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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My husband has cheated on me … again. I don’t know what to do. Even if I did, I don’t know whether I have the energy to do it. I love him very much. He says that he loves me very much. He wants our marriage to survive this; and is willing to do whatever he can to save it.

The first OW was someone he met online – the relationship started before we were married and then morphed into an EA that he carried on via email for the first year of our marriage until I fell pregnant with our first child. He had told me about a very passionate kiss before we got married (we took a break to rethink things before recommitting ourselves to the relationship), but I only found out the full story later by chance. There were actually secret meetings and phone calls, a ONS (stopping just short of sex) and, even after our marriage, a very emotional and romantic email exchange. When I found out by accident, I was devastated. I told him that I wanted a divorce, he (as non-confrontational as he is) fought back with how sorry he was and how he wasn’t going to let me throw away our relationship and family on something so stupid that he’d done. We went to MC and he went to IC. It was painful, but we grew up and grew together, had another son, and the affair became something of a badge that we had collected as a couple. Our experience together had made us stronger, more real and honest with each other. I can honestly say that I trusted him completely again.

More than ten years later (after I was treated for a major depression that went on for almost two years) I found out that that, for a few months earlier this year, he had another affair. This time, the OW was someone known to me (son’s school friend’s mother). My WH says that he has never had sex with another woman since he met me. He admits to a lot of kissing and hugging, secret meetings, flirtatious texting with this second OW. I found out about the affair when the OWH contacted me on a family holiday. (It had already ended by then – mostly due to OWH’s suspicions.) The OW had apparently come clean and finally confirmed the EA and that there had been “kissing”. My WH first tried to minimise things - a few weeks later he was finally more honest about the extent of what had gone on. He says now that he doesn’t have any real feelings for her at all, that he is deeply ashamed, that he felt “out of control” and “in a fog”. He says that he deeply regrets what he did.

In my calmer moments, I believe him. Sometimes I don’t. Mostly I try not to think about it at all. This second time is much worse. All the forgotten and forgiven hurt from the first betrayal has risen to the surface again. I am sad a lot, then I am angry and bitter a bit. Then I try to function normally - as normally as I can. My husband sits and holds my hands and says that he is so sorry, that he would do anything to save our marriage. He cries about how much he has hurt me, , then he holds me while I cry about how much he has hurt me, and he worries about the impact of his behaviour on our kids. I think he is genuinely remorseful (but then I think – what do I know?). I know that my depression wasn’t easy for him and that he did so much to keep our family functioning and healthy when I was getting well. I don’t know if I can trust him, don’t know if I should trust him. Am I stupid for even thinking of trying? He is a good dad and a good man. I want so badly to believe in him again.

Anyone got any wisdom for me?
 

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Grown, mature, experienced, dry-behind-the-ears, ADULTS do not stop at kissing and petting.

They had full body-on sex. Both of his affairs, they did this.

This is cheater script lies. They try to minimize the "outed" damage. Make it a forgivable offense.

NOT to spare you the details and pain, but to get him off the hook.

Your husbands boundaries were weak before you met him, after you married him.......and are still loose, still weak.

Pack his knap sack with peanut butter and jelly sandwiches, toss in a porcupine, a rat and a skunk. Hand it to him and tell him to have a nice life in a place that is not HOME.
 

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There are men that view sex as the most intense bonding experience there can be with their spouse. Your husband is not one of these. He is the other type of man that thinks of sex as a great feeling for them self, but don't really care WHO gives them that feeling.

There are women that look at it the same way. If he took the time to "kiss", they did everything they possibly could together.

There are good men out there, hopefully you can find one.

Sorry you are here.
 

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My husband sits and holds my hands and says that he is so sorry, that he would do anything to save our marriage.

Anyone got any wisdom for me?
Yes. Give him this list. Tell him once he completes it, you will consider giving him a third chance:
He must go to his parents with you and tell them what he's done and apologize.
He must go to your parents with you and tell them what he's done and apologize for hurting you.
He must contact OW's husband and apologize.
He must go back to IC and allow you to come to one session every month or two to get his IC's opinion on what's going on.
He must find a polygraph company and set up an appointment, for which you will set up the questions.
He must go to a lawyer and set up a postnup agreement so that if he cheats again he walks away with nothing.

