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My husband and I have had a rough 2 years. I was diagnosed with a condition that limited our possibility of having children, not only did the medicine I was on make me crazy, insecure, and jealous it changed me and my personality completely. I said and did things that harmed my husband deeply. I have since apologized for my actions, I have made amends, I have owned my partaking in his heartbreak, and affair, I am however still working on forgiving myself.
He has been an emotional/physical affair with someone who was a dear friend of mine. It came out on Thanksgiving that they were having an emotional affair sine July of 2014 and it got physical in October of 2014 when I went out of town. We are in communication with one another, we still currently live together for another month or so. In our discussion he has told me several things amongst them being:
He still loves me, cares for me deeply, I am important to him, I am his best friend, he values me and my opinions, he has told me that he wants a divorce that he feels it is the only way we will ever have a new relationship, that he has no idea what our future holds with me, her, or himself.
If I ask him directly if divorce is really what he wants he doesn't answer me, if I ask him if he has more feelings for me than he is letting on he doesn't respond. He claims he feels done with us, but I knew before he came clean that he was cheating and I knew it was with her my gut never lies. When he tells me these things about wanting a divorce, and not being in love with me anymore my gut laughs at him, my heart chips a little, but it too knows its a lie. He claims to be in love with my once friend but yet he comes to me when he is sick (twice in the past month), he still seeks out cuddle time, and comfort, we still talk, laugh and hangout, we have both been so honest with one another, we cook dinner together, watch our shows, go out to eat, to the movies, play and joke around with one another, sometimes he seeks out intimacy. He claims the only thing missing is the emotional side of a relationship.
He told me the other night over dinner that he and her have made non serious futuristic type plans (not kids, not marriage, not moving in together) just come what may we could have something good, or we can have nothing. He said she will either make something of it or she will teeter out because he gets that sense from her. This upset me and I told him how can he say he will be moving out to gain any perspective on us, if he is making "plans" with his mistress. He said he could do it because we are different and separate, he has said he believes my every word, that he will take all of our history, all of our discussions and gain perspective from it.
I have pointed out to him that what he feels isn't real, it will fade, I have told him what type of woman she is to have done this to someone she claimed was her best friend. I have told him she sees me and feels no guilt, feels no remorse, she sees me as inhuman. He has been open and honest about all of their discussions, he told me that she has no expectations of him right now, that he has told her how he feels about me, and who I am to him, that he can't see the future and doesn't know what it will hold, that he doesn't want to be anybody's step dad or father figure.
In my humble non bashing opinion she is the lesser prize to be won, She has no job, no money, she is 33 with two kids 11-12, she lives with her mother, her father and mother equally pay her bills, she is a FT nursing student (but he came to me for comfort), she has no class, obviously has low self esteem, no value of herself, no sense of respect or worth.
She has interjected multiple times trying to get my husband and I to fight in hopes that we severe ties completely, it has not worked and I have told him that this is the type of crap I have seen her pull dozens of times before to get what she wants, that she is literally trying to hack into his subconscious, and manipulate him into giving me up completely, even though he has stood firm ground that I am not going anywhere.... I feel as though he is lost, that he has no clue what he wants, i believe he knows it too otherwise why would he need to gain perspective about anything in regards to us, why would he be so adamant about not losing me.

I have asked him that when he moves out to gain perspective to ensure that divorce is really what he wants, (like I said in the above, i see hesitation in him, I feel he is more lost than he even knows) I sense from him that in some ways he is already seeing the error of his ways if he feels things with her may falter due to a sense he gets from her. I have been working hard on myself, working with coaches, reading paper after paper, article after article, I have attended seminars, webinars and the like trying to understand, trying to re-empower myself and find ways to implement small changes to show him and myself that we can recover, so far the positive of what I have accomplished has worked, the yelling, blaming, lording and name calling have stopped.
From the beginning of this I honestly have not poked, prodded, or tried to convince him otherwise. I have not tried to manipulate his decisions, in fact before he came clean I told him I supported his decision to get space, and gain clarity because the past two years have literally been hard on the both of us, it was taxing and exhausting emotionally and physically. I was and still very much am heartbroken, I have also stood up to him, I have packed all of his belongings, I have rearranged my home to suit me, taken all of his things off the walls, I have told him I will not tolerate being treated second class when despite our issues I never once thought of stepping out, that I will not be his back up plan when plan b fails, that i will not be disrespected in my home than when he is with me she needs to respect that and if she doesn't than she has no respect for him, and if he cannot adhere or abide by those non negotiable boundaries he can sleep in his car until he can. I have been enjoying getting to rediscover myself again since I got the all clear health wise, I have enjoyed not being on medication that makes me a crazy person, I have enjoyed finding my way back to who I was before the condition, and meds took over.
I hope he does see the error of his ways, I hope that he sees sooner than later that affairs are all well and good in the beginning, but her demands, her expectations of him will change, he will be stuck taking care of her and the two kids he never wanted to be a daddy figure to and realize that despite our issues, despite the last 2 years, that I really worked on myself, I really analyzed the situation for what it really is and he will see that the prize was me, the diamond was me.

