[Kindabitter]

My husband re-kindeled a romance with a high school gal he dated twice. We've been married for 11 years. He hasn't seen/heard from her in over 26 years. Anyhow, they met up and made out and had an "emotional" affair - except for the making out part. And they sexted and video chat about inappropriate things for a few months. I found out, we had many loud discussions on the subject, and they're not sexting any more but he insists they're just friends and he wants to keep their friendship going. She is more mushy about their friendship, even though he has told her he wants to save his marriage and doesn't want to have all the extra communications with her. If he sends one email, she sends 4. He will just say hey just seeing how you're doing or something and she gets all wordy and talks about her life, about how much she dislikes her husband, etc and talks about how much she misses their video chats, etc. I hate this woman with every fiber of my being. I have told her several times to back off and leave him and our family alone. She won't. I have their chats printed out and can share them with her husband and grown kids, but I don't see how that would do anything positive. I just want this woman to go crawl under the rock she came from and leave us alone. I know my husband isn't innocent, and we're working through things. I would prefer he just stop communicating with her at all but he does every couple weeks. Mostly I'm sick of it and having trouble re-building trust with their "friendship" continuing - no matter how innocent it is. I'm having trouble coping and really, really want to get rid of her. Please help.

 

[Machiavelli]

Forward all correspondence in hard copy to her husband via registered mail. That should do the trick.

 

[Kindabitter]

my husband doesn't know I have his email info. And I have printed out all of their emails. He does know I saw his facebook chats, and he doesn't know I printed them out. If I send the info to her husband, she will know and will tell him. And it will all come back to me. And my husband will say I'm not letting it go - I'm living in the past. And honestly, I don't want to fight any more. We're doing really, really well. It's just this SHE that keeps popping up in his email account and it's really got to stop. I keep thinking to threaten her but I don't know if that will work either. I did tell her husband that she is having inappropriate communications with my husband and she needs to stop but he didn't seem to care. Plus, what if she gets the mail and signs for it? And then opens it and destroys it? Then nothing's been done.

 

[EleGirl]

my husband doesn't know I have his email info. And I have printed out all of their emails. He does know I saw his facebook chats, and he doesn't know I printed them out. If I send the info to her husband, she will know and will tell him. And it will all come back to me. And my husband will say I'm not letting it go - I'm living in the past. And honestly, I don't want to fight any more. We're doing really, really well. It's just this SHE that keeps popping up in his email account and it's really got to stop. I keep thinking to threaten her but I don't know if that will work either. I did tell her husband that she is having inappropriate communications with my husband and she needs to stop but he didn't seem to care. Plus, what if she gets the mail and signs for it? And then opens it and destroys it? Then nothing's been done.

There are things that you can do… you can answer all of her emails. I did that at one time. And when you do make sure that you copy her husband on the replies. If you have the emails for her adult children include them as well. Are her parents alive… copy them as well.

And when your husband says anything about it just look him in the eye and tell him that if he wants to continue his affair he can move out. You will file for divorce. Until you are ready to stand up for your marriage he will continue this affair. Yes it’s still an EA. He must stop all contact with her for your marriage to recover.

He needs to send her a no-contact letter. If she contacts him again a second letter should follow for no contact and that your husband will take out a restraining order against her for stalking.

Anything less from your husband means that he is making a fool out of you.

You have this all wrong. You are bending over backwards trying to get your husband to reconcile. It’s he who should be bending over backwards hoping you will agree to reconcile.

I you send all of the emails to her husband she will be so busy trying to save her marriage that she will leave your husband alone. When you send him the emails, also either send him the link to this forum or to the marriagebuilder.com forums. The first thing he will be told on either forum that she has to end all contact with your husband.

When you send him the emails, make sure that you do it in a way that only he can sign for it. Do not let her get her hands on it first.

I know that you think that you are doing very well. But you are not. As long as he is still in contact with her he’s still in an EA.

