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Discussion Starter #42 (Edited)
Stop doing anything that makes you discontent with your wife, whether thet be porn or lusting after a 30 year old(and how is that any different from someone of 25, they are still young enough to be your daughter). Stop comparing her to her friends.
I don't on purpose. Just happens.

Think about how you would feel if she was looking at porn of younger men, wanting you to be more like them, have a larger penis, comparing you to men who earn more, who have bigger houses, better careers etc. Really put yourself in that position and think how it makes you feel. Disrespected and coming up wanting.
pretty crappy, of course. But like I said, and this is why the below is relevant, she has no reason to look elsewhere.

As for how 'very good looking' you are, we cant say, but men generally do think they look better and younger that they actually are.
See above.
I know this sounds boastful, and that is not my intention, but objectively, this is true. There are few men my age who can compete with my looks. Of course, male models and he-men will take me by a mile, but I stand high among regular joes.
Not that this is a reason in any way that she would not cheat on me, she would never do that because she loves me and we have a very good relationship and she is a good person who would not cheat or look at other guys regardless of her husbands looks. But it IS a reason why there is no symmetry, and no feeling of "what would you feel if she looks at porn or other guys" - it would not occur to her, nor would she need to. Thus it's relevant to this discussion.

In other words, would it bother me as much, were our looks more symmetrical?

Oh and are you practising Jewish?
that, is an excellent question. more for a private discussion.
 

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Wow.

I did not think I would get so many replies. Some were unhelpfully hurtful, some accused me of lying (I won't argue facts- there is indeed a large asymmetry between myself - I AM very good looking, in shape, man - no underestimation), but some of the replies certainly made me wake up a bit and consider. So thank you for taking the time to reply, because, for the first time in my life, I have a mirror held up to my face. Until now, it's always only been my own thoughts and, if I am honest with myself, excuses. I did a lot of thinking past 48 hours. So:

A few things to clarify:
1. Yes, this feeling of mine has indeed been since our second child, so over 20 years ago. Not a midlife crisis, rather a low-grade constant crisis. Otherwise, my life is a good one, and I/we am/are fortunate in health, good jobs (mid-middle class, yet steady). I had when one might call a small midlife crisis during my early 40s,, but some money was thrown at it and all is good.

2. DW and I had discussed this (the "Issue") years ago, and we did go through some tougher times where we were a bit distant and this affected us. But once I realized not much will change and made a decision this is something I will need to live with, I accepted it. I rarely talk about it with her anymore as There is nothing to gain.

3. Seems to me, that some posters think that sex is so important that divorce should be considered when one side is unhappy, and DW "deserves someone who wants her". I agree in theory, however, life is large, and there are many satisfying things in life. Companionship, caring, enjoyment of spending time together, raising great kids, mutual support, loyalty, love. These, we have in spades, thus divorce is simply not an option, not something I/we want. One can be in love, but not necessarily in lust. While this might be considered disloyal, I have always seen it as a small price to pay, especially considering that I have never, and don't intend to, take external action and cheat. (In spite of some fantasies.). Yes, I do see this as a certain sacrifice. You can poo-poo this, but feelings are feelings.

4. Over the years, as one poster advised, I have tried to focus on what I DO like about her physically. It has helped. But I still have this slightly disgusting feeling when I see her undressed. Thus I try to avoid it. What am I supposed to do - I can't help my feelings.

5. Over time, there have been periods when I watched no porn at all. But then something triggers, and back to it, I go. I know porn can be destructive, thus I try very much to put it in it's place.

6. Glass full /empty. I think I DO see the almost full glass, and thus, overall, I am happy. Yet, I think that I am allowed to also think of myself, and not only as "us" as a "couple". But this issue is, in spite of #3, something that bothers me.

7. When I married her, she was of course thinner. I knew in the back of my mind, that she was not my "ideal", (sorry ladies, 94.7% of men want some unachievable ideal in women (add here the funny meme about statistics)). But I loved her and we had a lot in common. Over time and kids, like most, you know, she changed. But then I also noticed that, if I were to plot a graph and compare her, (and cmon people, people compare everything, all the time, automatically), to her peers (age, kids etc), she is closer to the left side outliers, than even the center. Sounds horrible to do this, now that I write this, but it's automatic - I have eyes. To be clear, this is not comparing to 20-30 yo's, or the women you see in porn. Just normal people. And yes, again, this bothers me.

