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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So I posted a while back at the beginning of all this when I was still trying to save the marriage and you all were a lot of help, looking for help again now that this has moved into a full blown divorce.

I'm going to try and keep it as short and easy to read as possible.

Here is my first post if you care to read:

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/considering-divorce-separation/393113-wife-falling-out-love.html

Long story short, she came to me out of the blue and said she had fallen out of love and can't go back, come to find out she was having an affair and as far as I know she is still with this guy. I still tried to forgive and repair the marriage with counseling but she refused to cooperate and try and fix the marriage. I tried and tried for about a month and couldn't take being rejected continuously so I moved on.

We have 2 boys together who are now 2yrs and 4yrs.

If you were to get her side of the story she would say that throughout our marriage I have been emotionally unavailable and she just doesn't have the same feelings for me and can't get them back, loves me as the father of her children but not as a husband. She claims she never cheated on me she just kissed the guy (i'm sure is BS I know she slept with him). I haven't been a perfect husband but I was willing to work on my issues but she refused to accept that. My issues certainly shouldn’t be detrimental to our marriage by anyone’s standard.

Anyways the divorce is filed and we both have our attorneys, sounds there is no going back on the marriage. She is with this guy and pushed me away enough that I moved on and started seeing someone else.

We still have a $230k house together which is on the market; she never sleeps there but the boys sleep there with me 5-6 nights a week and they stay with her at her mom’s 1-2 days a week. She stays at the house with the boys while I'm at work and usually leave when they go to bed.

She works at a hospital making about $30k a year I'm a cop who makes about $55k-$60k a year. Her income is a little lower that it could be because she only works 36 hours a week but is considered full time. She has two bachelor’s degrees and could find a better paying job but choses not to. The guy she is seeing works there and she has co-workers that have encouraged divorce rather than working on the marrage. Kids are on her insurance at about $200 a month.

Childcare is free through her mom, if I were to get custodial parent her mom has suggested that she won’t watch them for me when I work but if her daughter has custodial parent then she will continue to watch them. I already know I don't have a chance of getting custodial parent because of my hours and I don’t have any family here to watch the boys for me while I work like she does. I typically work nights and I don't have family in the area that can watch the boys while I work those hours. My family is in MI and we live in MO.

We live in a no-fault state.

Here is my issues of what she wants in the decree:

Child support is $980 a month if I have the boys for 4 overnights a month. Equivalent to every other weekend.. I wanted 4 overnights because of my work hours and most of my time with the boys would be in the mornings, day time or evenings because of my hours. It is very difficult for me to do more than that especially when I will have to work a lot overtime to survive while paying such an absurd amount of child support. This is the amount the state says I would pay based on our incomes and me having 4 overnights. If I jump it up to 6 overnights it’s about $800 and 8 over nights its about $700 a month. All are way more than what our kids cost per month especially when we don't pay for child care if we were to split their monthly expenses 50/50.

She wants to claim both kids on her taxes for the rest of their childhood; I think that's bull**** if I'm paying for child support.

She has it in there that we have to get written permission to use any sitter for the boys outside of her mom, keep in mind I have no family in this area.

Kid's future expenses such as medical expenses will be split 70/30 since I make 70% of the house hold income and she makes 30%. She has verbally agreed to 50/50 but I have yet to see it in writing.

She refuses to do mediation, agreed to a settlement conference and only willing to negotiate things with her pit bull of a lawyer present and my lawyer present.


The divorce was filed in September by her. We had a joint account our whole marriage but I had to split the accounts because she was pulling out so much cash we couldn't pay the bills. Then when we split the accounts she has almost completely ditched me on the $3800 in bills we have together per month. All she has payed is the kids' health insurance that comes out of her check, one of her car payments and our oldest’s preschool. All I wanted her to pay is about $1000 a month of our bills since that is about 30% after health insurance is paid. All bills are in my name so my credit gets screwed if they don't get paid. I had to pull from my retirement savings to keep up on them.

