[Loveher4ever]

Help appreciated: Wife not "in love" anymore round 2!
Thank you in advance for your help and insight. First some background info: my wife and I have been together for almost 7 yrs and married 3. When times are good my wife and I are extremely happy together. Trouble is I have gone through what we call "cycles" where I severely stop showing my wife I love her through romance (average about one/yr). I'll always be kind, tell her I love her, etc but the planning special things kinda of disappears. (I know, big problem). I was laid off right before we got married and fell into a depression but never got help until 5 months later. During this time things got rough but I was ignorant to it. My wife ended up having an affair that summer, I caught her, freaked out because she had denied it and moved out. I sought help for my depression and my marriage. Learned about the fixing myself (started working out, hung out with friends, etc) and ignored my wife. Well 2 months later my wife came back, extremely apologetic and really just threw the whole thing about me being disengaged as to why she went elsewhere for the attention.
Things got better after that (i abruptly stopped seeing my counsler too) and only here or there did I have issues with my "cycles." Last year I had to work overnights for my job (FYI...I got the job after learning about the affair) and it put a strain on the marriage. My wife was longing for "us" time which I tried to give to her but I could have been more involved. Nonetheless we weathed that assignment but coming back to days at the beginning of the summer I never showed her romance, etc (in other words I suck again).
Sept 4th my wife texts me that "I'm sorry for being withdrawn. I am trying to figure out how to save this marriage and nothing comes to mind. It hurts me to say that. For months we've been drifting apart. No there is not someone else. Maybe I've fallen out of love with you. I don't know." So I said thank you for being honest and we talked a little. We decided to take a mini trip to Vermont and go camping. We had a great time and we talked. When we came home she was even saying I love you again.
So to speed this up (I'm sorry for writing so much), my wife is in an EA for sure with a guy from work. From what I've gathered it started about 2-3 weeks after our trip. I'll be honest I have real issues with being a romantic (it's an excuse but I work 50-60 hrs a week) but this time I was actually doing things but it was too late because she wasn't appreciating it due to the new guy having her interest. The rest is textbook: started to ignore me, bought new clothes, started hanging out with him without telling me, no more I love yous, etc.
It comes to a head and brings me to today when on last Sunday she asks to go shopping to pick up some things before we go up north for the week on vacation. Well she doesn't come home until 11pm and tells me she went to this guys house ! I lost it, told her she couldn't have both, me and him. That if she wasn't sleeping with him she sure as heck was having an EA. I slept on the couch that night after leaving the bedroom. Monday morning my wife wakes me up like nothing happened all lovingly. She tells me to come on and get ready. I was still heated and told her we needed to talk or else I wasn't going. Well after some verbal exchanges amounting to really nothing I decided I wasn't going. As my wife gets ready to go she stops and tells me " I'm not a bad person, I'm not sleeping with him. You always do this...you wait and wait to show me what I tell you I need. I'll always love you. You stay home and figure yourself out. Maybe you should go back to your counselor."
All week I've been a mess. But I cleaned the house like a champ, planned out a workout schedule and made an appointment to see my counselor (I don't really know why I get so zoned out...hopefully I can figure that out because its not intentional). Problem is all week my wife has been camping and texting this guy non stop. She is coming home tomorrow and wants to talk...
How to proceed so that I don't let this EA continue but also give myself another chance to be a better husband....

 

[Maricha75]

Question: Did you ever tell anyone that she cheated on you the first time? Do not, I repeat, DO NOT let her make you think her CHEATING is YOUR fault. She had a choice. If she wasn't getting through to you, she could have separated, filed for divorce, etc to wake you up. Instead, she chose to divert her affections elsewhere. This is NOT on you! It is SOLELY on her. Now, yes, you need to show her the affection. You do need to figure out why you go through these cycles. Have you ever been diagnosed with anything other than depression?

Seriously, if I didn't know better, I'd say you were my husband... before my 2nd EA ended! Just don't do what my husband did... he had an EA of his own. It certainly woke me up though! If you haven't already, talk to her parents or any other trusted, close relative... expose her cheating.

"I'm not a bad person, I'm not sleeping with him"? Please, she's still having an affair. She is still cheating. It is JUST as bad as a PA, whether she wants to admit it or not. I once thought as your wife does. I was just as wrong. If she wants to stay in the marriage, she needs to cut out the bullsh!t and commit. No more texting other men. No more hiding things. She needs to give you access to everything, all passwords, everything. UGH! Seriously, don't back down on this. She gets an ultimatum...him or you. And, if she says "IDK" tell her fine, then she can get out. There will NOT be a third person in your marriage. You will NOT allow this to continue. If she wants to screw around with someone else, she can leave. And yes, even if they are not having sex, she is still screwing around with him. Her "friendship" is taking her away from you, her husband. Unacceptable.