8. Do you know that silly thing about "half age +7"? so in my case, this is more or less true. I don't ogle 20-year-old girls- I see them as I see a child, heck my oldest is in her mid 20s. But I can't help being attracted to "hot" 30-year-olds. Remember what Hannibal Lecter said? "We begin by coveting what we see every day ". (Thus the 10th commandment. God, or whoever wrote it (not getting into theology here), was pretty smart.)

9. My wife's HD is very well taken care of. I am actually a very good husband, in spite of my inner thoughts and what some post here.

10. I did not mention in my OP, that I was informed later in life of some non-vanilla tendencies. As I said, DW was my first and only, so I have no real-world experience, only ideas and fantasies. We are all informed by the things we see or read, yet I was more insulated as a teenager (Ken Follet was a spicey as I had) and it took some time to discover. FetLife showed me that there are real-life people who enjoy alternate lifestyles, and this part is not so much from porn. I don't visit there often because of the jealously it raises in me.
However, my DW is 100% vanilla. Yes, we discussed these things too. Zero interest. Oral and PIV, that's about it. (Me on her. She is game for doing bjs, but it does not work for me. I never got what guys see in it. Maybe it's technique? Does not matter, bottom line, nada). She offered to try some stuff, but to me, unless she wants it too, it makes it seem ridiculous. So here too, I see this as a sacrifice, something I will not be able to enjoy in this life. Sure, it's a choice, we all have choices, but it's not really - I don't truly have a choice. When balancing some extra pleasure vs. Life, Life wins. But, this is another reason I turn to some porn.

11. I think Vlad's comment is valid. The answer is, I think I was wanting some cooling. Some perspective. How stupid am I being. Is my experience common.


I think I take home from all of this, that I will try to stop, or at least put some breaks on, porn, and again concentrate on what I do like about her. That what I am doing can be harmful in spite of my own thinking I am so strong. I guess I needed to hear these comments. Cheers. (Again sorry for the length, but this has long been bottled up inside).
I get what you are saying about the rest of the marriage being quite wonderful. But I just can't get past you saying you have a slightly disgusted feeling when you see her undressed. I think if you took a poll, many many women would decide to terminate a marriage to a man who felt disgust at their naked body (and had for decades and were never really happy with it even at the beginning of the marriage while thinner), no mattet how good the rest of the marriage was

It sounds like she isn't obese, but has a stocky body type and is carrying weight. She goes to the gym 3x a week you said, it's not like she didn't work on her body.

Your wife is living a lie because she is unaware of the disgust you feel about her.
 

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I don't on purpose. Just happens.



pretty crappy, of course. But like I said, and this is why the below is relevant, she has no reason to look elsewhere.



See above.
I know this sounds boastful, and that is not my intention, but objectively, this is true. There are few men my age who can compete with my looks. Of course, male models and he-men will take me by a mile, but I stand high among regular joes.
Not that this is a reason in any way that she would not cheat on me, she would never do that because she loves me and we have a very good relationship and she is a good person who would not cheat or look at other guys regardless of her husbands looks. But it IS a reason why there is no symmetry, and no feeling of "what would you feel if she looks at porn or other guys" - it would not occur to her, nor would she need to. Thus it's relevant to this discussion.

In other words, would it bother me as much, were our looks more symmetrical?



that, is an excellent question. more for a private discussion.
You do realise that people with very good looking spouses still look at porn and leave their spouses. Look at the many good looking couples in Hollywood, always having affairs and breaking up. The fact that you may or may not be good looking is irrelevant to that. For women especially how their spouse looks is only part of their attraction. There is SO much more to it than that. Arrogance is something that does put many women off. Sorry but you come across as very arrogant and your looks dont matter if she doeant feel loved or accepted.
Someone who doesnt feel accepted by their spouse is not happy, and she will know to some extent how you feel. The fact that you are lying to her constantly by looking at porn and lusting after young women doeant make you at all attractive either. Where is your integrity?

It sounds as if you have a treasure, just stop this awful comparison. You are making this worse by your attitide and actions. You are very blessed to have her.
 