If he's willing to do those things, you might have a chance.

And fwiw, when a cheater admits to kissing, they had at least made out. When a cheater admits to making out, they really had sex. When they admit to having sex once, they did it multiple times. This is true nearly every single time. So please don't do any of this without him taking a polygraph.
 

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He's a serial, which means that it's time to pull the plug and move on. He's already shown you that he's not going to stop cheating -- from here on out, he's just going to get better at hiding it.

Also consider this -- for every affair that you DO know about, there are probably one or two that you've not yet discovered.

Oh and they're also lying -- adults don't meet up "just to kiss". They f*cked. Think about it... why put your marriage and family at risk unless you're going to go all the way?

I'll say it again:

THEY.

ARE.

LYING.

THEY.

F#CKED.

Dump the chump!

Posted via Mobile Device
 

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I like your Avatar..

I think I was a Tom Cat in another life!

Before that, a Saber Tooth Tiger.
 

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Your post made me cry, and I'm not much of a cryer. My heart breaks for you.

I Agree to him following the steps listed above that include the poly. If he's serious, he will comply and there may be something here to salvage. TAKE. YOUR. TIME.


I'm so sorry you are here, it sounds like we've got two ultimately very nice, but very imperfect people really struggling with problems that seem impossible to solve. I hope you all get lots of help and that a FUTURE reconcile might happen. TAKE. YOUR. TIME.
 

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Your husband is full of BS, he's telling you only what he thinks you need to hear and saying it in a way that you fall for it hook line and sinker.

People who love one another don't do things that will cause devastation to the other person, it's really that simple.

You need to figure out why you are so reluctant to leave this horrible man who will hurt you without any regard for your feelings because he's only interested in satisfying his own selfish urges.

Remember, he only stopped- if he even did- because you caught him. If you didn't he wouldn't have stopped either one of those other times and there's a good chance there's even more women he was with that you don't even know about because if you didn't catch him, he had no reason to admit it to you.
 

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Yes. Give him this list. Tell him once he completes it, you will consider giving him a third chance:
He must go to his parents with you and tell them what he's done and apologize.
He must go to your parents with you and tell them what he's done and apologize for hurting you.
He must contact OW's husband and apologize.
He must go back to IC and allow you to come to one session every month or two to get his IC's opinion on what's going on.
He must find a polygraph company and set up an appointment, for which you will set up the questions.
He must go to a lawyer and set up a postnup agreement so that if he cheats again he walks away with nothing.

If he's willing to do those things, you might have a chance.

And fwiw, when a cheater admits to kissing, they had at least made out. When a cheater admits to making out, they really had sex. When they admit to having sex once, they did it multiple times. This is true nearly every single time. So please don't do any of this without him taking a polygraph.
THIS! He got away with it to all intents and purposes and thinks not that you have a family, he will again. You do not have to make any decisions with regard to this WH. See how far he is actually able to go to save the marriage, but give him no free passes. If he is not willing to do all the things listed above, then you know your answer. You do not want to wake up in another 10-15 years with a man you despise, believe me this could happen when it is just you and him and no kids.
 

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turnera's list is a very good starting point. I want to say 'just dump him', but I know it's hard, especially with the depression. You may think, if only I wasn't depressed maybe this wouldn't have happened... but never forget, it's NOT your fault!

And I think he's majorly lying. They totally fvcked. Get together with the OWH and see if your stories line up!
 

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A prostitute will f... but they don't [normally] kiss - to intimate.

No saying he went all the way but he was definitely being intimate outside the marriage, and it wasn't him who came clean.
Your call if he's the person you still want in your life, or are things in a state where you could enjoy freedom from worrying about a wandering partner?
 

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When he said this " how he wasn’t going to let me throw away our relationship" is a piece of work. He is throwing it away, then and now.

