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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hi

I’m hoping for some help and guidance in my newly complex life - re my wayward spouse, and how to move on in life.

I’m early 40s, so is my wife, and we have two kids just under 10. We got married 12 years ago, having dated for 10 years prior to that.

Since the kids were born, my wife has been increasingly disinterested in me - no sex for long periods at times, and less closeness. But still love, and an up and down relationship. I’ve worked hard, and we have a nice life (3-4 exotic hols a year, nice cars, nice house, friends and family - and I’m solvent etc).

I have been a bit too much of a nice guy (both positive and negative aspects) and we are both conflict avoidant. We communicate badly: at the slightest criticism she runs away crying until I comfort her (she is starting gate victim, I am starting gate rescuer). So lots of not talking...

We had fun times in the autumn, lots of hols etc, but she became particularly distant. After Xmas, I pressed her, and she admitted to an affair. Physical and emotional. ILYBANILWY, has found her soul mate etc.

The OM is a lot older (10-15 years...!), less wealthy, has two ex wives and several kids. He is more artistic - and I’m sure a good talker. He has said he will tell his current partner and young teenage daughter about his relationship with my wife towards the end of 2019 when his partner has finished a course and he can leave her more easily...

I said we should try to rescue our marriage for the kids, she agreed, I instituted CC and IC counselling - got myself fit, worked really hard on my mental and spiritual health, read tons of books... started the 180 - but found evidence last month that she was in fact still very much involved with the affair. She says she can’t imagine a life without the OM.

I’ve kicked off a range of consequences for the breach of trust, not respecting boundaries etc. Some pretty material- per the 180, I now do the fun things and she has to stay at home. We sleep in separate rooms. Counselling over. I have asked her to budget divorce, will be instructing the divorce papers to be issued shortly.

She seems sad, the consequences are mounting (and becoming visible to friends and family)... but she still is enamoured with the OM.

I’m borderline on what I want. My kids are paramount to me, and I hate the idea of hurting them, moving out etc.

Taking on primary care seems impractical because of my job... but I could perhaps manage with a nanny and lots of engagement from my wife in practice.

I’d possibly take her back if she seemed genuinely interested in fixing herself and our marriage. But she isn’t.

Divorce will take several months to send through court.

I could... contact the OM’s partner, who is apparently still in the dark. Don’t know what to do there.

I could... stay in the house while we wait for the divorce and hype the 180...

I could... tell her to move out and if she did, figure out how to manage life/kids

I could... aim for fun times, move out and start looking for a new life and love for myself.

I just don’t know. I would love to have my old life, plus fix it with the benefit of everything I have learned through this. Lots of affair counselling websites suggest sticking with it - the affair will be exposed as a fantasy, the limerance will abate etc. But I don’t know how realistic this is, and my wife is sticking to her guns through some fairly meaty downsides for her...
 

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Glad you found us. Sorry for your need to do so! Lots of good folks here. Details will broaden your answers.....
 

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welcome -- there are MANY here in TAM that will be able to help. Post your full story and you will get help right away.

IF she is having an affair:
1. Get your finances in order
2.See a lawyer to see what your options are
3. EXPOSE (if you do NOT have proof or are not sure -- DO NOT confront or you will lose the ability to find things out).
4. Put a VAR near where she tends to talk on the phone
5.Work on YOU (NOT HER -- do NOT do the pick-me dance) -- eat/sleep/exercise!!!!!!!/get your own hobbies and focus on YOUR stuff not her

SOrry you are going through this...
 

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My friend, you have made every single mistake that you could possibly make, every single one.

There are not good aspects of being a nice guy, none.

Read no more mr nice guy, ASAP.

She has had zero consequences, not one.

File for divorce, ASAP. Expose to everyone, have her move out, ASAP.

Leave her in the dirt...

Stop being nice, just stop it.

Have some self respect...
 

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Read up. It's short and will help you.

https://archive.org/details/RobertGloverNoMoreMrNiceGuy

Like many you apparently helped hide their affair. Guess what that did? It enabled it further.

Don't worry about pushing her away. She already left. You just lived in denial. All cheaters lie a lot and that's all you've gotten.

If you want a chance then get a plan together and expose (without any warning) all at once.

Affairs are secret and only function well in the dark.

Talk gets you nothing in these things only your actions count. Stop talking to her and accepting living in a life of infidelity

Until you wake up you'll stay where you are.
 