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Been giving this more thought. You seem to be saying that because your wife in her 50's isnt the size and shape of your 'ideal woman' you are within your rights to look at such women on porn and at work. She on the other hand has such a good looking husband that she would never need to do those things. How can you not see how arrogant that sounds? How wrong that is? How deluded that is?
I once heard a pastor saying that our wives must be our standard of beauty. I thought that was amazing. Once you change you mind set and stop the things you are doing you will see your wife differently. Keep your eyes and your thoughts off other women and place them on your wife.
 

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I'm thinking it takes a good bit of acting/effort to be the kind of husband you want to be for your wife. Women often sense the effort involved. All humans want to be appealing to their SO. What happens when one is physically marred by accident, time, illness, etc.?

Glad you wanted to release some of your frustration/desires. Having no comparison negates the real knowing what might be different--or not. Would something like a mommy makeover like many women have make any difference?
 

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I've been to the middle east and I think women, young and old are gorgeous over there! Men, on the other hand, not so much unless they are from Lebanon.

When you say you consider yourself very attractive I kinda have my doubts about it because men over there have their egos inflated as well. Your culture is very controlling and very patriarchal.

I understand we feel attracted to certain people. I understand you don't feel physically attracted to your wife. That's the issue you have and that's your problem, not your wife's. She really doesn't have to do anything because I suspect she still finds you attractive.

Even if your wife had a tummy tuck (I know plastic surgery is very common in the middle east) won't be enough for you to find your wife attractive again, because you said you weren't crazy about her in the beginning, so this issue is not new, it just got worse over the years.

It's your choice to stay or divorce but I have the feeling things are not going to improve for you in your marriage because you chose to marry someone who wasn't your "ideal" that was a big mistake and now you feel stuck.

Make sure your kids don't make the same mistake you made and tell them to fall crazy in love with their partners before getting married.

I'm feel sorry for you and your wife. I just can't imagine being in your wife's shoes. It's sad.
 

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Discussion Starter #48
I've been to the middle east and I think women, young and old are gorgeous over there! Men, on the other hand, not so much unless they are from Lebanon.
SNIP
This is stupid, I am what I am, I have no reason to lie.


I don't understand why people are so against me.
I understand the part about porn, OK, I get it that. I will certainly try to stop that, at least slow it down, and try to stop comparing. I'll admit I took that for granted that it's OK as long as she does not know, but y'all certainly put a mirror in front of me and I will do my best to put that out of my mind and concentrate on what I do find pleasing about her. I know that is not simple, yet luckily I am not addicted to porn (as addiction is defined) and I am busy enough that I can put effort into alternative actions. For this, I do thank this community.

Otherwise, yes, there is a certain amount of acting in my life. But don't we all act in parts of our lives? Do we not act civil to bosses we hate? Don't we make compromises to our mates in a myriad of things? Do we all truly "practice what we preach" to our kids, all the time? Don't we act towards our friends and neighbors in certain things? Put on certain facades in various situations?
Of course we do, and I think there is a modicum of insincerity or hypocrisy in some of the reactions. No need to feel sorry for us, my DW is happy, I am a very good husband in all other aspects of our lives, and even sexually she is more than satisfied. I am usually satisfied too. What does it matter if internally I cringe, or have some bad feelings? That is my problem, not my wife's. Why should I break her heart by telling her? What is to be gained by any type of separation?

And except for this, our marriage is blessed. Like I already mentioned above, life has many facets, and in all other ways, I am there for her, support her, help her, care about her. These are all mutual. I feel that as long as she never knows of my physical issues with her, how does that affect our lives? There is nothing to improve in our marriage because all is good. And not only on the surface. Only only in this thing, this one thing that only to ME is a problem, one that I will never let her know, I suffer. (Suffer might be a too strong word, I lack a lesser one.)

I am willing to sacrifice a possibly more fulfilling sex life for myself, (and, I am aware that in truth, the grass is not truly greener anywhere else, anyway) for the current life I have. As some have said or hinted here, in spite of the good looks that I claim, I am nearing 50, and who wants a 50-year-old anyway. So, I bury those specific feelings deep and live with them. Unburdening them here for the first time ever has given me some perspective.

Why does it bother some so much?
 

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This is stupid, I am what I am, I have no reason to lie.