I think, ion addition to YOU going to see YOUR counselor, SHE needs to see one as well...and you need to get into MC. Get "Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass. And, I think you should get "5 Love Languages" as well...see what exactly you BOTH need to feel loved...and start speaking each other's language.

But, first, this POSOM needs to GTFO, pronto.

 

[Loveher4ever]

Thank you for the reply, it helps to hear thoughts from others. I most def did expose the first PA. I got hammered the night I found out and called practically her whole family....got a little ugly but everyone got the message.
No I haven't been diagnosed with anything else but I wouldn't be surprised if I had something like a mild case of adhd...from what I read the symptoms and experiences of husbands/wives with a spouse that has it fits me to a T (I will have a chance to work/figure this out when I meet with my counselor again on Monday).
I guess the tricky thing I'm struggling with is acknowledging my opportunities to be a better husband but not use that as the excuse for my wife. I told myself before if this happened again I'm done....I just can't believe 3 years later I'm checking phone records again and am feeling this pain of being 2nd in my wife's life. It hurts. I love her, including her imperfections but Jeez why this again...this one almost feels worst because I really thinks she believes its okay.
Thanks again to all who respond.

 

[tom67]

Thank you for the reply, it helps to hear thoughts from others. I most def did expose the first PA. I got hammered the night I found out and called practically her whole family....got a little ugly but everyone got the message.
No I haven't been diagnosed with anything else but I wouldn't be surprised if I had something like a mild case of adhd...from what I read the symptoms and experiences of husbands/wives with a spouse that has it fits me to a T (I will have a chance to work/figure this out when I meet with my counselor again on Monday).
I guess the tricky thing I'm struggling with is acknowledging my opportunities to be a better husband but not use that as the excuse for my wife. I told myself before if this happened again I'm done....I just can't believe 3 years later I'm checking phone records again and am feeling this pain of being 2nd in my wife's life. It hurts. I love her, including her imperfections but Jeez why this again...this one almost feels worst because I really thinks she believes its okay.
Thanks again to all who respond.

Expose and stop being a bloody doormat please.

 

[Loveher4ever]

If my wife chooses to ignore the EA or not stop it....how do you go about explaining to get out of the apartment. What I mean is we rent with both our names on the lease, can I really force her out? 3 yrs ago with the PA I packed up and left and she followed behind and got her things and left. I proceeded to move back in thereafter. I hear ya on not being a doormat, should I leave again? Or just tell her fine and proceed to give her a heads up that I will be terminating the lease (huge, I mean huge penalty for that of about 3000)? The part that makes me mad is I'm the one who pays for 70% of the bills and could easily afford to pay everything myself, my wife however def couldn't do so. Thanks again for the advice.

 

[Maricha75]

That's the thing. She needs to step up as well. She needs to stop the cheating. It doesn't matter what you do to improve yourself to become a better husband. As someone pointed out to me a few weeks ago, I am a serial cheater. My first EA wasn't exposed to everyone though, only the second one. When your wife gets back, tell her she needs to choose, right now... him or you. And, if she says she can't decide right now, tell her to get out. I'm serious. By saying she can't choose now, she is choosing the OM. She needs to be made to realize that cheating is NEVER the answer to marital problems, no matter how much she talks to you about her needs. It doesn't matter how often you take her for granted, or go through your cycles.

My husband is bipolar and add (along with a few other diagnoses). It was wrong for me to cheat, and it is equally wrong for your wife to cheat. At the time, his diagnosis was "just" depression. It was so bad that he withdrew from me. Instead of focusing on our kids and even trying to help him, I got resentful and failed to cope well with it. So... I had an EA.

Regardless of the circumstances surrounding the discontent on the marriage, it does NOT give her a free pass to cheat on you. Like I said, meet her at the door and tell her the only thing you want right now is for her to choose you or him. Before ANY other discussion. Don't let her push the blame all on you. And if she says "IDK" or "him", make her move out immediately.You said you can afford the bills yourself...well, there ya go.

I know you love her. God, my husband could easily have written what you did! But unless she is willing to put herself completely back into the marriage, there is no point in holding on. But, I will say that even when you have your cycles of depression or inattentiveness, you still need to make an effort to show you are TRYING to say "with it". If you get past the "him or me", put that on the table. And, tell her to point out when you withdraw...and LISTEN when she says these things. This has helped my husband and me tremendously. Even when one isn't feeling well, we STILL take time to just talk and/or hold each other every night.

