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Discussion Starter #101
Two specific comments about the credit card. First, get all the back records because it may show she has been cheating. What has she purchased and where? Sexy underwear never seen at home? Hotel rooms? Second, run a credit report on her. The credit bureaus give a free report. You will need her SS #, and you may be asked multiple choice questions like which address or which car loan did she have in the last 5 years. Strictly speaking it may not be legal for you to pull her report, idk. As a spouse maybe? Anyhow, it is what I would do. Other debt or other bank accounts may show up.
Ok I just called our bank. A couple of months they pulled both our credit reports as we were considering buying a new house. So I know they pulled them. Just called the loan officer to see if I can go in and see them. It was the loan officer who first raised the red flags about her outstanding debts.


The credit card is from capital one so I don't know how to see what she bought there.
 

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Kettle, you seem to reaching in a grab bag of excuses why you're staying married to a woman you state you don't want to be with. Why don't you do a couple of things to straighten out our confusion.

1. Give us the real reason you keep holding on for dear life.

2. Tell us what you are going to do if you garner conclusive proof that she sleeping with any other guy besides you. If you're not going to do anything except complain about it, tell us that.

Right now you sound analogous to abused spouse who's having the police show up on a regular basis but refuses to press charges.
 

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When your marriage is suffering from a hundred cuts and none of them are sufficient enough to properly put it to death, a final death blow is needed.

A final shot, the smoking gun as witness.

If Kettle can prove infidelity decisively, he can die and be reborn.

He presently remains in bleak, cold, barren Siberia.

Prove infidelity.

VAR, VAR, VAR......Dive, Dive, Dive....Dig.


Get the proof to finish this dime store novel.

Find the guilty straw.Lay it atop the red flag heap.

Break your splay-legged marital-camels back.



TT-1
Yeah I still don't get it. Staying up all night agonizing. Plotting this and that to catch them in lies. Especially where words have already been spoken about only being together for the kid.

I don't understand this need to know. The marriage is toast when you go down this path of spying, tracking, plotting this and that. Its done. The need to know seems masochistic to me. Like all that you are doing by digging is a little bit of pain shopping, and avoiding the inevitable.
 

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Discussion Starter #104
Kettle, you seem to reaching in a grab bag of excuses why you're staying married to a woman you state you don't want to be with. Why don't you do a couple of things to straighten out our confusion.

1. Give us the real reason you keep holding on for dear life.

2. Tell us what you are going to do if you garner conclusive proof that she sleeping with any other guy besides you. If you're not going to do anything except complain about it, tell us that.

Right now you sound analogous to abused spouse who's having the police show up on a regular basis but refuses to press charges.
1. I don't have conclusive proof yet. I might be wrong. Also Perhaps fear and co dependency. I also am scared wife may end up with somebody who is abusive to my daughter. I had an abusive stepfather growing up. Do not want that for little girl.


2. Great question. I don't know exactly.

Yeah I still don't get it. Staying up all night agonizing. Plotting this and that to catch them in lies. Especially where words have already been spoken about only being together for the kid.

I don't understand this need to know. The marriage is toast when you go down this path of spying, tracking, plotting this and that. Its done. The need to know seems masochistic to me. Like all that you are doing by digging is a little bit of pain shopping, and avoiding the inevitable.
I know you are right. If I was an outsider looking in I would also GTFO now!
 

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Do people really think that once you go down this path of spygate on your spouse that the marriage is salvageable at all? You are just prolonging the inevitable IMO.
Sometimes there is an innocent explanation for what really happened. Sometimes one spouse is starting to get off the path but there is time to correct things.

Doing some investigation can be helpful in saving a marriage and helping it become a good marriage. But I do agree with you in many cases when there is known infidelity or other known big problems that the investigation does not provide a route to a happier outcome than simply moving to divorce now.
 

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The longer you stay married the more you lose in a divorce. Hey, I am the poster child for staying in a marriage for the kids. I did it for over 20 years.

I expect she will divorce you when the kids are out of the house. Maybe sooner. You need to realize divorce is almost a certainty for you. The longer you wait the more you'll lose.

