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It's nice to know that one person w/ a can of spray paint can silence 100,000 people who want to express a legitimate grievance.
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem, right? If they cannot police their own, they are complicit, right?
 

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It's not just a can of spray paint, it's destroying and burning homes and businesses - most of which were owned by minorities, jumping on people's cars that are merely trying to get home and go to work, setting up autonomous zones in neighborhoods where people live and work and no one doing anything about it. I saw one video of a BLM dude pull a girl off her bike by her backpack and then a gang swarmed on her. An elderly man stopped his car to help her - all he had was a golf club, the gang then turned on him and were kicking him in the stomach, back and head. It just makes me sick that these anarchists are portrayed as peaceful protesters. The news media and politicians portray those people as peaceful. The people that are peacefully protesting do not support nor want the anarchists in their groups. But the anarchists are the ones that get the news coverage and that merely turns people off of the message from the peaceful people trying to bring about change.
 

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Lol, karole, nothing to see here, right? Just a can of spray paint, just a tiny handful of fringe element who have nothing to do with the protests. Funny how it gets dismissed and deflected, and for some reason nobody wants to discuss in the mainstream public square what you said, how it is minority and poor neighborhoods being destroyed. Homes and businesses being destroyed. Innocent people being grievously injured or killed, many of them minorities themselves.

One of my adult children was on the receiving end of a mob of vandals, luckily without personal attack. There were a number of innocent people in the building that was broken into and vandalized. Almost certainly my child's significant Covid infection was due to the mob running around inside. I do see signs of PTSD/anxiety from the event, too.

But, nothing to see here, we're all just racists who deserve it.
 

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On thing that I find interesting in this, is that no one is defending the looters, rioters, or statue topplers. No one in here is saying that is good, right, or should be done. Everyone in here has said it is bad, and it should be dealt with by law enforcement. Yet, somehow saying the protesters have a point means we are saying we encourage them to destroy stuff. I just do not get it.

How does any of this get addressed without the protests? What is it you want them to do? Keep in mind that civil discussion has been going on for 100 years, and yet, here we still are. It was not long ago that MLK was shot, did he protest too much? Was he not quiet enough? He was hated by the people in power in his time, don't pretend for a second his voice was met with anything but hatred.

Talking has not been very fruitful, except for those that still have the power and wealth.
 

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Civil discussion? Like about how there actually is no demonstrable systemic racism wrt people killed in interactions with the police? Like how a black man is less likely to be killed by police than a white man? Or how a white cop is less likely to kill a black man than a black cop is?

Or how about reforming public education in the inner cities by allowing school choice with vouchers?

Or what about most boys who are in poverty are growing up without a male figurehead in the family? Or how that child will likely emulate the alpha males he observes in his neighborhood, which means if there is a destructive culture he is much more likely to grow up to be a criminal?

Or about how slavery ended over 150 years ago, so neither you nor I nor anybody alive in the USA owned a slave or was a slave?

Perhaps we could civilly discuss the effects of paternalistic progressivism and the message it teaches minorities from birth that they are not capable without white man's assistance, and any failure he encounters is due to racism?

Maybe we could try civil discussions with successful black people. I promise not to call them traitors to their race or Uncle Toms. Will their own race be as civil as that?

You mean like those sorts of civil discussions? Tried that, been shamed many times as a racist, elitist, someone who only got where I am by standing on the backs of the poor, who's success is due primarily to my white privilege.
 

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On thing that I find interesting in this, is that no one is defending the looters, rioters, or statue topplers. No one in here is saying that is good, right, or should be done. Everyone in here has said it is bad, and it should be dealt with by law enforcement. Yet, somehow saying the protesters have a point means we are saying we encourage them to destroy stuff. I just do not get it.

How does any of this get addressed without the protests? What is it you want them to do? Keep in mind that civil discussion has been going on for 100 years, and yet, here we still are. It was not long ago that MLK was shot, did he protest too much? Was he not quiet enough? He was hated by the people in power in his time, don't pretend for a second his voice was met with anything but hatred.

Talking has not been very fruitful, except for those that still have the power and wealth.
I'm sure this will ruffle some feathers, but I think one thing that could be done is the people in inner cities should quit electing Democrats. In all seriousness, what have they done to help minority communities? Look at Chicago - it has been run by Democrats for years - and the violence gets worse - not better, year after year. The people that live there feel hopeless. Have you ever watched interviews with the residents of inner Chicago? It is heartbreaking. They have a black mayor - what has she done/doing to help the community? Is she creating jobs? Improving living arrangements? Helping schools? Increasing police protection? Anything? Hundreds are shot in cold blood every weekend. It seems the "officials" do absolutely nothing to help the disadvantaged.
 