We haven't even begun to discuss splitting other things like property.

If she gets what she wants I feel like I'm completely getting completely screwed financially. I have talked to my lawyer about all this and am told there's not a lot that can be done about child support without adding more overnights, my time that I would spend with them every morning/evening doesn't count toward anything. We can try to fight splitting the kids on our taxes but judges usually favor putting them both on the custodial parent. Lawyer says the judge will likely commit to splitting expenses 70/30. Judges will not care about what cause the divorce since it's a no-fault state. The only thing I have going for me is that my lawyer thinks a judge might get mediation court ordered. The problem with that is that even if that happens my ex doesn't really have to commit to anything she agrees too or can go into mediation refusing to agree on anything. My lawyer is willing to fight anything I ask her to but says she is afraid some of it would only cost me money to get no results because she is familiar with how judges tend to rule on things. My lawyer has very good reviews online.

If she gets what she wants I will be broke all the time and working a lot of extra hours. I might be financially better off if I live in some dumpy trailer park/dirt cheap house or something but I'm really not trying to have my boys in that environment. At the beginning of all this she verbally agreed to $500 a month in child support and everything else 50/50. I was good with this. She got talking to her lawyer and saw how much she could get me for and that has all changed.

Thank you to anyone who takes the time to read this and help a stranger. You all are awesome.
 

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As I am sure you are already aware, those are legal and financial issues that will need to be worked out with the assistance of your attorneys and the court etc. Strangers on the internet can not give legitimate legal advice.

All I can say is that it is in both of your interests that your children are adequately housed, clothed, fed and provided for.

That cannot occur if you are living in the hood, dodging bullets and trying to keep the roaches and rodents out of the Ramen Noodles that you are living on.

It's ok to fall out of love and divorce, but there is nothing to be gained for either one of you to take it up the rear end dry financially.

The court may not care why the divorce is occurring and it has no interest judging who is more right or wrong. The court however is obligated to provide for a fair and reasonable division of marital assets and the continuing care of minor children.

It is in all of your best interests to come to as much mutually agreed upon points as possible.

All I can offer is to keep trying to take as much emotion and blame and finger pointing out of it as possible and keep trying to get her to negotiate as much as possible for the benefit of the kids and that is fair for each other.
 

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One little tidbit of info that I will offer you is some insight into the mind of the OM.

Right now your STBX is full of feel-good hormones and is likely thinking she has found her Twu Luv and that they are going to ride off into the sunset together and live blissfully ever after.

A part of that fantasy is that she can shake you down for ever penny you can come up with to give her so she and her studmuffin can live happily ever after on the beach at your expense. ......yeah that's a nice fantasy that she may currently be striving for.

But here is the real scoop on men that bone married women. The vast majority of OM are in it for the cheap and easy poon that really doesn't cost them anything.

I was a serial AP in my mid-upper 20s (I'm 53 now) and married women are the ultimate F-buddy. All they want from you is compliments and hot, steamy sex and once you've dumped your load they go home and it is the BH that has to rub their feet and change their flat tires and deal with their screaming kids and kill the spiders in the house. All the OM has to do is look good, smell nice and give them orgasms. It's a horny man's dreamworld.

That all changes immediately once she dumps the BH though. Once she's on her own, then she expects the OM to rub her feet and he is the one that gets the phone call to come change the flat in the pouring rain and he will be the one that has to deal with her laying around the house when she is sick or has menstrual cramps.

The real deal breaker will come when he has to put up with your kids for a full weekend and she won't 'F' him on the kitchen counter because the kids might hear.

That's usually when the OM drops her like a hot potato.

Once he exits stage left, that is when the bubble breaks, the affair fog lifts and her dreams of bleeding you dry to pay for her beach fantasy dissolves like a fart in the wind.