Child support is logical. You'll be spending that money anyhow even if you stay married, though the court ordered amount isn't always seemingly fair. And, yes, being divorced means you'll be paying for 100% of your living expenses rather than sharing them with your W (assuming she is earning an income now). But, every penny you earn after the divorce is yours. You can and you will rebuild. The sooner you start rebuilding the better off you'll be.

If you wait until you're in your 50's, you'll lose half of all your assets in the divorce. It just doesn't leave enough time for you to recover before retirement. If you have a pension, you'll lose half of it to her. Half your 401k, half your IRA. Half your savings. Half the equity in the house.

The longer you are married the more you will get crushed with paying alimony, if your state allows alimony.

You are better off to get divorced sooner even though you may have to pay child support.
 

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I am an attorney. I don't practice anymore but when I did, I did divorces.

You don't have to retain a lawyer from that firm your W's has a relation working at in order to taint the firm. You merely need to have an initial consultation. Maybe $500. In that consultation you should be prepared to give a lot of details about your finances. That is what taints the firm, typically.

That being said, it could backfire if the court finds that you did this with the intent that you have. You could be sanctioned for intentionally tainting a firm. I've never seen that happen and I've seen a lot of cases where one spouse was clearly tainting multiple firms. But it is a risk.

Thor is absolutely right about the spousal support. Talk to an attorney asap to find out what the cut off is for permanent support. Even if you prove she cheated, you still will be obligated to pay permanent support after some number of married years. Child support is of minor concern compared to that obligation.
 

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I also am scared wife may end up with somebody who is abusive to my daughter. I had an abusive stepfather growing up. Do not want that for little girl.
Youre pretty much pissing against the wind. She could jettison you and still end up with someone abusive to your daughter. Despite you being there 24/7, your daughter could be abused by any one of a number of people. If you're divorced, you still have the power and authority to act on any abuse that comes to light. Chances are when you were growing up, the law was more lax and neither of your parents gave enough of a crap to step in.
 

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You're just proof of what I always say - most men will stay in a miserable marriage as long as they can, and use all kinds of ridiculous excuses to do so because they're too damned afraid to go out in the world and fend for themselves. And that's why women initiate 75% of divorces in the US. You're the reason WHY.

Not surprised that you're clinging like grim death to this slow-motion train wreck of a marriage.

But the childish nonsense about cheating and not using a condom sounds like something an 18 year old teenager would say. Your marriage sucks but you don't have to be a tool and possibly pick up an STD to spread around or worse yet, knock up some woman you pick up off Craigslist or meet in a bar because of it. Jesus.

If you want to stay in a sham of a marriage, that's your business. But you're expecting her to act like someone whose IN a real marriage when she's not.

You can't suck and blow at the same time.
nice jab at male's.

have you ever considered that maybe men don't run off to divorce on a whim because of loyalty, concern for the impact of the divorce on others (especially kids) and arent just thinking solely of themselves, and given that in this case the OP doesnt know 100% the depth of his wife's deceit.......its not a slam dunk, clear cut decision.

i have spoken to many divorced women who many years later on bitterly regretted their choice to divorce. What seemed like unbearable horrible circumstances they were living in and divorced over.....they figured out down the road the grass wasnt greener and their life has turned for the worse. they freely admitted they had their priorities completely out of whack back at the time and are now living with it. A few are completely broken by it....seeing their X move on, find happiness in a new relationship while they have foundered and are now lonely and depressed.
 

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nice jab at male's.

have you ever considered that maybe men don't run off to divorce on a whim because of loyalty, concern for the impact of the divorce on others (especially kids) and arent just thinking solely of themselves, and given that in this case the OP doesnt know 100% the depth of his wife's deceit.......its not a slam dunk, clear cut decision.

i have spoken to many divorced women who many years later on bitterly regretted their choice to divorce. What seemed like unbearable horrible circumstances they were living in and divorced over.....they figured out down the road the grass wasnt greener and their life has turned for the worse. they freely admitted they had their priorities completely out of whack back at the time and are now living with it. A few are completely broken by it....seeing their X move on, find happiness in a new relationship while they have foundered and are now lonely and depressed.
Yes she jabs at males sometimes, but she is correct with her post. Men are worse about staying in bad marriages period. I think that a bunch of them are just chicken****...
 