 

[Loveher4ever]

That's the thing. She needs to step up as well. She needs to stop the cheating. It doesn't matter what you do to improve yourself to become a better husband. As someone pointed out to me a few weeks ago, I am a serial cheater. My first EA wasn't exposed to everyone though, only the second one. When your wife gets back, tell her she needs to choose, right now... him or you. And, if she says she can't decide right now, tell her to get out. I'm serious. By saying she can't choose now, she is choosing the OM. She needs to be made to realize that cheating is NEVER the answer to marital problems, no matter how much she talks to you about her needs. It doesn't matter how often you take her for granted, or go through your cycles.

My husband is bipolar and add (along with a few other diagnoses). It was wrong for me to cheat, and it is equally wrong for your wife to cheat. At the time, his diagnosis was "just" depression. It was so bad that he withdrew from me. Instead of focusing on our kids and even trying to help him, I got resentful and failed to cope well with it. So... I had an EA.

Regardless of the circumstances surrounding the discontent on the marriage, it does NOT give her a free pass to cheat on you. Like I said, meet her at the door and tell her the only thing you want right now is for her to choose you or him. Before ANY other discussion. Don't let her push the blame all on you. And if she says "IDK" or "him", make her move out immediately.You said you can afford the bills yourself...well, there ya go.

I know you love her. God, my husband could easily have written what you did! But unless she is willing to put herself completely back into the marriage, there is no point in holding on. But, I will say that even when you have your cycles of depression or inattentiveness, you still need to make an effort to show you are TRYING to say "with it". If you get past the "him or me", put that on the table. And, tell her to point out when you withdraw...and LISTEN when she says these things. This has helped my husband and me tremendously. Even when one isn't feeling well, we STILL take time to just talk and/or hold each other every night.

Thank you Maricha75 for your blunt honesty and sharing what you went through. I'll let you know how it goes...

 

[Loveher4ever]

I'm sorry for posting so much or sounding like a crazy man (my emotions are all over the place and I'm doing my best to stay civil this time and not freak out)...question is I haven't outed this affair yet. Deep down I'm honestly a little afraid because its an EA and not a PA this time. I know that sounds crazy but I feel that her dad and maybe friends might dismiss me since its not a PA. I know her mom might not though. How and what do I say? For the PA I was hammered and yelling through the phone to every friend or family member I had in my contact list. That obviously made me look foolish but because it was a PA the message still got across. I'm concerned that even I do so without the anger this time if I don't say the right things I will come across a a fool. I don't know sorry for the indecisiveness about this....rest assure though I'm not wavering on the me or him talk later. Thank you again

 

[Maricha75]

You tell them the truth...her affections are being diverted to a man other than yourself. It hasn't gone physical as of yet, but you want to nip it NOW before she goes that far...again. Look up as much info as you can about EAs and print it out, if you can. Get everything all together and then tell them, and say you could use their support in this. And, tell them that you decided that first time that if it happened again, you would be gone (or she gets kicked out, whatever). You are trying to prevent it from continuing..and this time, she is attaching herself to a coworker, someone she sees everyday. Yes, it is true that you have been less affectionate or haven't been showing your love for her as much or in ways she wants/needs... but it still doesn't condone her stepping out... not once, but twice. There is NO excuse for cheating, in ANY WAY, no matter what. And, you refuse to put up with it. And tell them that you are (or have) giving her a choice to either get all in the marriage, NO male confidants, or she leaves. No ifs, ands, or buts about it. Personally, I'd say no male friends at all at this point because she can't be trusted, but that's at your discretion. I have a couple male friends now... but they are not CLOSE friends. And, they are friends to my marriage, not just to me.

Get it? Just use those above as guidelines to figure out what to say. Take whatever you wish from my suggested scenario.

 

[Loveher4ever]

Update: she came home said she's very hungry and needs to eat (my wife is like me in that regard, bad time to talk). So I said okay but I have one question...are you going to stop cheating on me? She looked at me puzzled and angry saying I'm not cheating on you. I replied with yes you are by seeing him without me knowing and all the texting. Her response was I have to tell you everything I do and I told her yes when it comes to another man. I told her she is giving him her love and attention instead of me. She said my love? That's a good one and I told her she is in denial. She stepped out to get something to eat and when she comes back probably wants to talk but I think the only thing left to say is....leave.

Damn I really don't know this time...I've got my message to her parents done and will send it once she comes back (otherwise she'll not return before I tell her to get out).

I'm glad I found this forum this time around...I really appreciate those that are viewing and giving their support. It's good to know that there is genuinely nice people trying to help others in a time of need.