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Hi

I said we should try to rescue our marriage for the kids, she agreed, I instituted CC and IC counselling - got myself fit, worked really hard on my mental and spiritual health, read tons of books... started the 180 - but found evidence last month that she was in fact still very much involved with the affair. She says she can’t imagine a life without the OM.

Let her go

I just don’t know. I would love to have my old life, plus fix it with the benefit of everything I have learned through this. Lots of affair counselling websites suggest sticking with it - the affair will be exposed as a fantasy, the limerance will abate etc. But I don’t know how realistic this is, and my wife is sticking to her guns through some fairly meaty downsides for her...

Thinking you can fix this is a huge mistake. That's up to her. You will never have your old life back. It's gone forever.
Currently you are living the life of a willing cuckold. Stop!!! All that does is lower your status and make you unnattractive.

Wake up
 

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I’d possibly take her back if she seemed genuinely interested in fixing herself and our marriage. But she isn’t.
Expose to the POSOM's partner. In fact, expose to every adult who is associated with you two as a couple.

You will be amazed how quickly the limerance goes away and how fast the denial goes away, and all they have left will be the sickening, stupid-me-for-doing-this.

The real chances of a marriage beginning in adultery becoming viable are 1) slim; 2) none. They have both proven to each other that marriage means nothing to them and they are both quite willing to commit adultery.

It's only my $ .02, but I ask you to reconsider your "take her back". You don't really want to continue to live with someone who has this little respect for God, for you, for the sanctity of her marriage, or her kids.

Others have given good advice about "180" and concentrate on you.

I'm only going to add one more thing. This affair has nothing to do with being a "nice guy". It's good for your future relationships that you're not a "nice guy", but this affair is solely, completely, entered into, and kept going, because of the moral deficiencies of your wife.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Thank you for the varied advice. It is v good to get views and even the tough challenges.

I have read widely inc. No More Mr Nice Guy. I do get it - and I am at the stage with the 180 where I have gotten strong enough to be ambivalent about my relationship with her - I am ready to move one having worked on PIES etc fairly extensively.

The challenge is the real one of my children - no good grinding my wife into the dirt if it damages them and their view of me.

Who moves out also has some pretty major financial and future lifestyle impacts. Easier said than done to suggest one person leaves without having sorted the divorce financial split (which is instructed to my lawyer) - and I need to avoid a long battle on money/kids.

the length/complexity of our lives/marriage makes it v hard for a walk away to be a simple thing.
 

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Lordhail,

You have been too soft in this whole process, you should be the one calling the shots, not her.
1. Get a great attorney and ensure she gets the bare minimum
2. Out her to all your family and friends and to the OM's partner and daughter (why on earth are you waiting, the chances are he will drop her like a hot potato)
3. Get a nanny immediately and get her to start working in your home with the kids, while your wife is still there. Let your wife see that you really do not need her. A hot nanny, even better :) get that plan in motion now, so that your wife can train her. It will also give your wife some of her own medicine bringing another woman into the home (though platonic). Show her you mean business and are moving on without her.
4. Tell her parents, your inlaws, her siblings, everyone. You must go scorched earth on her ass
5. I think you would be a fool to take her back, she is now having her cake and eating it. File for divorce, your wife may turn it around but she will do it again, she is not a good woman. She is a terrible example for your kids. She doesn't care about the impact on them, nor you, why do you want to fix things with her.
Get a backbone FGS! and take action.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
The bit I struggle with - to what end does scorched earth work? Either it is to shake her from limerance (to get her “back”?) or for revenge (not such a good look). There is a good chance she keeps the kids regardless of what I want, and co-parenting is better for them than single parenting.

So being real about the kids is the hard bit.

Am speaking to lawyer (am in UK) - papers will go out next week. But realistically I need to find mediated position on divorce settlement, or all the money will go on fees etc.
 

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The behaviors and attitudes you should adopt will serve no purpose whatsoever to change your wife. Your wife is making a choice because she knows she can "cake eat" with you. That you have so much investment in the marriage that she can use you as her "plan B provider guy" while also using her POSOM as her "plan A fun guy".

"Scorched earth" and similar descriptively named attitudes are intended for neither revenge nor for creating any change in your wife. The target of these attitudes and actions is YOU. They are designed to show YOU that you are not going to accept being "plan B provider guy" while her AP is "plan A fun guy".

And, I agree, that you should be careful to not disparage your wife to your kids.

And, I agree, that there is a large possibility your wife will be the custodial parent of your kids. My lawyer told me, I'm glad that he did, because I think the choice I made to remain in their house was protective of them, I really didn't want them to be subjected to the **** carousel.