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I have to agree with the Dude on this one. What is there to save here? It is obvious this is a marriage of mutual convenience and nothing more.

I am usually against "open marriage", but in this instance maybe the best thing OP could do would be to go to his wife and tell her that he knows she is having an affair and that he doesn't really give a rat's ass. He can let her know that she can have her side piece and that he will find a side piece too. As long as she keeps it discreet and doesn't bring the OM around the kids, he will play nice. They can stay married until the kid(s) graduate and then divorce, or they can remain married for life and live out their days as companions and roommates.
 

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Go talk to your wife’s relative that is one of the top divorce lawyers in the state. Just call him/her at their office and ask if you can stop by.

Tell them a bit about the situation, make it seem like you are coming to them for their advice on the entire situation, do NOT use the word “divorce”’or “separation” until the very end. then ask if it comes to a divorce, would they be willing to represent you. Since your wife is related, they will say no, BUT, since you have contacted them and gave them some idea of what is going on, they, not their firm will be allowed to represent her!!!!

Be proactive!!!
 

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Yes she jabs at males sometimes, but she is correct with her post. Men are worse about staying in bad marriages period. I think that a bunch of them are just chicken****...
i dont doubt there are men that stay in bad marriages......same as women. and i agree with the poultry comparison although would add that goes both ways too.

it the 75% thing i have a problem with.

as an example.... I walked out and left my X and told her we were divorcing. she filed first. does that put me in the 75% wimp club when the divorce was 100% my doing? not trying to make this personal or clear out my own demons....just pointing out that because statistically more women file first.........it doesnt make the male world a bunch of wimps.
 

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Discussion Starter #114
The longer you stay married the more you lose in a divorce. Hey, I am the poster child for staying in a marriage for the kids. I did it for over 20 years.

I expect she will divorce you when the kids are out of the house. Maybe sooner. You need to realize divorce is almost a certainty for you. The longer you wait the more you'll lose.

Child support is logical. You'll be spending that money anyhow even if you stay married, though the court ordered amount isn't always seemingly fair. And, yes, being divorced means you'll be paying for 100% of your living expenses rather than sharing them with your W (assuming she is earning an income now). But, every penny you earn after the divorce is yours. You can and you will rebuild. The sooner you start rebuilding the better off you'll be.

If you wait until you're in your 50's, you'll lose half of all your assets in the divorce. It just doesn't leave enough time for you to recover before retirement. If you have a pension, you'll lose half of it to her. Half your 401k, half your IRA. Half your savings. Half the equity in the house.

The longer you are married the more you will get crushed with paying alimony, if your state allows alimony.

You are better off to get divorced sooner even though you may have to pay child support.
Good points. Thanks for this.

I am an attorney. I don't practice anymore but when I did, I did divorces.

You don't have to retain a lawyer from that firm your W's has a relation working at in order to taint the firm. You merely need to have an initial consultation. Maybe $500. In that consultation you should be prepared to give a lot of details about your finances. That is what taints the firm, typically.

That being said, it could backfire if the court finds that you did this with the intent that you have. You could be sanctioned for intentionally tainting a firm. I've never seen that happen and I've seen a lot of cases where one spouse was clearly tainting multiple firms. But it is a risk.

Thor is absolutely right about the spousal support. Talk to an attorney asap to find out what the cut off is for permanent support. Even if you prove she cheated, you still will be obligated to pay permanent support after some number of married years. Child support is of minor concern compared to that obligation.
I definitely need to talk to a lawyer. I don't want anything that could be used against me legally.

Youre pretty much pissing against the wind. She could jettison you and still end up with someone abusive to your daughter. Despite you being there 24/7, your daughter could be abused by any one of a number of people. If you're divorced, you still have the power and authority to act on any abuse that comes to light. Chances are when you were growing up, the law was more lax and neither of your parents gave enough of a crap to step in.
So true. Neither parent gave a **** about it when growing up that is for sure.

