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Strawman? Maybe I didn't connect the dots properly.

The earth isn't flat, cold fusion doesn't exist, the moon landing wasn't faked, and Hillary isn't at the top of a pedophile ring operating out of DC. To believe these things is to be objectively wrong.

Not sure when exactly it become smug, self-serving, or controversial to defend reality. Perhaps we really are in a post-truth society.

 

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One of my favorite personalities is the Amazing Randi, who as an ex-magician has spent the latter part of his life debunking psychics, mystics, astrologers, and the like
Too bad there's not someone like him debunking politicians and political operatives. Many try and many fail. Trouble is their are so many that want to believe BS is roses, they can have one political claim clearly debunked, the cats assisting in setting up and propagating the theory exposed, and immediately fall for the next created by the same crowd.
 

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Mainly agreeing!
My, possibly semantic, disagreement was based on a few other internet discussions I have been having, I am afraid.
I do not think I am particularly rational. Most of my views can be predicted by my experience, background, social standing and culture. I meet many who believe they are utterly rational. Yes, I do not see any reason for their conviction beyond assertion and failure to acknowledge their own bias.
I can see that we can generally see the same thing differently compared to our perspective. We agree completely there. Ultimately, neither perspective will be completely true. But, they are perspectives on the same thing and one is likely to be closer to the truth.
All scientific models are wrong, but some are less wrong than others.
Sorry, I have not put it well, but tried my best :)
This is a great answer to me!!
So by "objective truth", you mean, like...a provable FACT, right?

For ME, my perspective and opinions are based on how I FEEL about the issue, not only how I THINK. Also, I consider how other people FEEL about their opinions as well, and why.
It is important to me where someone's "heart" is with their beliefs, because I want to understand the whole person as much as possible, as I analyze what they are telling me. I don't believe that logical thinking is the only way to be right about something...but, to be honest, I am rarely interested in "right" or "wrong" when it comes to issues, because that limits my true understanding, or at least, the understand that I am seeking.

What needs to be respected (in MY opinion) is not whether a person's perspective is true to ME, but that it's true to THEM.
 

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Discussion Starter #65
This is a great answer to me!!
So by "objective truth", you mean, like...a provable FACT, right?

For ME, my perspective and opinions are based on how I FEEL about the issue, not only how I THINK. Also, I consider how other people FEEL about their opinions as well, and why.
It is important to me where someone's "heart" is with their beliefs, because I want to understand the whole person as much as possible, as I analyze what they are telling me. I don't believe that logical thinking is the only way to be right about something...but, to be honest, I am rarely interested in "right" or "wrong" when it comes to issues, because that limits my true understanding, or at least, the understand that I am seeking.

What needs to be respected (in MY opinion) is not whether a person's perspective is true to ME, but that it's true to THEM.
Forgive me, I would suggest that there is an objective truth, but we do not know it. But, we can alter our perception and understanding to be close to it.
A rather personal one, as we are on this forum. My ex-wife and I debated whether or not she had cleaned her breakfast bowl that day. The bowl was between us and the remains of her coco-pops and some milk were still in it.
In one way, we both had perceptions and neither were quite valid. On an emtional level, she very much identified as someone who would have cleaned the bowl. But, I would say that it was not cleaned. This is of course the emotional labour argument.
There are a couple of approaches to things. I am male and am likely to react and decide quicker and perhaps more forcibly, my wife will take longer and is more considered. If there is a fire or a car price to be negotiated, you want me. If it is something like this Covid-19, the second approach has been better.
The right tend to place empahsis on the individual and ignore the wider picture of curcumstance. The left tend to do the opposite. Personally, I think for a person the former right wing approach is the better one in life, but the latter is more realistic. You have to take responsibility and do all that you can as though it is the only factor, but you have to know that that is not actually true at the same time.

I discussed brexit on some other forums. Both sides thought they had considered it logically. Yet, intellect did not determine which way people voted. The young and people who felt the modern world had been good to them assumed the EU was important, that trade, international co-operation and compromise would need an institution, and that our needs were very inter-related.
Older people, who felt the modern world as articially unfair to them assumed that nations would be fine without such an institution, that it just got in the way and that people who liked the EU must just love foreigners or think the EU was a pretty perfect thing.
There really was no way of seeing which was more accurate at the time. But, the load mouths on both sides feel they have been vindicated and the other side are just naive and/or stupid.
 

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Right now down under we have a bunch of conspiracy theorists in Melbourne preaching that covid 19 is a hoax, and encouraging people to break social distancing, abandon masks, commit fraud, cross borders illegally, etc etc.

Thank the heavens we locked down that state. Need to keep the loonies contained.
 
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