Now I am even more confused, he has told me that he is torn between wanting a divorce because he was unhappy for so long and not wanting one because he still loves and cares for me. That we both never saw this coming, and he feels that when he moves out (living with me has been a knee jerk thing for him) he will cut communication with the both of us so he can get a clear picture of what he wants. That living apart will help him to determine if we are worth it or not. He also stated during this conversation that he is hesitant about us and our marriage because if things go bad again he will lose me forever, That if we got a divorce he still isn't sure what our future may hold, even still with him and her.
I told him that I understood that, and that he needs to tell her what he has been thinking, that despite me not liking her in this moment she deserves to know what he has been thinking. I am apprehensive though about this and his thoughts of not talking to her either because she broke it off once and 2 days later was calling him (shows she has no respect for her own decisions) I know I have to adhere to it, but i do not see her taking this news well, and I do not see her adhering to this and his decision I know her, she will contact him (which shows she has no respect for him) she will try hard to stand her ground with him. When he said this to me I laughed because as I stated above that rule she set didn't last long, he told me that even now it is difficult for him to not talk to me, that he just doesn't know what to say most days and it will be hard to not talk to me when he moves out. He keeps using terms like "if we get divorced" "whether your my wife or not" and so on... before it was "when we divorce"
. I am beyond confused, how can he love her but be torn in his decision? How can i trust he will adhere to the no contact rule he sets with her? When the no contact rule is lifted how do I show him I am still vested in this marriage?

I have implemented a lot of the advice I have found within blogs, and so forth. I have gotten pretty good results, our communication is more open, our spats die quickly, we apologize and find ourselves having more neutral conversations once we have cooled off, Of course when it comes to the other woman still in his life I get heated and emotional which is understandable.

he is 50/50 on the wanting not wanting a divorce, this past weekend we had an intense conversation about this because it is coming down to the wire and he is moving out soon. He told me the no contact rule still applies to me because we both have agreed we need space, and that he will be the one to initiate contact again. He stated that he is not going to cut contact with her in this because he does not feel that "she will cause an issue, she will not be over all the time so he will have time to contemplate us..." This information made me sad in a way because he feels he can make a sound decision even with her in the picture. I told him he was the one living in a rose colored world not me, that of course he doesn't see anything she says or does as a problem or an issue and that he will have no issue believing her every word because she will not say or do anything to compromise their "relationship", that everything with her is fresh, fun, exciting, and colorful and when he looks over at me its still this grey area, where I am hurt, and trying to rebuild communication and trust even with her in the picture, where believing what I say is one thing but believing in me is a different story. That just like I do not want them to be together she doesn't want us to be together.

This is where this gets interesting, he told me that we are still deeply connected, that he loves me, cares for me, I am still a sense of weakness for him, I am still a safe and comfortable place for him, That he still has a soft spot for me, and that our connection is more than just that of physical intimacy. He told me that he holds everything I say at value and that he will be thinking of this all while he is gone. That he still feels guilty and she feels guilty, that he caught her looking at our photos and crying claiming she was a horrible person. He expressed to me in a more deep level that he does not know what the universe has designed for us, that he has never thought nor has he ever stated to her that he thought she was his saving grace, or his true love. That our connection (his and mine) and theirs are similar but also very different... that stung and he saw that because I instantly started to cry, how can that be so? Ours started 12 years ago, EVERYONE that knew us even as just friends always made a show of us being together, connections like that do not come around everyday but then he wants to sit there and compare ours to theirs oh no sir!!! it made me feel like ours was no longer special, that it never was... why can't he see that the connection they found they sought after, made deeper by lies and betrayal?? in all reality I believe their connection is purely physical that's all their texts ever suggest aside from a few lunch dates in between her classes and her kids getting off of school.