I have to agree with the Dude on this one. What is there to save here? It is obvious this is a marriage of mutual convenience and nothing more.

I am usually against "open marriage", but in this instance maybe the best thing OP could do would be to go to his wife and tell her that he knows she is having an affair and that he doesn't really give a rat's ass. He can let her know that she can have her side piece and that he will find a side piece too. As long as she keeps it discreet and doesn't bring the OM around the kids, he will play nice. They can stay married until the kid(s) graduate and then divorce, or they can remain married for life and live out their days as companions and roommates.
This may happen IDK until she and I can talk. For that I need proof.

Go talk to your wife’s relative that is one of the top divorce lawyers in the state. Just call him/her at their office and ask if you can stop by.

Tell them a bit about the situation, make it seem like you are coming to them for their advice on the entire situation, do NOT use the word “divorce”’or “separation” until the very end. then ask if it comes to a divorce, would they be willing to represent you. Since your wife is related, they will say no, BUT, since you have contacted them and gave them some idea of what is going on, they, not their firm will be allowed to represent her!!!!

Be proactive!!!
There is no way she would represent me. Good points though.
 

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Go talk to your wife’s relative that is one of the top divorce lawyers in the state. Just call him/her at their office and ask if you can stop by.

Tell them a bit about the situation, make it seem like you are coming to them for their advice on the entire situation, do NOT use the word “divorce”’or “separation” until the very end. then ask if it comes to a divorce, would they be willing to represent you. Since your wife is related, they will say no, BUT, since you have contacted them and gave them some idea of what is going on, they, not their firm will be allowed to represent her!!!!

Be proactive!!!
This will not work to taint the firm. At least not where I live. Money has to change hands to create the attorney client relationship and the confidentiality requirement.

Kettle - you said this person would not represent you. You just need to pay someone in the firm to have a consultation with you. Not actually hire them for the divorce.
 

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Your right, there is no way she will represent you, but you can make sure she doesn’t represent wife! Don’t forget to bring financial info to seal the deal that her and her firm are out of the picture.
 

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I don't know if I know what I want to be honest.
I would likely use this as an excuse to exit marriage. Sometimes I want to save marriage other times not.

Dude, It's not my intent to sound like an ******* here, but I think you need a reality check. Before you can decide on a course of action you need to determine what you want from this Marriage first. Cause to continue like what you've explained? That's not fair to her or to yourself.
 

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Discussion Starter #120
Hi everybody just update. So I have decided, mainly due to cowardice, I am going to stay with my wife for now. I have given myself the excuse I am doing it to protect my children.

Anyway in early January I guess out of the blue my wife said "lets move to town A." I said okay. Now she had never wanted to move to town A in the past. She even said she hated Town A and would never live there. I love Town A. Only place in the world I want to live. So imagine my surprise when all of a sudden she wanted to move there. I just said "fine."

In May on 2019 we finally moved to Town A. My best friend said to me "Dude why would she all of a sudden want to move to Town A. She said she hated it. Sounds like she is running from something." I agreed. He wondered if she had had an affair. I agreed with him totally.

Anyway we now live in Town A and says she loves it and could not imagine living anywhere else. I just "sure" or something similar.

She is now overseas with the kids visiting family members. She will be back at the end of the month. Yes I am sure she will be coming back. She says she is happy. In fairness she does seem happier in this town.

Oh and gets better. When we were between houses. That is waiting to move into our new house in Town A I found something interesting. We had to do credit checks. So the bank gave me a copy of hers and mine credit report. She had more than 2,500 on a store credit card she never told me about. She said that was for Christmas and apologized for not telling me. But worse than that was her student loans. Before we married she had 15k in student loans. After she was pregnant she told me it was 30k. Anyway after looking at her credit report it said she has 38k in student loans remaining. Which means she had probably closer to 50k when were married. We married 6 years ago.

Anyway that's where I am at. Thanks all for you input. As I said I am staying as I lack the courage to leave. However, I feel that since you were all kind enough to give your input I wanted to tell you where I am at now.
I figure if she cheated once, she will do it again.
 
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