That's when she comes down to Earth and realizes that it is in the kid's best interest that each of you are able to provide a safe, hygienic environment and that each of you is able to put healthy food on the table and pay for their insurance and doctor bills.

As you are the higher wage earner, you may bear more than 50% of those expenses post divorce. That sucks big donkey d1(k and is a big nasty tasting turd sandwich for you considering that you were not the one that chose this route, but no one said divorce was fun, easy or fair.

This may be the hardest part of this whole thing, but the best thing you can do is take out the emotion and do NOT play the pick me dance.

Embrace the OM and their relationship. Take your kid's over to his house and show him their retainers and how they fit and how they are supposed to wear them at night and tell him how to bribe them and oversee them to make sure they are actually wearing it when they are supposed to.

Them show him how to pre-scrub and bleach the skid marks in your son's underwear because he doesn't always wipe very well.

Then shake his hand and thank him for watching them this weekend because you have a date with a stripper from the strip club you make bar checks at and you don't want them in the house this weekend because of all the noise that is going to be coming from your bedroom.

Expect him to be out of the picture by Tuesday.
 

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Get a sitter from a service or through a friend that can watch the kids while you work. Go for 50/50. Get a lawyer with some balls.
 

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This....
This is the thing that gets my ire.

I have not been Irish since about four incarnations ago.

She cheated, she went ahead and opened her legs, and then drained your life trusting blood.
And then shut down your patience and openly drained your bank account.

A mean one she was, and still is.

Save, moving out of state and leaving your boy's fatherless, you must abide.
Take the beatings...... hard, unfair, continuous, these, those painful beatings.
A pound of flesh for every six months living. I hope you are chubby.

If chubby, you will have enough flesh to see this through.
Until, the boys are eighteen and are no longer financially burdensome.
What have you lost?

Only money..
And that sir, is nothing compared to pride, your self worth.

And make this your' goal.
To win completely, both of your son's favor.

From this day forward.
Make her pay for her sins, by her losing her two son's favor.

Take this from her....
You will take from her taking, the only thing in life worth living for.

Her memory, in they, they are her living proof.

While living and after her body dies and is buried.
She loses, she will have lost, her children's respect.

Ah, Sir, believe me.

SunCMars-
 
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Being mean is easy..
Being properly vengeful, is an art.

Unleash vengeance wisely..
Unleash it sparingly, if ever.

If ever justified, if needed, let it eat, consume it's target.
If not needed, hold it in abeyance.

SunCMars-
not unleashed...chained to his own kind heart.
 
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Dude, fight like hell. Quit your job if you have too. Become a Avon lady making 30 K a year. Do anything to get those kids 50% of the time.

Fight this blackmail as hard as you can. No judge will fault you for making less money a year so you can guarantee 50% custody having a more flexible schedule. She think you will not. Show her otherwise.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
As I am sure you are already aware, those are legal and financial issues that will need to be worked out with the assistance of your attorneys and the court etc. Strangers on the internet can not give legitimate legal advice.

All I can say is that it is in both of your interests that your children are adequately housed, clothed, fed and provided for.

That cannot occur if you are living in the hood, dodging bullets and trying to keep the roaches and rodents out of the Ramen Noodles that you are living on.

It's ok to fall out of love and divorce, but there is nothing to be gained for either one of you to take it up the rear end dry financially.

The court may not care why the divorce is occurring and it has no interest judging who is more right or wrong. The court however is obligated to provide for a fair and reasonable division of marital assets and the continuing care of minor children.

It is in all of your best interests to come to as much mutually agreed upon points as possible.

All I can offer is to keep trying to take as much emotion and blame and finger pointing out of it as possible and keep trying to get her to negotiate as much as possible for the benefit of the kids and that is fair for each other.
Yes I would never go off and do anything advised by strangers on the internet without consulting w/my attorney, I'm simply looking for experiences or ideas. Maybe from people who have been in a similar situation at one point. Maybe something that will give me some hope that this wont play out as bad financially as it looks like it will.