I don't understand why people are so against me.
I understand the part about porn, OK, I get it that. I will certainly try to stop that, at least slow it down, and try to stop comparing. I'll admit I took that for granted that it's OK as long as she does not know, but y'all certainly put a mirror in front of me and I will do my best to put that out of my mind and concentrate on what I do find pleasing about her. I know that is not simple, yet luckily I am not addicted to porn (as addiction is defined) and I am busy enough that I can put effort into alternative actions. For this, I do thank this community.

Otherwise, yes, there is a certain amount of acting in my life. But don't we all act in parts of our lives? Do we not act civil to bosses we hate? Don't we make compromises to our mates in a myriad of things? Do we all truly "practice what we preach" to our kids, all the time? Don't we act towards our friends and neighbors in certain things? Put on certain facades in various situations?
Of course we do, and I think there is a modicum of insincerity or hypocrisy in some of the reactions. No need to feel sorry for us, my DW is happy, I am a very good husband in all other aspects of our lives, and even sexually she is more than satisfied. I am usually satisfied too. What does it matter if internally I cringe, or have some bad feelings? That is my problem, not my wife's. Why should I break her heart by telling her? What is to be gained by any type of separation?

And except for this, our marriage is blessed. Like I already mentioned above, life has many facets, and in all other ways, I am there for her, support her, help her, care about her. These are all mutual. I feel that as long as she never knows of my physical issues with her, how does that affect our lives? There is nothing to improve in our marriage because all is good. And not only on the surface. Only only in this thing, this one thing that only to ME is a problem, one that I will never let her know, I suffer. (Suffer might be a too strong word, I lack a lesser one.)

I am willing to sacrifice a possibly more fulfilling sex life for myself, (and, I am aware that in truth, the grass is not truly greener anywhere else, anyway) for the current life I have. As some have said or hinted here, in spite of the good looks that I claim, I am nearing 50, and who wants a 50-year-old anyway. So, I bury those specific feelings deep and live with them. Unburdening them here for the first time ever has given me some perspective.

Why does it bother some so much?
i dont critisize you at all, i actually feel sorry for you, it must be so hard to have sex with soemone that you dont find sexually attractive
 

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This is stupid, I am what I am, I have no reason to lie.


I don't understand why people are so against me.
I understand the part about porn, OK, I get it that. I will certainly try to stop that, at least slow it down, and try to stop comparing. I'll admit I took that for granted that it's OK as long as she does not know, but y'all certainly put a mirror in front of me and I will do my best to put that out of my mind and concentrate on what I do find pleasing about her. I know that is not simple, yet luckily I am not addicted to porn (as addiction is defined) and I am busy enough that I can put effort into alternative actions. For this, I do thank this community.

Otherwise, yes, there is a certain amount of acting in my life. But don't we all act in parts of our lives? Do we not act civil to bosses we hate? Don't we make compromises to our mates in a myriad of things? Do we all truly "practice what we preach" to our kids, all the time? Don't we act towards our friends and neighbors in certain things? Put on certain facades in various situations?
Of course we do, and I think there is a modicum of insincerity or hypocrisy in some of the reactions. No need to feel sorry for us, my DW is happy, I am a very good husband in all other aspects of our lives, and even sexually she is more than satisfied. I am usually satisfied too. What does it matter if internally I cringe, or have some bad feelings? That is my problem, not my wife's. Why should I break her heart by telling her? What is to be gained by any type of separation?

And except for this, our marriage is blessed. Like I already mentioned above, life has many facets, and in all other ways, I am there for her, support her, help her, care about her. These are all mutual. I feel that as long as she never knows of my physical issues with her, how does that affect our lives? There is nothing to improve in our marriage because all is good. And not only on the surface. Only only in this thing, this one thing that only to ME is a problem, one that I will never let her know, I suffer. (Suffer might be a too strong word, I lack a lesser one.)

I am willing to sacrifice a possibly more fulfilling sex life for myself, (and, I am aware that in truth, the grass is not truly greener anywhere else, anyway) for the current life I have. As some have said or hinted here, in spite of the good looks that I claim, I am nearing 50, and who wants a 50-year-old anyway. So, I bury those specific feelings deep and live with them. Unburdening them here for the first time ever has given me some perspective.

Why does it bother some so much?
Most women would know already that their husband doesnt like their body. .
 