I did 180..... I lived there, but was no longer a part of our marriage.

aine said:
she is not a good woman. She is a terrible example for your kids. She doesn't care about the impact on them, nor you
 

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[email protected], because you mentioned the autumn and spell counselling with the extral, I'm going to presume you are British?

What I would suggest is to check out your legal position with local solicitors. Have the initial free consultations with all of them which will stymie her attempts to get a local solicitor.

And please get tested for STDs.

And threaten to have her on the Jeremy Kyle Show. >:)
 

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OK, what are the downsides for her?

One, that is likely, is that her OM is playing her for a fool. He will soon dump her tush in the bin. Just like he did to the others.
Then again, maybe not..


She is desperate for love and attention and has gotten it in spades from the new man.
Love and love chemicals.... cannot a price tag be attached.

I would ask her politely to leave. This will rush the dumping sequence from her new love. He will tire of her quicker. {One would hope}.

She will then realize that life on the other side of the lily pad pond is not greener in things bought with cash. She needs to feel some pain, some new loneliness and some deprivation.

Being on her own and ignored will give her plenty to think about and deal with. {Again, one would hope}.

Since you want her back, do the 180 with a sad smile. Make no promises about any possible returning.

We all go through cycles, some get caught up in the mid-life spin-cycle. She is right on schedule with her new love, separation cycle.
Let us see if she can eject herself from this brain flattening, centrifugal force.

I would just let her go, and never look back. Oh, my.





[THM]- Lilly McGarvey
 

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@Lordhail,

I am a person who is a former wayward wife (my Dear Hubby has subsequently died...so it was years ago). When my then Dear Hubby found out, he did two things that REALLY dropped the scales from my eyes for which I still admire him to this day:

1) He emailed the OM (my affair was an online EA) and said: "She is MY WIFE, and if you think I am going to give up my wife without a fight you are sadly mistaken."

This dropped scales from my eyes because up to that point I did not think he cared one bit about me or losing me, and after he wrote that email, I knew that he did because he didn't just talk about it--HE ACTED. Up to this point you've been "nice" about it. Another man is romancing YOUR WIFE who has both moral and legal obligations to you, and you are being "nice" about it. Now I'm not advocating being a jerk or badass or anything illegal or violent...I'm just strongly suggesting that you stop "being nice" about her adultery. Grow a spine, stand strong, and let her know that this is a MARRIAGE and you will not accept or tolerate anything short of honoring her vows 100%. Period.

2) He packed my bag, took me to the train station, and told me "Okay this is it. Either I buy you a ticket and you leave to be with the OM, or you decide to come home and be with me, but know this: if you choose to leave, the door here will be closed forever. You will never come home and you will never ever again be anything to me."

This dropped scales from my eyes because up to that point I had the "rainbows and unicorns" view of a nice hubby at home with a warm fire in the fireplace, and a thrilling lover on the side who wooed me with compliments and fancy words. I may not have thought it out loud, but yeah--I thought I'd keep having both! He made it clear that was NOT ACCEPTABLE to him, and that I was free to make my own choices, BUT if I wanted HIM...I had to honor my vows! For you, I strongly recommend that you make it clear tat YOU are taking a stand to protect YOUR FAMILY...and that the marital home and marital assets will no longer be squandered for her to have a lover. If she wants a lover, she has to leave the house and finance her own cell phone and her own internet and her own lunches or dinners out, etc. YOUR finances, YOUR energy and YOUR benefits are going to go toward the family and the marriage.

So yeah--pack her luggage this afternoon, have them at the front door, and allow her to realize that the natural consequence of dilly-dallying around with loverboy is that she has to move out and provide for herself. Yeah...after a year of divorce paperwork and malarchy she may get 50% of some marital assets, but not today, and TODAY she either gives up loverboy or gives up the benefits of YOU (not least of which is the comfy marital home and having all her bills paid from marital funds). Now...even if she has a job equal to yours (I will assume she does, and she's not a SAHM), she has had access to double the funds with the two of you working--she has had access to double the credit power--she has had access to what the two of you provided together. Sure she could go rent a place but it wouldn't be near as nice as the house she is in with the two of you. Sure she could pay for groceries and bills, but OUCH that health insurance sure takes a lot, and she wouldn't have nearly the discretionary funds! That's the COST of loverboy!

So please man up and grow a pair. :) You don't have to be a mean jerk, but being a strong man who stands firm FOR HIS FAMILY is impressive.
 
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