically pressing a bar.

let the dust settle for awhile, don’t be so needy and pressuring.

Give it some time and then if she simply doesn’t want to have a sex life with you or she can’t bring herself to be with you unless drunk, that’s something that probably needs to be addressed with a professional MC or sex therapist and not something where you try to browbeat her into putting out every day for God’s sake.

you’re trying to treat cancer with a home remedy poultice here.

give her room to breathe and not feel pressured and attacked……. Then if there is an actual structural problem in the sexual dynamics (which there surely is) then seek professional counseling and guidance.
Thanks for your reply but you've got this completely wrong.

I've dropped the whole sex subject before and nothing changed.

Initiating more is actually something that I haven't tried. We've got into a routine of generally only having sex on a weekend after a few drinks. So last week I decided to change things up and start initiating more, midweek. That didn't work really as she turned me down 4 times, although we did have sex on Saturday. Both sober, both orgasmed.

I completely agree however that repeatedly asking for sex and getting turned down isn't attractive and not something I'm prepared to put up with, hence why I've decided to see if she's up for the no turn down policy instead. Then I wouldn't need to initiate every night and look weak and needy, I wouldn't be pressuring her into sex 10 times a week. Maybe twice a midweek but knowing that when I initiate she's receptive.
 
Discussion starter · #268 ·
i don’t think you grasp the gravity of the situation yet even now.

This is a real problem.

Someone only having sex when drunk is one of or a combination of a couple things.

One is a serious lack of attraction to where they have to chemically numb themselves up to be able to touch you.

The other is a serious anxiety issue to where they are so worried about stuff and so emotionally tense and uptight that they have to dull their senses and drown their inhibitions and hang ups in order to touch you.

…. and it’s likely a combination of both, but either way it is a serious problem that needs to be addressed and will likely need to be addressed in MC or therapy.

At this point you may both need IC to address each of your own personal demons as well.

And whether she has a lack of attraction and desire for you or whether she has an anxiety issue, trying to insist on a no rejection policy at this point will end in disaster either way.

Read the Marital rape thread if you want to see how your wife will feel about your no rejection policy.

There is a serious problem her and pressuring to take away her agency is going to trying to put out a house fire with a flame thrower.

This is not a differing libido issue. It is a serious marital and personal interaction issue.
She's not drunk as such but has said she feels more relaxed after a few drinks, whether that's 2 drinks or 8.

I don't have any personal demons.

I've read the marital rape thread and what I'm proposing is nothing of the sort. I'm not saying I expect her to go from current status to receptive 5 times a week. What I do expect in marriage is that if I'm the one who's always initiating (which I am), then when I do I expect her to be receptive more, (even if it's once or twice a week more).

This is a difference about libido, the majority of the time we do get on. Although when we don't it's usually down to her mood swings.
 
Discussion starter · #269 ·
Im going to throw in a personal experience and anecdote of my own.

When we were in MC, this was one of my wife’s chief complaints and one of the things that pissed her off and turned her off the most.

If we did have a particularly good encounter, I would kind of ride that waves for days. It would pump me up and I would be feeling good and would be full of horny hormones and thinking about the night before would get me all horned up and wanting to go for Round 2.

My wife on the other hand was good and was basically going into something of a refractory period where her tank was drained and it would take a number of days to fill back up again.

If I was acting like Thumper Rabbit and wanting to go again, that was putting a lot of pressure on her when she just didn’t have the capacity to go again.

It was also instilling her with a sense of nothing she did would be good enough for me and that would also cause her to think the old “all-you-want-is-sex” and along with that came the resentment and bitterness.

it put her into a catch-22 situation where she couldn’t win. If we didn’t have sex, I would get all resentful and crabby and start pulling away etc etc.

But if we did have a good encounter, I would just get all turbo charged up and just want more.

it’s like a kid on Christmas morning that got what he asked for but after all the Christmas presents were opened up, he just wants more.

Like I said, that was her main complaint in the sexual arena (the rest was the usual not doing enough the house or with the kids or with her family etc)

You hadn’t had sober sex in 6 months and you’ve been begging for sober sex for half a year, so what made you think it would be a good idea to try to get in her knickers again the very next day after you got what you wanted? (That’s a rhetorical question for you to ponder,,, I already know why you did cause I used to do the same thing myself)

If you don’t want to take my word for it, set aside some time and read through a bunch of posts in the low libido forum on Reddit. Continuous repetitive requests for sex is one of the things that piss off and turn off the low libido people most. If your nagging them day after day after day, you are just digging yourself into a deeper and deeper hole. It’s making the situation worse.
Yes I agree with this.

I'm not saying if she says yes to a no turn down policy I'm going to be initiating every night. The only reason I did on Sunday was because we'd been out for a few drinks and that's usually when we do have sex. There's lots of times we have sex after a drink, then next morning we go again.

The idea with no turn down policy is that I won't need to keep making continuous requests. Nor will I have to stop initiating like I generally do whilst sober because of the rejection.
 
i agree with what you are saying as advice as it relates to this poster, but want to add that not EVERY woman is like your wife, oldshirt.

There are also.lots of women in the world who DO love to have sex many days in a row. Week after week, year after year.
Correct, but their husbands are not on relationship forums complaining about being in a sexless marriage or that they will only have sex when drunk.

when someone is rejecting intimacy for months on end, there is a problem and when the person that is being rejected continues to beg and badger the rejector day after day it makes the situation worse.
 