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I'm sure this will ruffle some feathers, but I think one thing that could be done is the people in inner cities should quit electing Democrats. In all seriousness, what have they done to help minority communities? Look at Chicago - it has been run by Democrats for years - and the violence gets worse - not better, year after year. The people that live there feel hopeless. Have you ever watched interviews with the residents of inner Chicago? It is heartbreaking. They have a black mayor - what has she done/doing to help the community? Is she creating jobs? Improving living arrangements? Helping schools? Increasing police protection? Anything? Hundreds are shot in cold blood every weekend. It seems the "officials" do absolutely nothing to help the disadvantaged.
Wow ... you've managed to turn me into a republican! 😉
 

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Civil discussion? Like about how there actually is no demonstrable systemic racism wrt people killed in interactions with the police? Like how a black man is less likely to be killed by police than a white man? Or how a white cop is less likely to kill a black man than a black cop is?
No, you haven't. I have posted numerous resources about violent encounters with police, ratios, and how it is not more likely for a white man to be killed, or harmed. Crickets.

Or how about reforming public education in the inner cities by allowing school choice with vouchers?
How does the person get to the classroom? There are numerous hurdles for kids to get to private school, such as after school programs, transportation, additional costs to kids in private schools.

Or what about most boys who are in poverty are growing up without a male figurehead in the family? Or how that child will likely emulate the alpha males he observes in his neighborhood, which means if there is a destructive culture he is much more likely to grow up to be a criminal?
What is your plan to fix that?

Or about how slavery ended over 150 years ago, so neither you nor I nor anybody alive in the USA owned a slave or was a slave?
Yes, and segregation ended in the 60's, there are still numerous things, that I have provided sources for about unequal law enforcement, unequal access to loans, unequal access to housing. And all I hear back is, meh, slavery was like long ago.

Perhaps we could civilly discuss the effects of paternalistic progressivism and the message it teaches minorities from birth that they are not capable without white man's assistance, and any failure he encounters is due to racism?
Sure, show me where that is in the curriculum.

Maybe we could try civil discussions with successful black people. I promise not to call them traitors to their race or Uncle Toms. Will their own race be as civil as that?

You mean like those sorts of civil discussions? Tried that, been shamed many times as a racist, elitist, someone who only got where I am by standing on the backs of the poor, who's success is due primarily to my white privilege.
So, it is the blacks fault that they cannot have a civil discussion with you? After your 6 topic rant about how everything they want to talk is about is wrong, I am shocked they did not respond better.
 

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Also, here is an interesting tidbit from a Milwaukee study on their voucher program: https://files.eric.ed.gov/fulltext/ED566679.pdf

WKCE test scores for voucher students continue to lag those of MPS students. This is especially true for voucher students who attend predominantly-voucher schools.

Overall, schools with high concentrations of voucher students experience lower WKCE test scores.

(MPS is the public school system, and WKCE is their state testing)
 

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No, you haven't. I have posted numerous resources about violent encounters with police, ratios, and how it is not more likely for a white man to be killed, or harmed. Crickets.
No, that is false. Based on number of contacts with police and other relevant data, whites are more likely to be killed by police. I assume you are looking at raw % of the population or something similar. In addition, almost every death involving police is the result of a criminal who gets into some kind of altercation with the police. A police officer is 18 times more likely to be killed by a black perp than the reverse.


How does the person get to the classroom? There are numerous hurdles for kids to get to private school, such as after school programs, transportation, additional costs to kids in private schools.
It starts with the Democrats not blocking school choice. The dems, the ever more Woke and Progressive amongst us who supposedly are the only force which can save blacks from evil, block any attempt at school choice or school vouchers. So let's get to that first, and then watch the private sector use the power of competition to bring great education to the poor areas. Many such places spend more per pupil than the top tier private prep schools, so I think there is some hope private schools could apply voucher money to bring better education to impoverished neighborhoods.

What is your plan to fix that?
As Karole above said, vote out the Rats. The cities with the biggest problems have been run by Democrats for decade after decade after decade. Either we believe just a few more of YOUR dollars will fix everything, or we believe the experiment of The Great Society has been a complete failure. We've given paternal progressivism nearly 60 years, so I say throw them out.

Yes, and segregation ended in the 60's, there are still numerous things, that I have provided sources for about unequal law enforcement, unequal access to loans, unequal access to housing. And all I hear back is, meh, slavery was like long ago.
Yet there are still calls for Reparations...

Sure, show me where that is in the curriculum.
Lol dude. You must live in a cave.

So, it is the blacks fault that they cannot have a civil discussion with you? After your 6 topic rant about how everything they want to talk is about is wrong, I am shocked they did not respond better.
No, it is the fault of many people that there can be no civil discussion with a black person who happens to be conservative and successful. It is the fault of black community leaders, of liberal politicians of every race, of popular black celebrities, of race baiters and race agitators.

It isn't my fault I've been accused on this very forum of being racist, being blinded by my white privilege, etc when I try to have a discussion.
 