It really doesn't seem like the courts give two ****s about what kind of living conditions the father ends up in. I have seen fathers living out of their cars thanks to child support. So far every man I have talked to who has been through divorce has taken it up the ass financially and every woman I have talked to who has been through a divorce was happy with the outcome. I don't want to pay a lawyer $10,000 more than I have to if I'm going to end up with the same results as paying them $2,000.

Thank you for your response!
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
One little tidbit of info that I will offer you is some insight into the mind of the OM.

Right now your STBX is full of feel-good hormones and is likely thinking she has found her Twu Luv and that they are going to ride off into the sunset together and live blissfully ever after.

A part of that fantasy is that she can shake you down for ever penny you can come up with to give her so she and her studmuffin can live happily ever after on the beach at your expense. ......yeah that's a nice fantasy that she may currently be striving for.

But here is the real scoop on men that bone married women. The vast majority of OM are in it for the cheap and easy poon that really doesn't cost them anything.

I was a serial AP in my mid-upper 20s (I'm 53 now) and married women are the ultimate F-buddy. All they want from you is compliments and hot, steamy sex and once you've dumped your load they go home and it is the BH that has to rub their feet and change their flat tires and deal with their screaming kids and kill the spiders in the house. All the OM has to do is look good, smell nice and give them orgasms. It's a horny man's dreamworld.

That all changes immediately once she dumps the BH though. Once she's on her own, then she expects the OM to rub her feet and he is the one that gets the phone call to come change the flat in the pouring rain and he will be the one that has to deal with her laying around the house when she is sick or has menstrual cramps.

The real deal breaker will come when he has to put up with your kids for a full weekend and she won't 'F' him on the kitchen counter because the kids might hear.

That's usually when the OM drops her like a hot potato.

Once he exits stage left, that is when the bubble breaks, the affair fog lifts and her dreams of bleeding you dry to pay for her beach fantasy dissolves like a fart in the wind.

That's when she comes down to Earth and realizes that it is in the kid's best interest that each of you are able to provide a safe, hygienic environment and that each of you is able to put healthy food on the table and pay for their insurance and doctor bills.

As you are the higher wage earner, you may bear more than 50% of those expenses post divorce. That sucks big donkey d1(k and is a big nasty tasting turd sandwich for you considering that you were not the one that chose this route, but no one said divorce was fun, easy or fair.

This may be the hardest part of this whole thing, but the best thing you can do is take out the emotion and do NOT play the pick me dance.

Embrace the OM and their relationship. Take your kid's over to his house and show him their retainers and how they fit and how they are supposed to wear them at night and tell him how to bribe them and oversee them to make sure they are actually wearing it when they are supposed to.

Them show him how to pre-scrub and bleach the skid marks in your son's underwear because he doesn't always wipe very well.

Then shake his hand and thank him for watching them this weekend because you have a date with a stripper from the strip club you make bar checks at and you don't want them in the house this weekend because of all the noise that is going to be coming from your bedroom.

Expect him to be out of the picture by Tuesday.
This may be true but I know her enough that she would never come back and let it look like she was in the wrong in any way. She never admits when she is in the wrong no matter how stupid she looks. It will be interesting to see what happens if they split, she still keeps her relationship with him very secret from me.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
This....
This is the thing that gets my ire.

I have not been Irish since about four incarnations ago.

She cheated, she went ahead and opened her legs, and then drained your life trusting blood.
And then shut down your patience and openly drained your bank account.

A mean one she was, and still is.

Save, moving out of state and leaving your boy's fatherless, you must abide.
Take the beatings...... hard, unfair, continuous, these, those painful beatings.
A pound of flesh for every six months living. I hope you are chubby.

If chubby, you will have enough flesh to see this through.
Until, the boys are eighteen and are no longer financially burdensome.
What have you lost?

