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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I don't see this very often here on TAM, but if both you and your spouse have cheated (my situation), would you mind telling your story?

False R's?
Separated?
Quick divorce?
False R's - then a D?
Reconciling now?
Divorced and sad?
Divorced and happy?
Did you end up w/ your AP?
Was your's or your H/W's A discovered first?

A situation like this brings more to the table than "Kick the [email protected]/b!tch out", IMO...for instance, I'm willing to cut my W (maybe stbxW) some slack about her A, because I drew first blood.

While it makes great drama, this is a real cluster-fvck if you are involved. The dynamics of "double-dipping" (should I register that as a TAM acronym?), are such that most here on TAM simply can not fully comprehend.

Hopefully there are not many here dealing w/ this, but if you are in this situation, and are willing - please share your story.

Infidelity Articles By Katie Lersch » We Both Cheated. Now What?

*EDIT: BTW, I think there are some "betrayeds" here on TAM that have cheated in the past but will not admit it, because they now hold the "power" in the their marriage.
 

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I had an EA with a OM while my husband had an EA and PA. I was texting this OM about my marriage struggles as he was divorcing his wife. When I discovered my husband's A, I used this OM. I really had no interest other than revenge on my husband. I almost met up with OM.
Before I discovered my husband's A, I told my husband about all the conversations I had with OM. I knew in my heart my conversations were wrong. If one were to see the conversations, you would think we were just friends comparing our lives...but it felt wrong...and when one night my husband rolled his eyes because OM texted, I cut OM off. My moment of weakness was me discovering husband's A.
My OM is a father to my day care kids. I'm getting a new job, but have to rely on OM financially. It's been a mess.
My husband knows about all the texts and I gave him access to all my accounts. I was forthcoming about the EA even after I discovered husband's A. I've somewhat cut the OM out, but have 2 weeks until I start my new job. Every time OM picks up his kids, I ask that husband be here.
Husband and I are/were reconciling. I asked husband for passwords to everything yesterday because he said he would be an open book. Yet, it took him forever for the passwords, and he neglected to give me everything until after I asked for specifics. He didn't know I knew about all his social networkings. When I gained access, he deleted all his trash folders and all sent msgs. It was the straw for me. So I guess we were in false reconciliation!?!?!
I kicked him out yesterday. He has a serious addiction to porn and he kept saying he was embarrassed for me to see all the pics he had. So, I'm doing the 180. I've been more than open wth him, but he's obviously not ready.
I told his mother and step-father about the A a day after dday...but yesterday I told close family and friends about his porn addiction and the A. He has a hotel room...his family and friends are shocked. I think he's really embarrassed, but I still believe in reconciling. We have a new house that we can hardly afford, two kids (one year old and 10 year old), and I do believe we love each other. He's got some serious demons in his closet, however and I am to the point that I am ready to risk it all to save me from being unhappy. This is my second marriage.
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I would think you have a good chance at R - if that's what you want.

Of course, until his lack of true transparency is made right, you'll be spitting in the wind, imo.

Are both kids from this marriage?
 

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I would think you have a good chance at R - if that's what you want.

Of course, until his lack of true transparency is made right, you'll be spitting in the wind, imo.

Are both kids from this marriage?
I truly want to reconcile! I make decisions quickly, but feel like I need to make sure he understands he has to be transparent with me. I already know his faults, I just need him to accept them and let me help him. I know it's an addiction.

The 10 year old is from his previous relationship. I've been around for the last 5 years and my stepson's mother died 2 years ago. The baby is ours.
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We both cheated. My W EA (April '12 - present); My EA turned PA (June '12 - August '12). False R (May & June) - wife trickle truthed in which I used as an excuse to get close to a young lady I knew - Revenge?? I say False R because my W remained (still remaining) in contact with her OM and would not agree to transparency, MC, etc....
We are currently separated and most likely heading for D. My PA ended mutually. Since separation, I am not currently dating, just drinking with the guys. I don't want to say I am happy, I am not. I miss my daughter and MY home (SHOULD HAVE MADE HER MOVE OUT). I do not miss my W and her garbage.
OH, my W knows nothing of my A.
 

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It's a very interesting dynamic. Brings up a lot of "what if's".

Eg - OT: if you didn't have your affair, do you think your wife would have had hers? i.e. I know you kept yours hidden - so it wasn't a revenge affair by your wife. But is it possible that the emotional withdrawal may have been the catalyst for your wife to seek an AP?

Speculating further - is it possible that your wife had some form of affair BEFORE you - which led to YOUR seeking outside validation? Did you have any bad "gut feelings" before you began your affair, or was it simply a marriage that had grown apart?

I think I've posted before about the time I went through a period where I was not attracted to my wife. This was after we had kids (we waited 10 years before having children - 2 daughters) and lasted about 6 - 9 months. It seemed my wife was never happy, and it seemed like raising the kids was never fun together. I still hold a lot of resentment from that period too, because it seemed that no matter what I did, my stbxw was unhappy.