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No, that is false. Based on number of contacts with police and other relevant data, whites are more likely to be killed by police. I assume you are looking at raw % of the population or something similar. In addition, almost every death involving police is the result of a criminal who gets into some kind of altercation with the police. A police officer is 18 times more likely to be killed by a black perp than the reverse.
Again, you say that, but I disagree, I have posted stats that disagree, and here is a study that also disagrees: Risk of being killed by police use of force in the United States by age, race–ethnicity, and sex




It starts with the Democrats not blocking school choice. The dems, the ever more Woke and Progressive amongst us who supposedly are the only force which can save blacks from evil, block any attempt at school choice or school vouchers. So let's get to that first, and then watch the private sector use the power of competition to bring great education to the poor areas. Many such places spend more per pupil than the top tier private prep schools, so I think there is some hope private schools could apply voucher money to bring better education to impoverished neighborhoods.
I already provided at least one source that shows that school choice is not a panacea for the poor or inner city. Again, how do republicans get those kids to school? Are republicans putting in bus programs for private schools?


As Karole above said, vote out the Rats. The cities with the biggest problems have been run by Democrats for decade after decade after decade. Either we believe just a few more of YOUR dollars will fix everything, or we believe the experiment of The Great Society has been a complete failure. We've given paternal progressivism nearly 60 years, so I say throw them out.
So, democrats cause single fathers and republicans save families.......


No, it is the fault of many people that there can be no civil discussion with a black person who happens to be conservative and successful. It is the fault of black community leaders, of liberal politicians of every race, of popular black celebrities, of race baiters and race agitators.

It isn't my fault I've been accused on this very forum of being racist, being blinded by my white privilege, etc when I try to have a discussion.
There are many civil discussions that happen every day.
 

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Also, here is a fun fact, Jacksonville FL, and it's republican mayor, has the highest murder rate in the state. Maybe they need some democrats. Or maybe things are more complex than donkeys and elephants.
 

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Once again, this thread is about the riots, not about those peacefully standing with signs or engaged in scholarly discussions.

I pointed out that the rioters conveniently only attack monuments they believe are to the "wrong" side. Which tells me this is mostly not about facts or honest discussion, it is about angry lashing out at political or racial targets. It is about stirring up hatred, but only against certain factions.

Now if there were protests about Senator Byrd it would be a totally different thing, wouldn't it? It would be about actual racist people who did actual racist things.
Because enslaving people based upon their race isn't racist. Got it.
Not at all the same thing as stampeding private property when they assume or believe the occupants to be white or on the "wrong" side. An by "wrong side" I do specifically mean conservative, traditional, Constitutionalist, or Republican.

Again, I am not "tarring all protestors", I am pointing out the mindlessness, idiocy, and hypocrisy of those involved in the non-peaceful protests, aka "riots" as related to the topic of this thread. If you want to discuss topics related to peaceful protests we have done that on other threads, where my White Privilege was pointed out as blinding me to Systemic Racism and Micro-agressions which have permanently disabled black people from advancing out of poverty.
Why are you crying to me here instead of wherever this happened? What am I supposed to do for you now?
Those who are violent do not want to have a peaceful discussion. The leadership certainly intends to take down America to be rebuilt into Marxist state.
Strawman
If you don't know this you haven't been paying attention.
I haven't seen this statement from BLM and your word doesn't carry any weight.
The hoodlums on the streets looting stores may or may not share this goal. They may largely be "useful idiots".

My preferred grievance? Oh come on man! I am pointing out THEIR GRIEVANCE which conveniently skips over Democrats. I personally don't give a flying **** if Senator Byrd has a statue. I am merely responding to YOUR request for examples of monuments which have been left alone due to the leftist affiliation of the person memorialized.
If no one has any grievance against said Democrats, why shouldn't they be skipped over?
 

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Here is another interesting thing on police interactions: The statistical paradox of police killings - The Boston Globe

It is talking about this as well: Study that claims white police no more likely to shoot minorities draws fire

Here is another thing that is intersting: Arrests by offense, age, and race

So, white adults are arrested 2.6 times more often than black adults, yet the statistics do not bear out an equal treatment of them by police, by the justice system, or the penal system. There are multiple studies done on the unequal treatment of blacks in our court system.

Then you also have things like the Breona Taylor shooting. Have you looked into that story? How is it that a woman is dead, shot by police, and the police report doesn't even mention shots, and listed her injuries as 'none'. How many other reports lack details important as killing someone? They also said they did not force entry, despite breaking down the door. At least two of the officers have other body camera footage from other events, but none from that night.

Does that even count as a 'contact with police'?

Or Elijah McClain, what does his stat go under? He was walking home with an iced tea and was killed by police. He was unarmed, non-combative, now dead. Since we are talking about riots, it was sure nice of the Aurora PD to show up and pepper spray the people at the violin vigil for him. It looked like it was about to get out of hand......There are also reports of officers mocking the choke hold that eventually led to Elijah's death while at the vigil.
 
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