 

[Kindabitter]

Thank you, and I agree. As long as he's in contact with her it's still and EA. And I hate that they're still in contact. I have brought up divorce, and talked to an attorney. We tried counseling but that was a huge mistake. I do believe he's trying to be a good husband and not be inappropriately involved with her, but he doesn't see how continuing on with a friendship with her is hurting me. Right now he doesn't know I have access to his email and doesn't know I know they're still in touch. Lately if I get to his email before he does I delete the unread emails she has sent. Thank you for the advice and thoughts. I do really appreciate them.

 

[EleGirl]

Thank you, and I agree. As long as he's in contact with her it's still and EA. And I hate that they're still in contact. I have brought up divorce, and talked to an attorney. We tried counseling but that was a huge mistake. I do believe he's trying to be a good husband and not be inappropriately involved with her, but he doesn't see how continuing on with a friendship with her is hurting me. Right now he doesn't know I have access to his email and doesn't know I know they're still in touch. Lately if I get to his email before he does I delete the unread emails she has sent. Thank you for the advice and thoughts. I do really appreciate them.

I'm going to be a bit harsh here because I think you need it.

Your husband is not trying to be a good husband. He's doing what we call 'cake eating'. He's trying to have his cake and eat it too. He wants to keep both of you.

He does not truely care about your feelings. Instead he only cares about what he wants. Sure he's cut it down a bit with her but he's not willing to let her go.

You are sharing your husband with another woman. Are you really comfortable with that. I don't think so.

since you are not you have to let your husband know and you have to be willing to say either give her up 100% or leave.

 

[Kindabitter]

You are right, and I did at one point tell him he had to let her go and he told her I said they couldn't be friends any more. (it was kinda jr. high). I want him to make the choice because he wants to, not because I want him to. I do believe everything you're all saying is correct. I am trying to be a bigger person and move forward, but her emailing is making me upset. A few days after I told him he couldn't be friends with her I then said he could be friends with whoever he wants, and I tried to trust that it would be ok. But it's not. I hate that they're in contact. I hate her. So much!

 

[EleGirl]

You are right, and I did at one point tell him he had to let her go and he told her I said they couldn't be friends any more. (it was kinda jr. high). I want him to make the choice because he wants to, not because I want him to. I do believe everything you're all saying is correct. I am trying to be a bigger person and move forward, but her emailing is making me upset. A few days after I told him he couldn't be friends with her I then said he could be friends with whoever he wants, and I tried to trust that it would be ok. But it's not. I hate that they're in contact. I hate her. So much!

So you think that letting your husband continue an affair is being a bigger person? This is not Junior High.. this is not about you will not let them be friends. This is about your husband being involved in infidelity.

You can see in the pain, anger and bitterness that are growing in you want allowing your husband to keep a 'friend' (aka carry on an affair) does to you. It will distory you. And it is distorying your love for him.

He on the other hand has it great... he has two women who are fighting over him.. just like in Junior high.

Send her emails to her husband and her children. Add a letter about what this is doign to your family.

How many children do you have? Are they all grown? Do any live at home?

Do any of your children know about the affair?

 

[Kindabitter]

Hi EleGirl,
We have 9 children. 6 grown, 3 still at home. The oldest knows - I told her what was going on after she kept asking (over a period of months) what was going on. She was/is upset, as she should be. I haven't said anything else to her other than her dad and I are trying to work things out. I really like your idea of a letter saying what it's doing to our family along with the emails/messages they've shared. Thanks for your insight.

 

[smithcarloso]

We tried counseling but that was a huge mistake.

 

[CandieGirl]

Expose her to her husband, her family, her JOB. Everywhere. Excellent advice above!

Who cares if your husband gets mad at you for doing it? He needs to be shaken down...

 

[Kindabitter]

I care if he gets mad. He's super scary when he's mad. Basically, I'm afraid of him when he's mad. Yes, he needs to be shaken down. And so does she. I just don't want any more drama - I want peace and happiness, and I want her gone. I suppose that to get to that point there will need to be more upheaval. I'm just not sure I'm brave enough to do it right now.

 

[carmen ohio]

I care if he gets mad. He's super scary when he's mad. Basically, I'm afraid of him when he's mad. Yes, he needs to be shaken down. And so does she. I just don't want any more drama - I want peace and happiness, and I want her gone. I suppose that to get to that point there will need to be more upheaval. I'm just not sure I'm brave enough to do it right now.