At that time, I spent a lot of time "in the basement" after the kids were in bed doing stuff in my office (sounds crazy, but at the time I was more politically involved and spent a lot of time blogging about Canadian politics on Canadian news websites). I would come to bed very, very late. At the time we still had sex, but it was less frequent (maybe once a week) and I just went through the motions. I never thought of cheating, but I DID wonder if I could continue with the marriage - it just seemed to have lost its spark and its fun. I know it was tough on my wife who was feeling unattractive (aging, post kids).

I remember one night where I just decided that I had to get out of the funk and started to look at my wife the way I used to. I managed to flick the switch back on, so to speak (over the period of a few months). I got her a gym membership for Pilates which she loved and it helped her mood too. As her mood improved, we improved. Our sex life went back to normal. In hindsight, I think my stbxw probably holds a lot of hurt/resentment for that period. I know we re-connected and it was good for a few more years - but in all honesty, it was never the same as before kids. Less footsie under the table. Fewer spontaneous hugs. Stupid pride and all neither of us was ever wrong - led to a few of heated arguments over the years. She just never seemed as involved as me with us or with the kids. Being ignorant, I just let it slide - thinking "we'll fix it later".

My wife has several times said (in the heat of an argument) that I wanted kids more than HER. So I think she resents the period where I "left her".

So maybe the effect on her was similar to an affair, but on a smaller scale. Maybe the scars from this period had an effect to make my stbxw care a little less when she started her EA?

ETA - added something in an new thread which I learned that may have added to my stbxw's resentment. Short version: I didn't get a vasectomy.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
It's a very interesting dynamic. Brings up a lot of "what if's".

Eg - OT: if you didn't have your affair, do you think your wife would have had hers? i.e. I know you kept yours hidden - so it wasn't a revenge affair by your wife. But is it possible that the emotional withdrawal may have been the catalyst for your wife to seek an AP?

If I had kept the lines of communication open between us, I think neither of us would've gone outside the marriage. That's the key. My withdrawal certainly precipitated her A, imo.


Speculating further - is it possible that your wife had some form of affair BEFORE you - which led to YOUR seeking outside validation? Did you have any bad "gut feelings" before you began your affair, or was it simply a marriage that had grown apart?

I have no reason to believe that she ever had an A. Frankly, my W has always been a challenge to love, but 5-6 years ago, her mood swings and hurtful things she said in anger seemed nonstop. I went from engaging her in arguments to taking a passive-aggressive route and just withdrew farther and farther. What I didn't know at the time (I don't think she realized it either), was that she was going through perimenopause, with the hormonal changes which can exacerbate an already volatile personality such as hers. I abandoned her at the time she needed me most. I just realized this in the last few months.

I think I've posted before about the time I went through a period where I was not attracted to my wife. This was after we had kids (we waited 10 years before having children - 2 daughters) and lasted about 6 - 9 months. It seemed my wife was never happy, and it seemed like raising the kids was never fun together. I still hold a lot of resentment from that period too, because it seemed that no matter what I did, my stbxw was unhappy.

We each had 3 kids from first marriages (3+3=6, lol). Before we married, we discussed my having a vasectomy, and I had it done shortly after we married. A couple of years later, she told someone in my presence that she had always wished we'd had a child together. I pressed her on this: "Why didn't you tell me you wanted another child? I wouldn't have had the V!" Her answer: "I thought I was pregnant when you had the vasectomy". Geez Louise :scratchhead:

At that time, I spent a lot of time "in the basement" after the kids were in bed doing stuff in my office (sounds crazy, but at the time I was more politically involved and spent a lot of time blogging about Canadian politics on Canadian news websites). I would come to bed very, very late. At the time we still had sex, but it was less frequent (maybe once a week) and I just went through the motions. I never thought of cheating, but I DID wonder if I could continue with the marriage - it just seemed to have lost its spark and its fun. I know it was tough on my wife who was feeling unattractive (aging, post kids).

Roughly 2 years before I began cheating, my W got into a hobby (raising, breeding and showing pedigreed animals), and she became consumed with it - seemed she never talked about anything else. She started going out of town to shows on weekends, and while I rationalized the reasons, her absence provided me w/ an opportunity to cheat. Never had any reason to believe she was cheating during her trips.


I remember one night where I just decided that I had to get out of the funk and started to look at my wife the way I used to. I managed to flick the switch back on, so to speak (over the period of a few months). I got her a gym membership for Pilates which she loved and it helped her mood too. As her mood improved, we improved. Our sex life went back to normal. In hindsight, I think my stbxw probably holds a lot of hurt/resentment for that period. I know we re-connected and it was good for a few more years - but in all honesty, it was never the same as before kids. Less footsie under the table. Fewer spontaneous hugs. Stupid pride and all neither of us was ever wrong - led to a few of heated arguments over the years. She just never seemed as involved as me with us or with the kids. Being ignorant, I just let it slide - thinking "we'll fix it later".

