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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Last night I watched the Netflix show about Chris and Shanann Watts.

Chris Watts is the Colorado guy that killed his pregnant wife and 2 little girls so he could hook up with some other chick.

The show is mostly a montage of clips of police videos, home movie clips, social media pictures and posts and snippets from txt messages and such.

What struck me was the txt and email dialogs between Shanann and her girlfriends as well as some of the exchanges between her and her soon to be killer.

Other than the murders, it was classic stuff you see here every day. Even murderers follow the playbook.

Her txts to her girlfriends show he was going cold and distant. He had gone from a horny lover to rejecting her advances for weeks at time.

He had gone from a doting father to not speaking to her or the kids for days on end when they were out of town visiting relatives.

When she’d press him for answers and would even ask him about another woman, he would completely DARVO and gaslight her and act like she was crazy.

She would want to address the issues and he would cut her off and tell her it was time for his workout.

Even when the police were interviewing him and telling him their suspicions based on his prior behaviors, including significant weight loss and preoccupation with fitness and changing his appearance, he would straight-faced deny any outside involvement.

One of the things that is kind of haunting me today is she would txt her GF about his change of behavior and that she suspected there was an OW and the GF would basically say, “oh no Honey! He would never do that!” The GF then encouraged her to get sexier and more assertive sexually and “..go get your freak on!”

When Shanann would txt her the next day and say that despite her best efforts he still rejected her and she spent the night crying, the GF still only offered platitudes and still rejected the notion of him cheating.

This was a young, fit, healthy, engaging man in his mid 30s with tattoos and tight shirts and Shanann was a beautiful, sexy and self-admittedly very horny woman and he was saying no thanks and rolling over to sleep - yeah right!!! If things don’t add up, they don’t add up.

The thing she kept telling the GF that the GF wasn’t registering was that this was completely out of character for him and for them as a couple. I got the impression from the txts that they used to be like rabbits and now he was suddenly stiff arming her at every pass.

I’m not trying to blame the GF at all, she was trying to be supportive and support the marriage as well as a listening ear to Shanann.

But I can’t help but think if Shanann had written to this forum, that people would have at least told her to listen to her gut and that the signs and red flags she was seeing were things to be taken seriously and she would have been told how to dig a little deeper and where and how to investigate for further evidence.

He was following the Handbook. The signs were there.

I know we get on each other that we may be too paranoid and a little too quick to say that someone is cheating, but when the signs are there, the signs are there and some of those signs are things that normal friends and family would brush off as “stress” and being too tired from work etc.

Maybe I’m feeling some kind of weird guilt that maybe she and the girls could have been saved if she had been tipped off sooner 😢

Has anyone else seen that show? What were your thoughts as you were watching it play out?
 

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I know we get on each other that we may be too paranoid and a little too quick to say that someone is cheating, but when the signs are there, the signs are there and some of those signs are things that normal friends and family would brush off as “stress” and being too tired from work etc.
Yeah, posters here do sometimes get jumped on when they "dare" to bring up the infidelity topic when someone is posting about their spouse being unloving or disengaged or suddenly wanting out of the relationship. There's a thread right now on General Relationships from a distraught woman whose husband suddenly blindsided her and told her he wants out and a poster in that thread got thumped for daring to bring up the possibility of infidelity.

I 100% agree with that poster (Diana) that the OP needs to consider that her husband is having an affair. I think she's going to eventually find out that Mr. Wonderful has a girlfriend and THAT'S why he's not sure if he wants to stay and go through IVF with her again, or hit the skids and run off to Unicorn Land with his girlfriend.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Shanann's GF wasn't a true friend.
I disagree with that. I really don’t blame the GF.

Although it’s kind of haunting me, I don’t think the GF necessarily displayed any malfeasance or actual negligence based on the evidence she was being presented with.

We want our friends to not only be our friend and confidant, we also want them to be friends of the marriage and of the spouse as well.

In many weddings, both religious and secular, the presiding official will encourage the witnesses/congregation to support the couple and support the marriage as a whole. That is why weddings are public and why many do it before friends and family.

What the GF was being presented with (at least in the show) was that Shanann was horny and wanting some love’ns but Chris was basically not in the mood.

If the roles were reversed and it was a dude, his friend of the marriage would likely tell him to go take care of his hard on himself and let the Mrs get her rest.

Now if Shanann had told the GF she found 342 flirty and sexy txts and some boob pictures from some other gal and that he was coming home late from work all the time and had scratches on his back and found a woman’s necklace under the seat of his car - then yes, the GF may have had some negligence if she tried to explain that away.

But what the GF was being presented with was that he hadn’t been putting the d—- to her in the manner she was accustomed to lately.

I’m sure in hindsight the GF feels terrible, but what she was given at that time is at least understandable, especially if she herself had not been cheated on before.
 