Dear Kindabitter,

If you are afraid of your H, you have a bigger problem than his infidelity. Contact a spousal abuse hot-line in your area and seek advice on how to deal with him.

When you finally work up the courage to confront him and put your foot down, arrange for trusted family members to be with you.

You shouldn't have to live with either his cheating or in fear of him. If you don't solve both problems, you are just headed for more down the road.

Wishing you the best possible outcome.

 

[triggerhappy]

my husband doesn't know I have his email info. And I have printed out all of their emails. He does know I saw his facebook chats, and he doesn't know I printed them out. If I send the info to her husband, she will know and will tell him. And it will all come back to me. And my husband will say I'm not letting it go - I'm living in the past.

HE'S living in the past!! HE won't stop this relationship. He has no right to speak to this woman, and to even suggest it with a straight face is pretty balsy!

I will never understand how the betrayer expects their spouse to never snoop again after an indiscretion, or worse. It's almost laughable that they would even think they have a right to that again. Trust is what everybody starts off with. If you lose that trust, you have to work hard at rebuilding it. You don't just get it back.
It doesn't just come back because you realized you effed up. You have to allow the person you betrayed to find their own trust. You cannot say "Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know I messed up, but hey babe, this time you can really trust me". I'm sorry it doesn't work that way.


I say send all the crap to the other spouse, and when you're husband confronts you about his "privacy", You tell him, "ARE YOU SERIOUS??!!"

 

[Kindabitter]

Thanks, everyone for the advice. You are all right, and I know in my heart it is what I need to do to stop this. I just need to get up enough courage. and yes, have a support system in place at the same time. He is working on the anger/abuse thing - he's not physically abusive, but very emotionally abusive. It hasn't happened since our big fights about this EA, and although he is working on it I am still afraid of his anger. Yes, that is another problem. And it sounds like I married a douche, and perhaps he is but I love him and he has lots of good qualities too. I'm just bringing up the ones I'm having trouble coping with because I have no one else to talk to. I don't know where to get advice other than here.

 

[EleGirl]

You would be helped quite a bit if you did some individual counseling with a counselor who works with spouses who are emotionally abused. His using his angry outbursts to scare you and keep control of you is called emotional abuse.

There are things that you can do to stand up to him and to stop this. Get some help in learning those things.

Does he break things, punch walls, bang on furnature when he's angery? Or has it been just yelling so far?

Here is something that I learned to do with my ex who was verbally abusive….

Never, ever again talk to him or be around him when he is displaying his anger. When he starts to go off the handle put up your hand in a stop gesture. And say firmly “STOP”. If you have to repeat this a couple of times do. Then tell him “I’m going to leave now while you calm yourself down.”

Go to another room and close the door, go for a walk… do whatever you are comfortable with to get away from him and to give him time to calm down.

I he follows you, bangs on the door, and will not leave you alone call 911. He has to learn that you will not tolerate his angry outbursts.

When I used this I practiced it in front of a mirror, over and over until it was an automatic response. I’d imagine him coming at me with his anger, his yelling, his pounding on things. Then I would practicing remaining calm and telling him to “STOP” and walking away.

Then I had a talk with my husband when he was in a calm mood. I told him that his anger is his problem and I don’t want to be part of it. I told him that I now have the safe word ‘STOP’. When use it I will walk away and not talk to him until he’s calm and has composed his thoughts.

I also told him that it’s his responsibility to learn to control his anger. He can no longer intimidate me with it because I’ll just call the police if it gets out of hand. I suggested that instead of him letting his feelings built to the boiling point that he find a way to manage them. Exercise is an very good way to do that. Daily walking, bike rides, weight lifting… something, anything that lets him work off the anger and aggression and that pumps good brain chemicals that will calm him down.

My husband started to bike ride a lot. It really helped. It also go to the point that when I’d use the “STOP” thingy he’d jump and his bike and be gone for an hour. He’d come back in much better frame of mind.

