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I personally think the Fed (through artificially low interest rates, debt funding) and National Government (deficit spending, stimulus) has created a giant bubble. The next crash I fear will be especially bad. Twelve years of economic growth and continued debt spending? Even Keynes would shake his head. Look at the housing bubble, housing prices are way higher than they were during that bubble, everything is higher.
 

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And you did good!

I worked all through school, college, got every "poor family" "single-mom family" grant I could apply for, and still graduated with 15,000.00 student debt (30,000 in today's money?) which it took seven years but I paid off, and was working, married, raising a family most of that time.
We did good. Because 1) we worked hard and more importantly 2) we could.

Part B is not as simple as it used to be.
 

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The entire way of doing business has changed since then. We are in an international economy and becoming more everyday. You can get 3 Indian workers for the same amount you'd pay one US worker. Everyone I have been employed with has several outsourced employees from India, Russia, all over the place. So with depressed wages in other countries along with our higher wages, of course wages aren't going to increase as much (unless you are very specialized like doctors), atleast not until there is global parity which could take generations.

It's not so simple as raise taxes and create more welfare programs. There are limitations. And it will of course come with unintended consequences as always occurs due to higher taxes.
 

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What University did you attend and when?

Like Cletus I paid as I went and left with only a few grand in debt. I went to the University of Nebraska. During the mid to late 90s. Pretty cheap then. Unheard of cheap now. My parents didn't help pay for school but "made too much" to get any grants etc.

Was it housing costs that racked up so much debt for you then? With grants and working through school, 15k sounds like a lot if it was a similar school and time.
Even in the 80s. Housing for two years before I could afford to drop, and all lab eqpt and lab time.
I'm an Electronic Engineer with minor in physics and math, going to school year round no summers off. I got suckered into the math but in the long run was worth it.

But I was fortunate enough to get hired quickly and have been in IT and Telecom since. And education is continuous!
 

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(I mean *real* socialism, the the social democracies of northern europe where are completely different).
This is no such thing as a socialist democracy. The countries that you refer to object to being called socialist. They say they are capitalist.

Why? Because people will not willingly give up their right to free enterprise and private ownership without a fight. This always leads to "Reeducation Camps" and or Firing Squads.

Here is a stark example of Socialism (North Korea and South Korea side by side) Also notice China which has allowed Capitalism to rear its ugly head again: Google North Korea & South Korea Satellite Photo at night.

One of Bernie's boys was recently gleefully talking about this on video. By the way, did you know where Bernie Honeymooned? Moscow.

Instead of figuring out how to get "free stuff", Millenials should figure out how to "earn" stuff.
 

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So we need more free stuff! I notice food tastes better when free. I'm sure the same can be said for education. Of course, then everyone would have a equally useless degree fighting over finite jobs. But maybe jobs will grow with all those higher corporate taxes!
IDK who told you jobs are finite, but an educated workforce is often a factor in deciding where to locate economic entities that employ people.

I frequently read that manufacturers complain about a shortage of people educated in how to maintain and set up equipment.
 

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This is no such thing as a socialist democracy. The countries that you refer to object to being called socialist. They say they are capitalist.
True enough. I work for a German company and regularly travel there. They are a capitalist nation with a social safety net. They have universal health care and the ability to "buy up" to better coverage if you desire.

We could do a lot worse than emulate the better run Social Democracies of Europe.
 

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Here is a stark example of Socialism (North Korea and South Korea side by side) Also notice China which has allowed Capitalism to rear its ugly head again: Google North Korea & South Korea Satellite Photo at night.
Just for comparison, since you are holding South Korea up:

he South Korean healthcare system is run by the Ministry of Health and Welfare and is free to all citizens at the point of delivery. The system is funded by a compulsory National Health Insurance Scheme that covers 97% of the population. Foreign nationals living in South Korea enjoy the same access to universal healthcare as the local people.
 

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IDK who told you jobs are finite, but an educated workforce is often a factor in deciding where to locate economic entities that employ people.

I frequently read that manufacturers complain about a shortage of people educated in how to maintain and set up equipment.
would that be a hands on, non college degree required job?

This is what I do and I'm making preety good money with no college degree.
 

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That is about as whiny as a millenial would sound. Everyone pretty much starts off from a status of debt (school, house, cars) for half their life. Then they accumulate skills and wealth of turn the corner. Millennials will do the same eventually. Then they will be complaining about the next gen being whiny commies.
Maybe, or maybe they will decide as previous generations of Americans did that capitalism isn't delivering for them and start a movement for something else. Google "International Workers of the World" if this doesn't sound familiar, though they aren't the only example. I think most of today's millenials wouldn't consider themselves communists; some previous generations were very comfortable w/ the label.

My take on Karl Marx was that capitalism of the era looked so bleak for so many people he was trying to envision something that wasn't so hopeless. BTW I don't think what he came up w/ was ever going to work.

I also think the West's tolerance of labor unions was a middle ground that would (and did) keep people content w/ capitalism, or whatever you want to call what we wound up with.
 

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would that be a hands on, non college degree required job?
It is across the spectrum. Some jobs hinge on the availability of people w/ a HS education, others w/ higher and/or more specialized education. And sometimes the availability of these people enables a facility which also hires less educated people.