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I followed that case. He apparently is thriving in prison. And his former gf has restarted her life somewhere else under a new name, IIRC (because plenty of people thought she was involved). His parents may still believe he only killed his wife when she killed their daughters (the best story he could come up with apparently) but certainly no one else does. And her parents lost their only daughter and only grandchildren. Shaking my head.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Another thing that struck me about the show was towards the end once it came out he killed her and the girls, Shanann’s family started receive hate mail and people were bashing her on forums and social media.

There were people saying she was the ***** and ball breaker and cause for their marital woes.

There are those that automatically blame the BS for not being nice enough or sexy enough etc but here was a beautiful, sexy woman wanting to have a love and sex life with her husband and now her children and watching him bury her body in the desert and then strangled one by one and their bodies discarded in petroleum tanks???

That’s a special kind of evil.

I guess the lay-public has a playbook of their own that wants to blame the victim as well 😔
 

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Yes, there were lots of Chris groupies who couldn’t believe that this low-key “nice” guy could possibly do what he did. Many of them still blame Shannan for being a strong Type A (as was his gf). They felt Shannan and/or his gf drove him to it. Especially Shannan since he said he told her he wanted a divorce and she said no. I think he didn’t want his good guy image destroyed and he was one of those people who decided murder was easier than divorce. Obviously, he thought he would get away with it and he and his gf would ride off into the sunset. Instead he’s doing life in Wisconsin (transferred there from Colorado where he was getting death threats) and his gf was, and maybe still is, in hiding somewhere. And Shannan and the children are gone forever.
 

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Last night I watched the Netflix show about Chris and Shanann Watts.

Chris Watts is the Colorado guy that killed his pregnant wife and 2 little girls so he could hook up with some other chick.

The show is mostly a montage of clips of police videos, home movie clips, social media pictures and posts and snippets from txt messages and such.

What struck me was the txt and email dialogs between Shanann and her girlfriends as well as some of the exchanges between her and her soon to be killer.

Other than the murders, it was classic stuff you see here every day. Even murderers follow the playbook.

Her txts to her girlfriends show he was going cold and distant. He had gone from a horny lover to rejecting her advances for weeks at time.

He had gone from a doting father to not speaking to her or the kids for days on end when they were out of town visiting relatives.

When she’d press him for answers and would even ask him about another woman, he would completely DARVO and gaslight her and act like she was crazy.

She would want to address the issues and he would cut her off and tell her it was time for his workout.

Even when the police were interviewing him and telling him their suspicions based on his prior behaviors, including significant weight loss and preoccupation with fitness and changing his appearance, he would straight-faced deny any outside involvement.

One of the things that is kind of haunting me today is she would txt her GF about his change of behavior and that she suspected there was an OW and the GF would basically say, “oh no Honey! He would never do that!” The GF then encouraged her to get sexier and more assertive sexually and “..go get your freak on!”

When Shanann would txt her the next day and say that despite her best efforts he still rejected her and she spent the night crying, the GF still only offered platitudes and still rejected the notion of him cheating.

This was a young, fit, healthy, engaging man in his mid 30s with tattoos and tight shirts and Shanann was a beautiful, sexy and self-admittedly very horny woman and he was saying no thanks and rolling over to sleep - yeah right!!! If things don’t add up, they don’t add up.

The thing she kept telling the GF that the GF wasn’t registering was that this was completely out of character for him and for them as a couple. I got the impression from the txts that they used to be like rabbits and now he was suddenly stiff arming her at every pass.

I’m not trying to blame the GF at all, she was trying to be supportive and support the marriage as well as a listening ear to Shanann.

But I can’t help but think if Shanann had written to this forum, that people would have at least told her to listen to her gut and that the signs and red flags she was seeing were things to be taken seriously and she would have been told how to dig a little deeper and where and how to investigate for further evidence.

He was following the Handbook. The signs were there.

I know we get on each other that we may be too paranoid and a little too quick to say that someone is cheating, but when the signs are there, the signs are there and some of those signs are things that normal friends and family would brush off as “stress” and being too tired from work etc.

Maybe I’m feeling some kind of weird guilt that maybe she and the girls could have been saved if she had been tipped off sooner 😢

Has anyone else seen that show? What were your thoughts as you were watching it play out?
I mean, how would she have protected herself even if she did know he was cheating? It sounds like he came completely unhinged and killed them all. Maybe she did have proof and confronted him the day he killed them? The whole thing is so sick.
 

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She had been out of town for a sales meeting and got home around 2am as I recall. He killed her almost immediately, loaded her body with the two girls, who were alive, in the back of the truck and then drove to a remote site. He killed the girls there and put them in separate oil tanks. He buried her nearby. He originally said there was an argument and but she was tired and pregnant so he probably planned what he did. He also said in the beginning that she killed the kids so he killed her. He didn’t expect to be caught. They never do.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I mean, how would she have protected herself even if she did know he was cheating?
We will never know. There’s that and a million other unanswered questions.