Correct, but their husbands are not on relationship forums complaining about being in a sexless marriage or that they will only have sex when drunk.

when someone is rejecting intimacy for months on end, there is a problem and when the person that is being rejected continues to beg and badger the rejector day after day it makes the situation worse.
I agree with you... I can't say, for example, that I "badgered" mt wife for sex, since it was twice a month, but the "pressure" is always felt and it doesn't help. In fact, it makes the situation a lot worse, as you say. That said, it's a lost battle, because if you don't ask you don't get, if you ask you put pressure on and you don't get, if you leave there is no guarantee you will find a woman who will have sex every day, every week, ever month, every year. I won't find one at 59 and starting again is not an option for me. I'm just not interested in a relationship - and all its trappings - again. But I'm glad I don't have to put up with that torture ever again. I'm sad, but relieved.
 
Thanks for your reply but you've got this completely wrong.

I've dropped the whole sex subject before and nothing changed.

Initiating more is actually something that I haven't tried. We've got into a routine of generally only having sex on a weekend after a few drinks. So last week I decided to change things up and start initiating more, midweek. That didn't work really as she turned me down 4 times, although we did have sex on Saturday. Both sober, both orgasmed.

I completely agree however that repeatedly asking for sex and getting turned down isn't attractive and not something I'm prepared to put up with, hence why I've decided to see if she's up for the no turn down policy instead. Then I wouldn't need to initiate every night and look weak and needy, I wouldn't be pressuring her into sex 10 times a week. Maybe twice a midweek but knowing that when I initiate she's receptive.
Or, you could write her off as a wife and start taking applications for the next Mrs. @BIL310 .
 
@BIL310

You seem to have already tried a lot of thing, so not sure if this will help, but I think these worth a read. Most are a quick read.

 
I agree with you... I can't say, for example, that I "badgered" mt wife for sex, since it was twice a month, but the "pressure" is always felt and it doesn't help. In fact, it makes the situation a lot worse, as you say. That said, it's a lost battle, because if you don't ask you don't get, if you ask you put pressure on and you don't get, if you leave there is no guarantee you will find a woman who will have sex every day, every week, ever month, every year. I won't find one at 59 and starting again is not an option for me. I'm just not interested in a relationship - and all its trappings - again. But I'm glad I don't have to put up with that torture ever again. I'm sad, but relieved.
Let’s follow the chain of events.

If someone is rejecting their partner consistently and continuously for months, it’s because they don’t want to have sex with them.

If someone does not want to have sex with their partner, then ANY requests, initiations, overtures etc will be perceived as “pressure.”

Any ‘pressure’ from the rejected party will exacerbate the problem and make it worse and add to the problems that make the other party not want to have sex with them even more. It becomes a Viscous cycle.

There for, the logical solution is to stop the situations and conditions that are exacerbating the problem and address the root causes of why that person does not want to have sex with you.

You don’t treat lung cancer by trying to get them to smoke more cigarettes in an attempt to kill the cancer cells by smoking them out.

thats what continually hitting on someone that doesn’t want to have sex is like.

you have to get them in a clean and hygienic environment that does not contribute to and exacerbate the disease and then address the cancer professionally.
 
Let’s follow the chain of events.

If someone is rejecting their partner consistently and continuously for months, it’s because they don’t want to have sex with them.

If someone does not want to have sex with their partner, then ANY requests, initiations, overtures etc will be perceived as “pressure.”

Any ‘pressure’ from the rejected party will exacerbate the problem and make it worse and add to the problems that make the other party not want to have sex with them in the first place. Viscous cycle.

There for, the logical solution is to stop the situations and conditions that are exacerbating the problem and address the root causes of why that person does not want to have sex with you.

You don’t treat lung cancer by trying to get them to smoke more cigarettes in an attempt to kill the cancer cells by smoking them out.

thats what continually hitting on someone that doesn’t want to have sex is like.

you have to get them in a clean and hygienic environment that does not contribute to and exacerbate the disease and then address the cancer professionally.
Yes, I agree. My situation was a bit different, my wife having mental issues, but nevertheless I put pressure on her - rightly or wrongly - and that pushed her away even further. If, after some time, the situation is not solvable, pack your bag if you think you can't live without a satisfactory sex life.
 
Yes, I agree. My situation was a bit different, my wife having mental issues, but nevertheless I put pressure on her - rightly or wrongly - and that pushed her away even further. If, after some time, the situation is not solvable, pack your bag if you think you can't live without a satisfactory sex life.
Yes.

Some causes for not wanting to have sex can be corrected.

Some cannot.

In either case, pressuring for sex will only exacerbate the problem and make it worse.

Address the cause and if it cannot be corrected, then the decision will need to made whether to suck it up and live with it vs outsource the sex vs dissolve the relationship.
 
Are you a man or a mouse?

C'mon man, surely you're better than this.

You control yourself and consequently control your marital relationship, just as much as your wife controls herself and her half of your marital relationship.

Seriously, for your own good. Please stop buying into this victim card nonsense, and stand up instead of wallowing in being pathetic.

So isn't it about time, you take responsibility for yourself? And stop with this idea that you're a victim, when you are a volunteer.
Are you a man or a mouse?

C'mon man, surely you're better than this.

You control yourself and consequently control your marital relationship, just as much as your wife controls herself and her half of your marital relationship.

Seriously, for your own good. Please stop buying into this victim card nonsense, and stand up instead of wallowing in being pathetic.

So isn't it about time, you take responsibility for yourself? And stop with this idea that you're a victim, when you are a volunteer.
Please don't insult your intelligence. That was an observed statement, not an objective outline of my own relationship. Really?
 
261 - 280 of 303 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top