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I don't understand why people are so against me.
Maybe because you are forcing your wife to live a lie. At some point in the next few years, you will most likely start to have issues with your 'equipment' working. Even if you considered your wife to be drop-dead gorgeous, you would still encounter problems. Since you are basically turned off by your wife, your problems will be exacerbated. Maybe you'll be pleased to no longer have to fulfill your duty. Where will that leave your wife?

How about you have a gentle conversation with her and explain that you are finding her less attractive and let her decide if she wants to work on it. For the benefit of both of you. Call it a preventive measure.
 

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I don't understand why people are so against me.


Why does it bother some so much?
As I said in my earlier posts, your post has hit a nerve and triggered a variety people.

Most of the regular posters here are in the 40s and above and many have either been cheated on or their partners have lost romantic/sexual interest in them and haven’t had an active and satisfying sex life in a long time.

A number of people here have had partners that have either met someone else and packed up and left or have simply lost attraction to them and checked out.

One of a middle aged woman’s fears is her partner losing interest in her due to weight gain and stretch marks etc and discarding for a younger woman without looking back.

So when you opening describe how you have lost desire for your wife due to some extra pounds and talk of yearning for slimmer women, it hits a very raw and primal nerve.

Another disturbing feature is many middle age men do remain or even become more attractive to women as they age (up to a certain point) and there are many walk-away-husbands in the world that simply trade in their middle age wives for newer models.

Additionally many of the men are here because their wives have simply lost desire for them and couldn’t care less if they ever have sex with them again and the men have basically been emotionally and sexually discarded by their wives.

Many of the men here would crawl naked through broken glass and rusty thumbtacks for a woman that still had some semblance of a sex drive and some attraction and desire for them...... and they wouldn’t care less if that woman had some extra pounds or stretch marks or a belly that just won’t go away despite proper diet and exercise.

So even the men here can see themselves in your wife’s position of being the one who is no longer desired and just being kept around for the “other” services that they provide, as well as seeing you as not appreciating something that they want so badly.

In essence, the people here on this site are here due to being in your wife’s position and they are identifying more with your wife rather than being empathetic and supportive of your perspective.
 

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The fact that you "internally cringe" about your wife's body and have felt that way for decades is extremely unsettling. And no, it's not like the other facades people present in life.
 

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Heck, my wife has added at least about 40 pounds since we got married. Of course, she is in full menopause, though. Do I wish she would lose some weight? Of course, but I understand that she isn't as young as she once was, and losing weight is certainly not as easy as it used to be. She has actually tried, though I think she has given up on it now. I can overlook any "flaws" of her body because I can still see the beautiful woman I married underneath. I love her dearly, and we still have sex at least 4 times a week. I'm 59, and she is 54, and we have been married over 23-1/2 years. She definitely loves me, and is the best wife and mother a man could ask for. I married her for better or for worse, so there's that, right? You have to focus on the positive, not the negative. I see hot women all the time, and being a man I look...., discretely, mind you. I know she does the same, even though I am definitely above average in looks. The thing is though, we know neither of us would blow up our marriage over attraction to others.
 

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Heck, my wife has added at least about 40 pounds since we got married. Of course, she is in full menopause, though. Do I wish she would lose some weight? Of course, but I understand that she isn't as young as she once was, and losing weight is certainly not as easy as it used to be. She has actually tried, though I think she has given up on it now. I can overlook any "flaws" of her body because I can still see the beautiful woman I married underneath. I love her dearly, and we still have sex at least 4 times a week. I'm 59, and she is 54, and we have been married over 23-1/2 years. She definitely loves me, and is the best wife and mother a man could ask for. I married her for better or for worse, so there's that, right? You have to focus on the positive, not the negative. I see hot women all the time, and being a man I look...., discretely, mind you. I know she does the same, even though I am definitely above average in looks. The thing is though, we know neither of us would blow up our marriage over attraction to others.
Do you feel disgust at the sight of your wife's naked body? Do you internally cringe? This OP does.
 

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It is perfectly possible to lose attraction for a man you once considered very attractive. You get used to it and you see the whole package at some point. Really, it only takes one wrong move or insult for a women to lose attraction for you. So don't get too comfortable with that. And just because you figure she can't find someone who on the surface is as good, doesn't mean she might not be happier alone. Just don't take it for granted, that's all.
 

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As I said in my earlier posts, your post has hit a nerve and triggered a variety people.