In general I think people are always better off knowing the reality of the situation vs not knowing.

If you have knowledge you can always make decisions and have a chance.

If you are clueless, you are always a sitting duck at someone else’s mercy.
 

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By that, I hope you mean he is getting beaten and butt raped in prison regularly.
I don’t think he’s in GenPop. That very likely would happen if he were. Last I read he was reading the Bible and wanted to counsel people in a Christian way (whatever that means). And he has pictures of the girls in his cell and talks to them every day. That was one of the strangest family-annihilator cases I’ve followed. He seemed so very normal in all the videos and even if he decided he didn’t love his wife after his affair began he continued to always be so loving and protective toward the girls. Right up to the moment he killed them. All for some … whatever. Crazy.
 

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I don’t think he’s in GenPop. That very likely would happen if he were. Last I read he was reading the Bible and wanted to counsel people in a Christian way (whatever that means). And he has pictures of the girls in his cell and talks to them every day. That was one of the strangest family-annihilator cases I’ve followed. He seemed so very normal in all the videos and even if he decided he didn’t love his wife after his affair began he continued to always be so loving and protective toward the girls. Right up to the moment he killed them. All for some … whatever. Crazy.
Probably the play acting of a very nasty and dangerous psychopathic narcissist. He fooled everyone. He was never the nice person people thought he was.
 

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I’ve seen the show. And I think her personality was a little controlling, and a planner and he was more go with the flow and it was clear she was the boss in the marriage, and she wanted things her way. I get it, I am 100% like her. But what I’m trying to say, is that I think she knew there was someone else. And I think she was the type of person that should do anything to make her marriage work. So even if her gf told her he probably is cheating, I don’t think that would make her leave him.


The other thing that I noticed because I found myself to be a lot like her; and my exH was like the killer..: was that she came across brash and controlling, and he can’t across super nice and a saint to put up with her. Like a really nice guy. But the more I learn about the behaviors or people, I realized she had a loud bark and no bite. She’s scary, but harmless and sweet. But he has no bark, and a really bad bite. And to me, there is nothing worse. Throughout the whole time, he was telling her what she wanted to her, he was so sweet, always saying the right thing. But then he ACTED off. It really throws you for a mental loop. He was the typically super charming, tells people what they want to hear, liar. His red flags were hard to pick up on, until they were so obvious and too late.
 

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Another thing that struck me about the show was towards the end once it came out he killed her and the girls, Shanann’s family started receive hate mail and people were bashing her on forums and social media.

There were people saying she was the * and ball breaker and cause for their marital woes.

There are those that automatically blame the BS for not being nice enough or sexy enough etc but here was a beautiful, sexy woman wanting to have a love and sex life with her husband and now her children and watching him bury her body in the desert and then strangled one by one and their bodies discarded in petroleum tanks???

That’s a special kind of evil.

I guess the lay-public has a playbook of their own that wants to blame the victim as well
Welcome to being a women in a patriarchal society. Blaming the victim women isn’t new. I have seen time and time again people blaming rape victims for everything under the sun... what they wore, who they were with, how much they drank, how many previous sexual partners they had. It’s so sad.
 

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She had been out of town for a sales meeting and got home around 2am as I recall. He killed her almost immediately, loaded her body with the two girls, who were alive, in the back of the truck and then drove to a remote site. He killed the girls there and put them in separate oil tanks. He buried her nearby. He originally said there was an argument and but she was tired and pregnant so he probably planned what he did. He also said in the beginning that she killed the kids so he killed her. He didn’t expect to be caught. They never do.
Actually she came home, and they had sex then went to sleep. He killed her in the morning when he told her he was leaving her.
 

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Yeah, posters here do sometimes get jumped on when they "dare" to bring up the infidelity topic when someone is posting about their spouse being unloving or disengaged or suddenly wanting out of the relationship. There's a thread right now on General Relationships from a distraught woman whose husband suddenly blindsided her and told her he wants out and a poster in that thread got thumped for daring to bring up the possibility of infidelity.

I 100% agree with that poster (Diana) that the OP needs to consider that her husband is having an affair. I think she's going to eventually find out that Mr. Wonderful has a girlfriend and THAT'S why he's not sure if he wants to stay and go through IVF with her again, or hit the skids and run off to Unicorn Land with his girlfriend.
I believe this was me. The circumstances from this poster was completely different. I think a lot of people on this forum want to go scorched earth at the very beginning of suspected infidelity and the poster didn't say she was concerned. He was talking to his sister at the end of their street. I think a lot of the posters here have been cheated on and know the ins and outs but come on, the mind games for some are just horrible. Don't you notice that most posters don't reply or come back? Maybe we're just looking for a sympathetic ear. Not go get a VAR. I believe in not hiding from the truth but think about the situations before you say that crap.

And how do you know she didn't check this site out? Blaming the friend is beyond ludicrous. This is what I'm talking about. Can you imagine if you were that friend and read this?
 
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