Only money..
And that sir, is nothing compared to pride, your self worth.

And make this your' goal.
To win completely, both of your son's favor.

From this day forward.
Make her pay for her sins, by her losing her two son's favor.

Take this from her....
You will take from her taking, the only thing in life worth living for.

Her memory, in they, they are her living proof.

While living and after her body dies and is buried.
She loses, she will have lost, her children's respect.

Ah, Sir, believe me.

SunCMars-
I do have to say she is a very good mother to the boys and I will never bash her in front of them. BUT they will know one day the facts of why we are no longer together and they can develop their own opinions on it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Get a sitter from a service or through a friend that can watch the kids while you work. Go for 50/50. Get a lawyer with some balls.
I would love to have my kids that much but with my work hours I don't know that I can do 50/50, I definitely cannot without a sitter. Sitters are extremely expensive and the going rate is $15-$20/hr. Day aren't open during my work hours. I can't quit my job because then I will be far worse off financially. I have been highly considering a more aggressive lawyer, I still need to see how aggressive mine is when it comes down to the fight. The lawyer I have has good reviews for divorce but we will see. Nothing has gone to court yet other than a motion to court order mediation.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Being mean is easy..
Being properly vengeful, is an art.

Unleash vengeance wisely..
Unleash it sparingly, if ever.

If ever justified, if needed, let it eat, consume it's target.
If not needed, hold it in abeyance.

SunCMars-
not unleashed...chained to his own kind heart.
That is where I feel my hands are tied...
 

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I do have to say she is a very good mother to the boys and I will never bash her in front of them. BUT they will know one day the facts of why we are no longer together and they can develop their own opinions on it.
Think about the bolded statement above, long and hard.

By cheating on their father, she cheated on them.
Cheated them out of your continuous presence, in their future lives.

Plant the seed now, it will grow and germinate into a stink weed.
One that she will have to curb, trim back, lest it consume her.

If she had just left, gotten the divorce, and then met a man; treated you fair in the divorce.
I would have no quibbles against her.

This was not the good mother, the good wife.
That women never lived at your house.

Just Sayin'

Lilith-
 
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Dude, fight like hell. Quit your job if you have too. Become a Avon lady making 30 K a year. Do anything to get those kids 50% of the time.

Fight this blackmail as hard as you can. No judge will fault you for making less money a year so you can guarantee 50% custody having a more flexible schedule. She think you will not. Show her otherwise.
Oh I'm going to fight, I am hoping I can convince the court to count my time with the boys some other way than overnights. I couldn't quit my job, for one I would be far worse off financially as I have about nothing else I could do with a steady schedule and make anywhere close to the amount of money as I do now. Also that would be a huge win for her to see that I quit the career I love all because of her, I really think she would get off on that.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Think about the bolded statement above, long and hard.

By cheating on their father, she cheated on them.
Cheated them out of your continuous presence, in their future lives.

Plant the seed now, it will grow and germinate into a stink weed.
One that she will have to curb, trim back, lest it consume her.

If she had just left, gotten the divorce, and then met a man; treated you fair in the divorce.
I would have no quibbles against her.

This was not the good mother, the good wife.
That women never lived at your house.

Just Sayin'

Lilith-
You have a good point and I agree she did cheat them. The will always just be caught in the crossfire and she would always argue that she has wanted this 6 months before she found this other man. She is full of **** though because it was only a few months before I found out that she was begging me for a 3rd child. No matter what they will see how unfair she treated me in the divorce, the sick thing to me is that the courts allow her to do it. I have always known the courts were sexist and hard on fathers but I never knew it was this bad.
 

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One little tidbit of info that I will offer you is some insight into the mind of the OM.

Right now your STBX is full of feel-good hormones and is likely thinking she has found her Twu Luv and that they are going to ride off into the sunset together and live blissfully ever after.