He also went on to say that he did have reservations about the two of them because she had her priorities her kids, and school and he too had his priorities school and work and the cloud of guilt will always be over them, and that it will always be known that in order to be together they had to break my heart, divorce or not it still will hurt.that nothing serious had been talked about, no commitment planned out because of these factors. Why can he not see that once he moves from me the dynamic between them at least in her eyes is going to change, she already asserts herself in between us, she already has made it known to me at least through immature social media bashing on her end that she is not okay with us being friends, that she has no clue what is going on behind the doors at home. I believe she feels for him more than he feels for her in the present moment, she has shown at least in my opinion a sense of possessiveness, obsessiveness, and controlling manipulative behavior over him and this situation. In a month they exchange over 5000 texts, even when she sees him she continuously texts him, at work, while he is sleeping, hanging out with family or me...

He knows he did wrong, and that he is not living the hurt I caused him anymore, I have made active steps to bettering our situation so that in case things do head further south a friendship can remain in tact. He claims he will always feel for me that he does not foresee our connection ever dying, which is nice to hear because in the beginning it certainly felt like all was lost, like he meant it when he said he loved me but wasn't in love with me. He told me that was never the case, that yes in the beginning he just wanted it to be over, then he slowly started coming to reality that he felt for me just the connection of emotion and the bond of marriage in his eyes was deteriorating before his eyes, that he needs to figure out if he believes in us again, in marriage again. He knows he allowed himself to get to a point where he hurt me deeply, he has to figure out if he can forgive himself enough to come home and make it right. He knows my sentiments that I do not want our old marriage back, I want a consideration for a new marriage that giving people chances is different that giving a marriage a second chance. He knows how I feel about him, what I want, and still want form our relationship. He knows that I am scared I may lose him, I may lose the chance to ever have him again and to know his love again, he expressed the same sentiment but also said that, that fear wan't enough we both did wrong, him more so. If he feels this way about us... then why is she still in the picture (he still claims to feel in love with her) ?

The intimacy between us is not an issue, it never has been, it does not make things harder. Its the conversations like the one I laid out that make it harder on me, that make me so nervous of what's to come... Everything I hold dear is riding on this decision all she has to lose is pride and ego. I do not believe in divorce and do not want to be forced into something I do not believe in, In the same regards if he chooses to leave and not come back who am I to force him to stay in something he lost faith in? I just do not want him to make a decision he may regret, if he chooses the latter he will more than likely spend the rest of his life never knowing if we could have made it work, if we could have made our marriage stronger, if we will ever be anything outside of our marriage and friendship again... I know there is nothing left to say that I haven't already said and there's little I can do in that regards either, do you think he will ever see? ever come to clarity? ever see things for how they are?

I honestly do want this marriage, I want him, I want us, I have had time to think in all clarity because I am not fogged up by some other woman/man. I have told him as much he knows I do not want a divorce, that I believe our issues can be sorted out. After all in his mind the only things needed to be worked on was our communication, how to control our feelings and how we spoke to one another. Since the cat has been out of the bag I have been the only one trying anything, because in more ways that one I want to let him see that I was listening, I have started to come back to myself since my treatment stopped, I have read and researched our communication pattern so that we can better communicate which has worked he mirrors it, I have changed my behavior towards him and have chosen to be loving and kind while backing off and asking questions as I deem fit to ask.

He told me last night that he had been thinking about moving from our home town during our separation in general that nothing besides his family and our marriage is holding him here. That he can do school anywhere and he thinks being gone from here will actually be better in the long run. I support this, his brother in MD offered for him to stay with him for awhile and I think he may chose that or joining the military.

I want him back, but like I said there is only so much one person can do, and say. I have said all I can and done all that I can that he allows without me coming off a certain way or over stepping our boundaries.