Most of the regular posters here are in the 40s and above and many have either been cheated on or their partners have lost romantic/sexual interest in them and haven’t had an active and satisfying sex life in a long time.

A number of people here have had partners that have either met someone else and packed up and left or have simply lost attraction to them and checked out.

One of a middle aged woman’s fears is her partner losing interest in her due to weight gain and stretch marks etc and discarding for a younger woman without looking back.

So when you opening describe how you have lost desire for your wife due to some extra pounds and talk of yearning for slimmer women, it hits a very raw and primal nerve.

Another disturbing feature is many middle age men do remain or even become more attractive to women as they age (up to a certain point) and there are many walk-away-husbands in the world that simply trade in their middle age wives for newer models.

Additionally many of the men are here because their wives have simply lost desire for them and couldn’t care less if they ever have sex with them again and the men have basically been emotionally and sexually discarded by their wives.

Many of the men here would crawl naked through broken glass and rusty thumbtacks for a woman that still had some semblance of a sex drive and some attraction and desire for them...... and they wouldn’t care less if that woman had some extra pounds or stretch marks or a belly that just won’t go away despite proper diet and exercise.

So even the men here can see themselves in your wife’s position of being the one who is no longer desired and just being kept around for the “other” services that they provide, as well as seeing you as not appreciating something that they want so badly.

In essence, the people here on this site are here due to being in your wife’s position and they are identifying more with your wife rather than being empathetic and supportive of your perspective.
Your comments may apply to some, I dont know, but my own responses come from a position of being in a very happy marriage. I just commented on the sadness of what I read and how arrogant he came accross. So please dont assume that most or even a majority come from people who have been rejected due to their age and weight etc.
Also its just not the case that older men can fall into a relationship with a women his daughters age. Yes it happens occasionally, usually if they are rich and earn good money and have lovely homes, cars etc.Thats usually what attracts a much young woman. I doubt they would give a man their fathers age a second look if he didnt have much or earn much.

Its hard to be empathetic towards a man who has such a lovely wife, yet complains that she doesnt look as she did 25 years ago. None of us do, including him, thats life.
 

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Maybe because you are forcing your wife to live a lie. At some point in the next few years, you will most likely start to have issues with your 'equipment' working. Even if you considered your wife to be drop-dead gorgeous, you would still encounter problems. Since you are basically turned off by your wife, your problems will be exacerbated. Maybe you'll be pleased to no longer have to fulfill your duty. Where will that leave your wife?

How about you have a gentle conversation with her and explain that you are finding her less attractive and let her decide if she wants to work on it. For the benefit of both of you. Call it a preventive measure.
The thing is, she is working our regularly.
 

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You sound like you pretty much have it made besides your malfunction in your mind.

I have a couple posts about when Mrs. Conan gained weight. I don't feel like telling the tale again so you can hunt it down if you like.

I don't have to imagine what I would do in your shoes because I did it.

Mrs. Conan couldn't walk straight for nearly two years among other things.

BTW, I'm 49 and I really can draw the attention of younger women. I have a lot of weird stories about women behaving forward with me.

I have also not once considered them. My wife is mine and I pour my romantic love and physical passion into her alone.

That is the promise I made and the vow I took with her.

I choose to love her this way and my mind leads my heart, not vice versa.

Hope the best for you and your wife.

She sounds lovely honestly.
 

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Only only in this thing, this one thing that only to ME is a problem, one that I will never let her know, I suffer. (Suffer might be a too strong word, I lack a lesser one.)
Yes, it's your problem, but what I don't understand is how do you want to solve this problem?

You don't want to divorce or break your wife's heart.

I don't understand why you posted here? To gain support?

I think your problem started at the beginning of your marriage by marrying someone who was not your ideal. That was a big mistake. Did you think her body wasn't going to change?

Has she expressed her desire to change her body? I mean having plastic surgery. I'm someone who's terrified of anesthesia, but I'm honest and I'd like to change a few things about my body and I've been researching lately. I'm not sure if that's a possibility, but maybe it could be an option that's going to benefit both of you. You can ask her if she's interested and go from there.

It's sad for both of you. If I were you I'd try to look into options about losing weight and reshaping the skin. How does she feel about her body? I don't like the idea of giving up and suffering where there could be something you both can do about it.

What do you want to do? What do you think she can do about it?
 
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