The point is, there isn't a fixed # of jobs that is independent of the workforce's education.
 

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And? Who owns those?

Rich people have 'households'.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/08/business/economy/stocks-economy.html

https://news.gallup.com/poll/211052/stock-ownership-down-among-older-higher-income.aspx

https://money.com/stock-ownership-10-percent-richest/

https://www.financialsamurai.com/what-percent-of-americans-own-stocks/

You can tell me all you want about funds, and this and that, but most boomers cannot retire, because they dont have the retirement plans to do so. Same with Gen-x in a few years, and even more so with millenials. If they own all this stock, why can't they retire?
 

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I am glad he was able to distill it down to they are stupid and/or not educated. I think that will just be my response to everyone that disagrees with my political/economic philosophies.

It is way easier than thinking they might have a valid reason, or capacity to think for themselves.
What an elitist attitude :surprise: Or, are you saying this is Dennis Prager's attitude?


From an article not on a right wing conservative site about this:

The fact that Millennials want a more socially and economically inclusive society doesn’t necessarily mean they are embracing old-school socialism or communism. Perhaps they are really redefining the words in their own terms.
Socialism for them has a drastically different meaning than it did for older generations who have lived through the dangers caused by despots and tyrants like Lenin, Stalin and Fidel Castro. But they’ve also endured the disaster caused by unbridled and unchecked capitalism. Reality for them has been the economic crash of 2007-2008.
They aren’t interested in what happened forty years ago, but what they’re witness to in the present age. What’s affecting their lives now? As someone so aptly put it: “It’s the economy, stupid.”
Socialism or communism are viewed by Millennials as an alternative to the disasters capitalism has created. And this generation may be on the verge of re-defining the terms to fit their experience.
Perhaps Millennials are choosing to create a “More Perfect Union, For the People and by the People” in their own way, and in the context of the times they live in.
It is their generation who will ultimately be in charge, it’s their time and they are choosing to shape the world as they see fit.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/this-is-why-millennials-favor-socialism_b_58ed0feae4b0145a227cb8d3
The problem with assigning different meanings to words, like communism and socialism, is that people who actually know what these words mean do not understand what the people who are redefining them are saying. I would suggest that those who want political and/or social change be clear in what they want and their words in order to discuss and devise an approach for change.

There is a significant portion of the U.S population that currently desires a communist revolution, if you are to believe their words. If you visit internet sites that focus on this subject you will see it. Of course, it is difficult, if not impossible, to discern the demographics of those who participate in the discussions on these sites (millennials, Gen X/Y/Z, etc.) however they talk of revolution, class warfare, killing the “elites”, seizing property, etc. It is also difficult to know the size of these groups, yes they have ten of thousands of members on these sites however that does not mean they are all Marxist/communists. Hence, I used the phrase “significant portion” because these sites have a substantial presence on the internet.

As for Dennis Prager (and myself), words have meaning, so if you are not a “communist” then don’t label yourself as such and then claim that you meant something different.
 

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And? Who owns those?

Rich people have 'households'.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/08/business/economy/stocks-economy.html

https://news.gallup.com/poll/211052/stock-ownership-down-among-older-higher-income.aspx

https://money.com/stock-ownership-10-percent-richest/

https://www.financialsamurai.com/what-percent-of-americans-own-stocks/

You can tell me all you want about funds, and this and that, but most boomers cannot retire, because they dont have the retirement plans to do so. Same with Gen-x in a few years, and even more so with millenials. If they own all this stock, why can't they retire?
How do you know they just don't want to retire? I know lots of boomers put off retiring after the recession to build their 401k's back up. I figured many had retired by now. Or atleast the ones I know did.
 

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What an elitist attitude :surprise: Or, are you saying this is Dennis Prager's attitude?
That is Prager's attitude.

How do you know they just don't want to retire? I know lots of boomers put off retiring after the recession to build their 401k's back up. I figured many had retired by now. Or atleast the ones I know did.
They cannot retire, just google boomer retirement problems and you will see how around half or so have less than 200k in total retirement "Only 55% of Baby Boomers have some retirement savings and, of those, 28% have less than $100,000. " https://www.investopedia.com/articles/personal-finance/032216/are-we-baby-boomer-retirement-crisis.asp
 

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Discussion Starter #59
U.S.S.R. = Union of Soviet Socialist Republics

It was easier to just call the communists. Why? Well, communism is always the goal, but it cannot be forced. A society needs to go that direction naturally, giving all of what they make for the good of all. Every nation that wants communist rule must start with socialism. Most have a side of dictatorship with that, so someone is in charge to stop chaos.
 

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It's hard to convince people of that when you have 3% unemployment rate and 12 years of economic growth. Not enough dissatisfied people to wreck the economy. The revolutionaries better wait till the next economic slowdown.

BTW, the US hardly has unchecked capitalism. There is so much red tape and hoops to jump through, companies need a whole department to deal with government/SEC demands.
While it may not be quite as dramatic as you would indicate in this post, it is still significant.

Furthermore, the more regulation that exists, The more the business environment favors large corporations as opposed to smaller businesses. It becomes a barrier to entry as an unintended consequence.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
 
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