My BIL is pro marriage, and he is in between a rock and a hard place when it comes to his brother and me, he wants us to work things out, but he also wants us to be happy and make the right decisions for ourselves. He mentioned the military before my diagnosis but stayed to see me through it, I live in Florida and my BIL in Maryland.

The OW woman wouldn't pick up and leave, she has two kids and a custody arrangement that would prohibit her from doing that without his permission. I agree he does need to get off the fence, when it comes to her he has blinders on as thick as fog and honestly the last two years were physically and emotionally taxing, I have no clue how much more I can take. I love him deeply, I want him and I want our marriage to work he knows all of this, he says he is going to take my words, my sentiments, my promises at face value and I truly hope he does. I know he wants to stay friends if things don't work out because he has said as much, and has said that no one would tell him otherwise, and if there was one person he wouldn't want to lose its me, well guess what? the more stuff I deal with, the more I put up with, the more he pulls me close and pushes me away chips away at any possibility of me even wanting that... My feelings for him would eventually sour our friendship our bring us back together. I know I am this limbo area in his life, where every element is there but forging a deeper emotional bond... that's hard when someone else is there filling that void. However isn't being open and honest with one another, laughing, cuddling, being intimate, and talking ways of an emotional bond??? I know he has a lot on his mind as well as I do, I know this is hard on him to be stuck in this area of uncertainty when for our whole relationship we were sure of everything. The difference is when he moves out he has someone to keep him warm at night, someone else to talk to about whatever, someone else wearing his t shirts, sitting by him watching our shows, etc I however do not and do not plan on it.

We both didn't have the best models growing up when it came to marriage. My mom cheated on my dad, his dad cheated on his mom and up until about 4 years ago his mom and his dad had a weird love hate relationship that should have ended 25 plus years ago which has completely ended now. We came into this saying what we weren't going to do, truth is we learned relationship skills from our parents, how we talk to each other, how fights should be resolved, how we say things, how we act. I wish more people realized that sometimes your parents set you up for failure. We did all of those things, we never had the proper tools to fix things, to fight effectively and to stay level headed through out it. every day I wake up, I look at him and think to myself no matter what he decides I love him, and I know he loves me back. Unlike the rest of his family members he has a conscious and it will eat away at him he will reach that clarity fast if he allows himself too, if he lets me go I feel it will be a mistake, I have done what needed to be done to show my sorrow for hurting him, for resolving what needed to be resolved to show him I am sorry.

I know he is sorry, I know he feels guilty, I know its hard to walk away from an affair but in my opinion since this came out he hasn't actually shown me he is sorry. He tells me he is, he says he thinks of me all the time, he misses me some times, he wishes I were around more when he is out but yet he doesn't hardly call or text ( I do not blame him for that, because even I cut back on it for I had no idea what to say to him anymore) If he felt all these ways then he should have passed the test when she initiated contact with him the first time around they called it off, If he felt that guilty why will he not stop seeing her? if he is that conflicted why am I the only one who knows how conflicted he truly is? Some times I honestly feel I am in a twisted Jane Austen Novel I never would have wasted years of investment just to be told it may or may not work out... .

I will continue to truck along.
 

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Your post is really long, I didn't read all of it, but basically this is the only thing I was glad to read: "I have also stood up to him, I have packed all of his belongings, I have rearranged my home to suit me, taken all of his things off the walls, I have told him I will not tolerate being treated second class when despite our issues I never once thought of stepping out, that I will not be his back up plan when plan b fails, that i will not be disrespected in my home."

Why tolerate his cheating? He wants to have his cake and eat it, too, doesn't he? And you're letting him.
 

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I didn't even realize how long it was, I figured getting all information out there would be better than breaking it into segments.

You are right he shouldn't come for cuddles and talk about being 50/50, just so everyone knows I do not tolerate it he knows it she knows it, he considers us separated and living together and for that sole reason he sees it as nothing wrong anymore even though it is.

I know I screwed up because when I found out I allowed him to stay when I should have kicked him out, even knowing he had no where to go. I know it would have made him realize sooner, now its just hard being under the same roof as him, seeing him day in and day out. Our conversations leave everything so open ended.