 

[DavidWYoung]

Time to be very strong and stand up for yourself. She WILL NOT RESPECT YOU if you back down now. Say it in a calm voice. You must leave now. I will not put up with this. Get out..............Yes, the SHBt will hit he fan for you but you will get thru it, and you will be more focused andsure of yourself. Listen to the people on this board, they really are life savers. God bless and good luck! David

 

[Maricha75]

Update: she came home said she's very hungry and needs to eat (my wife is like me in that regard, bad time to talk). So I said okay but I have one question...are you going to stop cheating on me? She looked at me puzzled and angry saying I'm not cheating on you. I replied with yes you are by seeing him without me knowing and all the texting. Her response was I have to tell you everything I do and I told her yes when it comes to another man. I told her she is giving him her love and attention instead of me. She said my love? That's a good one and I told her she is in denial. She stepped out to get something to eat and when she comes back probably wants to talk but I think the only thing left to say is....leave.

Damn I really don't know this time...I've got my message to her parents done and will send it once she comes back (otherwise she'll not return before I tell her to get out).

I'm glad I found this forum this time around...I really appreciate those that are viewing and giving their support. It's good to know that there is genuinely nice people trying to help others in a time of need.

The response to this, IF she maintains the stance that she is not cheating is "Yes, dear, your love. This is taking your attention/affection from me, your husband. And, I won't tolerate it any longer." As David Young said above, STAY STRONG! Do NOT back down!

 

[wiigirl]

Expose and stop being a bloody doormat please.

:iagree:

 

[jfv]

OP, there are people out there that cannot be emotionally and or physically monogamous.

I know people like this, i'm one of them. That's why I've never been married.

You married one of us.

You should not have to worry about being cheated on every time you stop being perfect.

Ask yourself. Is she perfect?

Have you cheated as a result?

Love yourself more than you love her.

There are 3 billion women on this planet.

You don't have kids.

Save yourself

 

[Archon]

You should not have to worry about being cheated on every time you stop being perfect.

Love yourself more than you love her.

There are 3 billion women on this planet.

You don't have kids.

Save yourself

What jfv said. (Also stealing it for my own situation, thanks jfv!)

You are explaining all the things she keeps doing, which are blatant slaps in the face. She will continue to keep doing them until you stand up for yourself! You don't need her. Divorce her and let her see what life is like without you. Besides, that's one heck of an EA. How confidant are you that it isn't a PA???

 

[Complexities]

I absolutely agree with other posters that you must stay strong and stand up for yourself. Make her realize you will not be disrespected.

 

[Loveher4ever]

I wanted to post to tell everyone I'm doing ok. It took longer than I should have let it but I moved out 2 days ago. November rent not paid so the apartment will be done by the 15th (at which time I'd settle/resolve the default to avoid ruining credit and cancel the lease). I got back to seeing my counselor and its refreshing/uplifting to be reconnecting with myself again. I'm in a weird place now emotionally though...my wife told me after I moved out that she wants to reconcile, is very sorry, still loves me, etc. (even mentioned mc). We're going to be meeting tomorrow to talk. Why does part of me feel disillusioned with the idea that we can ever repair this? I just can't see how I'd be able to ever trust her again. Am I just being lazy knowing how hard it is having gone through this before? I just don't know...I mean I was a wreck when moving out, when my wife was texting me that she can't live without me but now I'm doubting it all. I still love her...so I'm not sure why I feel so completely unmotivated now that I'm apart. :scratchhead:

 

[Archon]

You feel unmotivated because you're done with the relationship emotionally. Your wife cheated on you and you've decided to move on with your life. You can now rediscover who you are and what you like. This is a new beginning without your WS. You will doubt yourself but just remember the positives and that you WILL get through this ok. You will feel all sorts of emotions but just remember to stick to your guns!

 

[tom67]

I wanted to post to tell everyone I'm doing ok. It took longer than I should have let it but I moved out 2 days ago. November rent not paid so the apartment will be done by the 15th (at which time I'd settle/resolve the default to avoid ruining credit and cancel the lease). I got back to seeing my counselor and its refreshing/uplifting to be reconnecting with myself again. I'm in a weird place now emotionally though...my wife told me after I moved out that she wants to reconcile, is very sorry, still loves me, etc. (even mentioned mc). We're going to be meeting tomorrow to talk. Why does part of me feel disillusioned with the idea that we can ever repair this? I just can't see how I'd be able to ever trust her again. Am I just being lazy knowing how hard it is having gone through this before? I just don't know...I mean I was a wreck when moving out, when my wife was texting me that she can't live without me but now I'm doubting it all. I still love her...so I'm not sure why I feel so completely unmotivated now that I'm apart. :scratchhead:

Until the om is out of the picture mc is a waste of money. Sigh you should have made her move out now she can have om in your house and bed ick!

 

[Ovid]

Get this moved to the cheating forums. You'll get a lot more help for this topic.

Until then.
Lay it down. Let her know that it ends now. If it doesn't end immediately file for divorce and cut her off emotionally, and cut any money that is helping her cheat.

You can always retract the divorce if you change your mind, but if you don't take decicive action she will continue to treat you like a doormat.