"secret meetings" = sex. If nobody is around, what keeps them from doing it? You know sex can be quick... we've all had our quickies.
 
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I wouldn't be in a rush to jettison this marriage, especially with children. I wonder if your depression was any kind of contributing factor (not blaming you, of course). You both need to agree wholeheartedly on radical honesty between each other. Needs aren't being met, communication sucks, he's a liar. Without 100% honesty on everything past and present, marriage cannot recover and grow. 99% won't cut it. If it were me, I'd polygraph his a$$ since he has proven himself to be a liar. He is likely giving you the G-rated version to avoid hurting you further and to increase his odds of reconciliation. If you don't know the whole truth, how can you recover, forgive, and love him?
 

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I wouldn't be in a rush to jettison this marriage, especially with children. I wonder if your depression was any kind of contributing factor (not blaming you, of course).
You're not blaming her, only suggesting that she once again forgive his serial cheating and constant lying and trickle truths because, well she was depressed so don't blame the poor guy for getting his own needs met because he's gotta deal with a depressed wife all day. Nice.
 

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Miz,

Let me give you a heads up on Serial Cheaters... He never really stopped cheating on you after that 1st time before your marriage. Oh they will take a pause for 6 months maybe a year but they are always looking for that next time. The more realistic truth is... it just took 10 more years for him to get caught again.

Oh BTW, there was sex. My own WW finally admitted to me that after months of kissing and groping with her AP she decided to have sex. "The consequences didn't change." Understand?
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I want to thank you all for your words - those that were kinder and gentler and those that were harsher and more uncompromising.

After I had read some of them, I started shivering so much that I had to curl up in a little ball on this rainbow shaggy carpet that we have in the study. The reality is that I have already thought everything that your words suggest. I've had the pictures in my mind to prove it. But do I still want to believe in him? Absolutely.

This morning I woke up certain of some things:

Because I love my boys, I'm not going to make any decisions now. At heart, I'm a fairly analytical person - and when all the emotional seesawing is done, I need to make the best decision I can for me and mine. If I do decide to stay married, I won't agree to go on with our marriage as it is.

Yes. Give him this list. Tell him once he completes it, you will consider giving him a third chance:
He must go to his parents with you and tell them what he's done and apologize.
He must go to your parents with you and tell them what he's done and apologize for hurting you.
He must contact OW's husband and apologize.
He must go back to IC and allow you to come to one session every month or two to get his IC's opinion on what's going on.
He must find a polygraph company and set up an appointment, for which you will set up the questions.
He must go to a lawyer and set up a postnup agreement so that if he cheats again he walks away with nothing.
If he's willing to do those things, you might have a chance.
Thank you turnera for your list (I'm big into lists). He'd already agreed to take a polygraph (although thus far our local service providers seem reluctant to take on domestic interviews) and we discussed the idea of a postnuptial agreement in some detail this morning. He will choose an IC. I'm also going to start IC this week (my WH's idea) - I need a face to speak things to. I did realise that unless I shadow him 24 hours day for the rest of our married life, I will need to trust him at some point. So we're going to need a practical plan to make that happen.

Re: the sex part. We had a long nose-to-nose discussion this morning (like a heart-to-heart, but with tissues). And I found out something very interesting. He saw sex with another woman as the final step that he wouldn't be able to come back from. I think that for him everything up until then was very wrong, but somehow not quite unforgivable. I know men and women are supposed to respond differently to EA's and PA's but I think that my response to him on this was pretty unequivocal. I don't actually care much whether he had sex with them or not. I care that he lived a lie with me. That he gave another woman the truth of who he is for the time that he lied to me and even after that. That is what has done the damage and made me doubt whether I can stay married to him. And I care that he tells the truth to me now in all its ugliness.

And I also realised one final thing. That if I do give him this chance and he lets me down again; then I refuse to feel ashamed. It would be very easy to walk away so that he can never hurt me again. I am not weak if I choose to believe the best about someone.
 
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