How am I playing mommy to him if I have taken the advice to implement changes, back off, do me and what not.. I tried detaching myself and all that got me was a barrage of questions "why are you being weird? Why won't you talk to me" in all honesty he started back with wanting to hang out, going out to eat, and playing house again, The thing that switched that was when I went out with one of my guy co workers to a dinner, I had never seen him so hurt, so angry he actually told me he doesn't want me dating other men?? what the hell is that about??
 

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How am I playing mommy to him if I have taken the advice to implement changes, back off, do me and what not.. I tried detaching myself and all that got me was a barrage of questions "why are you being weird? Why won't you talk to me" in all honesty he started back with wanting to hang out, going out to eat, and playing house again, The thing that switched that was when I went out with one of my guy co workers to a dinner, I had never seen him so hurt, so angry he actually told me he doesn't want me dating other men?? what the hell is that about??
Again: he wants to have his cake, and eat it too.
He wants his mistress, but also his wife. And the only way to do that is threaten divorce, which allows him to live under the same roof as you, yet still see his mistress.

If he's truly ready and willing and wanting to divorce you, it will NOT anger him that you go to dinner with another guy, or that you're detached from him.

Completely detach. Move on with your life. Tell him to move out. Get the divorce papers, put them on the table and ask him to sign them. He won't. And if he does - good riddance!
 

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Detatch and do a 180. He wants it both ways, the comforts of you and the newness and excitement of another woman. Tell him either he needs to leave and go through with the divorce and you won't have contact with him or stay and work on the marriage. He is confusing you and driving you crazy.
 

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He is most def. fence-straddling and cake eating. Almost all of us in the same boat got the "I love you but not in love with you" speech. It is a selfish driven statement.

Don't be thrown off by the incongruity of his behavior. Cheaters like to come off like they are making a civil and mature decision, but really they are unstable, emotionally compromised, and bounce around in their highs and lows of being involved with an addictive relationship. His logic has been sidelined...overridden by the euphoria and novelty of runnin' rebel with OW.

Open the cage door. Tell him you are letting him make his decision. Don't bother trying to teach or preach at him...rarely will it work...and even if a conversation does happen to turn on a light bulb...these epiphanies are usually momentary, swept away by the wave of euphoria and selfishness.

Yes, the best way to deal with this is set boundaries. If he wants to stay, then he needs to do all of the things that show he is reinvesting in the marriage and zero contact with other women. If he chooses her or can't choose...then there is the door...and D papers are being drawn up. Addicts only change when there are painful consequences...which happens either because spouse threw down the iron gauntlet OR the addict bottoms out to the point of crying mercy.

Still...right now you are in salvage mode. Let's say he comes back...and a couple months go by. How are you going to feel about your husband who had been sleeping with your best friend? Sometimes, we get so focused on saving the marriage that we ignore our resident feelings. Give H all the space he needs...you do not have the power to coerce his decisions, but you can take control of the situation by setting boundaries and getting far away from his emotional rollercoaster so you can inventory your own needs, wants, and wishes.
 

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He wants you as a backup. Cut ties with him and let him go with his wh0re. You can reconsider later if he puts himself together and you're still interested, but think about the character of a guy that gets upset over you with another guy while he has a sk!nk. He has too much power here.

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I didn't even realize how long it was, I figured getting all information out there would be better than breaking it into segments.

You are right he shouldn't come for cuddles and talk about being 50/50, just so everyone knows I do not tolerate it he knows it she knows it, he considers us separated and living together and for that sole reason he sees it as nothing wrong anymore even though it is.

I know I screwed up because when I found out I allowed him to stay when I should have kicked him out, even knowing he had no where to go. I know it would have made him realize sooner, now its just hard being under the same roof as him, seeing him day in and day out. Our conversations leave everything so open ended.

How am I playing mommy to him if I have taken the advice to implement changes, back off, do me and what not.. I tried detaching myself and all that got me was a barrage of questions "why are you being weird? Why won't you talk to me" in all honesty he started back with wanting to hang out, going out to eat, and playing house again, The thing that switched that was when I went out with one of my guy co workers to a dinner, I had never seen him so hurt, so angry he actually told me he doesn't want me dating other men?? what the hell is that about??
WAY too many people talk about being 50/50.

50/50 is what a DIVORCE is made of.

Marriages are made of 100/100, and anything less just doesn't measure up.

50/50 = trying halfway....
 
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