After about 6 months of his he learned and he no longer had those ugly, angry outbursts. But it took me sticking to my guns on refusing to tolerate his outbursts.

You need to stop being afraid of his anger. It’s his anger. It belongs to him. If he’s not physically violent to you what harm does yelling really do? It’s just a lot of hot air.

And if he escalates to violence when you stand up to his anger just dial 911. Let the police teach him that he cannot treat you that way.

Does he treat your children this way as well? I hope you do not allow that.

As his wife, it’s your job to inspire him to be the best person he can be. If you enable his angry outbursts by allowing him to scare you and thus control you with them, you are not inspiring him to be the best he can be. Instead you are teaching him that it’s ok to mistreat you.

(Just a bit of tough love here )

 

[TCSRedhead]

KB - just a voice from the other side of the coin. I was the cheater in my marriage. I can tell you that I would not have been able to devote myself entirely to my marriage until I cut out all communication with the other man. Period.

Anything less is disrespectful for the betrayed spouse. If he's not willing to do that, you can't make him but you can choose what you will and will not accept in a marriage.

 

[dormant]

KB - I have to admit, I haven't read all comments in detail, but here is my take on this:

Your anger should be directed mostly at your husband. You can't much blame the OW for responding to emails your husband sends to her. SHe won't back off until he does.

You need to shock him in to quitting. I believe, when he stops, so will she. I rarely buy in to bringing the other spouse into the mix, but if it takes busting her, with her husband to make him stop, then do it.

 

[Kindabitter]

EleGirl - yes, and I totally appreciate your advice. We've talked about his anger (it got so much worse when I started to stand up for myself). I didn't/don't fight back, but I do tell him to stop. He does follow and keeps screaming and saying horrible things. My love language is verbal, so the verbal abuse is really hard for me to deal with. I stand up for the kids (rarely does it happen with them, occasionally when the olders were teens but they pushed the limits, too... he didn't go abusive to them, more loud frustration when they were being "teens") So far he's been doing much better about keeping the temper under control. I know this will set him off, and I don't know if it will do any good. I don't know if her husband even cares.

TCSRedhead - did you choose to stop communication or did you have an ultimatum? I think part of my problem is I feel like i have a double standard - which I don't, but it seems like it. I was raised with 5 brothers, no sisters. I have lots and lots of friends that are boys/men and it is 100% innocent. There has never been any inappropriateness on my side or theirs ever. If I tell him he can't be friends with her, when he swears they are just friends now, what's stopping him from telling me I can't have this friend or that friend? (except if he was threatened by one of my friendships I would end the friendship because I care more about the husband).

dormant- I do have anger with my husband over this. But she emails 4x's more than he does. And his emails (since he was outed) have been superficial and short, nothing other then a couple sentences replying to what she writes. Nothing mushy like hers. I really believe if she wasn't pushing the relationship so much it would end. She is unhappy in her marriage and insecure with herself. She's one of those who needs constant reasurance that she's ok. (which she's not - she's a cow) So yes, I am angry at him but I am more angry at her for not respecting that he told her to chill out and so have I and she disregards it.

 

[TCSRedhead]

TCSRedhead - did you choose to stop communication or did you have an ultimatum? I think part of my problem is I feel like i have a double standard - which I don't, but it seems like it. I was raised with 5 brothers, no sisters. I have lots and lots of friends that are boys/men and it is 100% innocent. There has never been any inappropriateness on my side or theirs ever. If I tell him he can't be friends with her, when he swears they are just friends now, what's stopping him from telling me I can't have this friend or that friend? (except if he was threatened by one of my friendships I would end the friendship because I care more about the husband).

My husband made it clear that this person could not be part of my life if we were going to stay married. So, it was my choice to ditch the OM and keep my husband and marriage. That was the price I paid for making the wrong choice and betraying my husband's trust. How can I justify keeping in touch with someone who was willing to destroy my marriage and his?

This is the price HE pays for HIS choice in crossing boundaries.

If you were to cross boundaries in your friendships with other men, then that would need to be discussed.

You should expose the other woman - doesn't her husband deserve to know what his wife is doing?