A part of that fantasy is that she can shake you down for ever penny you can come up with to give her so she and her studmuffin can live happily ever after on the beach at your expense. ......yeah that's a nice fantasy that she may currently be striving for.

But here is the real scoop on men that bone married women. The vast majority of OM are in it for the cheap and easy poon that really doesn't cost them anything.

I was a serial AP in my mid-upper 20s (I'm 53 now) and married women are the ultimate F-buddy. All they want from you is compliments and hot, steamy sex and once you've dumped your load they go home and it is the BH that has to rub their feet and change their flat tires and deal with their screaming kids and kill the spiders in the house. All the OM has to do is look good, smell nice and give them orgasms. It's a horny man's dreamworld.

That all changes immediately once she dumps the BH though. Once she's on her own, then she expects the OM to rub her feet and he is the one that gets the phone call to come change the flat in the pouring rain and he will be the one that has to deal with her laying around the house when she is sick or has menstrual cramps.

The real deal breaker will come when he has to put up with your kids for a full weekend and she won't 'F' him on the kitchen counter because the kids might hear.

That's usually when the OM drops her like a hot potato.

Once he exits stage left, that is when the bubble breaks, the affair fog lifts and her dreams of bleeding you dry to pay for her beach fantasy dissolves like a fart in the wind.

That's when she comes down to Earth and realizes that it is in the kid's best interest that each of you are able to provide a safe, hygienic environment and that each of you is able to put healthy food on the table and pay for their insurance and doctor bills.

As you are the higher wage earner, you may bear more than 50% of those expenses post divorce. That sucks big donkey d1(k and is a big nasty tasting turd sandwich for you considering that you were not the one that chose this route, but no one said divorce was fun, easy or fair.

This may be the hardest part of this whole thing, but the best thing you can do is take out the emotion and do NOT play the pick me dance.

Embrace the OM and their relationship. Take your kid's over to his house and show him their retainers and how they fit and how they are supposed to wear them at night and tell him how to bribe them and oversee them to make sure they are actually wearing it when they are supposed to.

Them show him how to pre-scrub and bleach the skid marks in your son's underwear because he doesn't always wipe very well.

Then shake his hand and thank him for watching them this weekend because you have a date with a stripper from the strip club you make bar checks at and you don't want them in the house this weekend because of all the noise that is going to be coming from your bedroom.

Expect him to be out of the picture by Tuesday.
Now, read THIS, this above, my TAMster detractors!
You nice fellows and nice gals, running in a straight line in your spinning round cages, running fast around my posts.

This above is hard azz talk.

Compared to THIS, I am the 'Fruit of the Looms' that cover such, this immodesty.

Old Shirt's huff delivers fire.

My typing mouth's outspew delivers laughter, laughable denials.
Come back my lovelies, let me sing you, swing you to slumber.

The Typist-
jealous as per the case, per the post in question.
 
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Old Shirt is a dreamer.
I hope he is co-rectal.

The Martian-
 
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Dude, fight like hell. Quit your job if you have too. Become a Avon lady making 30 K a year. Do anything to get those kids 50% of the time.

Fight this blackmail as hard as you can. No judge will fault you for making less money a year so you can guarantee 50% custody having a more flexible schedule. She think you will not. Show her otherwise.
I wish this were true, but unfortunately it is far from correct. There are plenty of men who have been stripped of everything they had with the assistance of the child-support industrial complex.
 

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You have a good point and I agree she did cheat them. The will always just be caught in the crossfire and she would always argue that she has wanted this 6 months before she found this other man. She is full of **** though because it was only a few months before I found out that she was begging me for a 3rd child. No matter what they will see how unfair she treated me in the divorce, the sick thing to me is that the courts allow her to do it. I have always known the courts were sexist and hard on fathers but I never knew it was this bad.
Here is the definitive work on the unbelievable racket that is the divorce/child support industrial complex: Real World Divorce: Custody, Child Support, and Alimony in the 50 States.
 
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