My AP and I had broken off our A about 3 months before I discovered my W's A, and I had been consciously trying to reconnect w/ her, w/o any success. I now know that she started her EA with him online about 2 years ago, and had already metup w/ OM a couple of times last year. Too little, too late.

My wife has several times said (in the heat of an argument) that I wanted kids more than HER. So I think she resents the period where I "left her".

No way to remember all the vitriol which has spewed forth from this woman's mouth - even before she got hormonal, lol. PMS around my house was a fvcking nightmare - the kids and I avouided her like the plague. She used to say: "PMS - the only time a woman can really be herself", and by god, she took full advantage of it.


So maybe the effect on her was similar to an affair, but on a smaller scale. Maybe the scars from this period had an effect to make my stbxw care a little less when she started her EA?

Far be it from me to venture a guess on what any woman is REALLY thinking - that's a recipe for disaster, imo.


ETA - added something in an new thread which I learned that may have added to my stbxw's resentment. Short version: I didn't get a vasectomy.


If you left the birth control up to her, I could understandably see that causing resentment on her part.
 

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I have no reason to believe that she ever had an A. Frankly, my W has always been a challenge to love, but 5-6 years ago, her mood swings and hurtful things she said in anger seemed nonstop. I went from engaging her in arguments to taking a passive-aggressive route and just withdrew farther and farther. What I didn't know at the time (I don't think she realized it either), was that she was going through perimenopause, with the hormonal changes which can exacerbate an already volatile personality such as hers. I abandoned her at the time she needed me most. I just realized this in the last few months.
.....


No way to remember all the vitriol which has spewed forth from this woman's mouth - even before she got hormonal, lol. PMS around my house was a fvcking nightmare - the kids and I avouided her like the plague. She used to say: "PMS - the only time a woman can really be herself", and by god, she took full advantage of it.
.....


If you left the birth control up to her, I could understandably see that causing resentment on her part.

You know, I never considered that my wife's problems could have been hormonal. I have always said that it's a classic MLC. But now that I think about it, the real problems started after she stopped breastfeeding. And I too didn't realize the depth of her unhappiness - maybe because my wife too, had horrible monthly PMS - which I used as an excuse to stay clear. And when she started going pre-menopausal, her periods got out of whack - so sometimes she'd be PMS'ing every two weeks. For my wife, it wasn't so much a short temper - but she would get horrible migraines - to the point that she could not function. I always nagged her to get a prescription for a migraine medication - but she never did and resented me for always suggesting it She would rather lie in a darkened room and be miserable.

Re: the birth control. I didn't get a vasectomy, but my wife went off the pill - so we used condoms for the last 4 or 5 years of our marriage.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Thanks for stopping in pidge.
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I had EA and my husband, I have learned from coming here, had an revenge EA... though he didn't appear to have revenge in mind. Dday was almost one year ago, and we are still together.
 

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I had an EA for about 8 months, it was starting to fizzle out on my end but my AP was so patient (gag) and convincing I didnt end it. At about the same time my H had met a new toxic friend at work and he started hanging out with him, met a relative of toxic friends girlfriend and started texting her. Anyhow led to him having a PA for about 6 weeks until I found out. So I flipped out we had our dday and about 2 days after dday, I had to admit my own EA. (He never caught me) He didnt even believe me at first.
Anyhow, I thought he was worse because his A was physical and mine was not. Now I know my own EA led to everything. :(
So 4 years later, we are pretty happily reconciled. Our marriage is 10Xs better then before. Our 25th anniversary is coming in June!!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Maricha and sunshine, glad to hear both of you are working throught it.
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Mine gets a little complex. My STBXW started her EA a month or so before I met a nurse who was running in a half marathon I was going to run (wife was supposed to run it too, so I payed it no mind). Wife gets hurt, misses the race, nurse at race chops it up with me. Uncomfortable, but nothing big...over the next week, nurse really begins to pursue and make obvious she may have the beginning of a thing for me. I accepts blame in this and come clean to my wife, although at this time, NO boundaries had been crossed other than it was obvious she liked me. Wife went off (although she had already started her EA and this is what she claims allowed her to push it to a PA, whatever)

After I found out about wife's EA/PA 4 months later, I stupidly allowed myself to be around my OW (hadn't seen her since breaking contact 4 months prior). Told myself it was good for the gander, so to speak. Really I was just out of my mind crushed (no excuse, but I was doing a lot of destructive things at that time, anger issues, drinking, picking fights, etc.)

Continued my EA for about a month. Wife found out, I came totally clean, let her read all texts, etc. most of the stuff centered around my broken marriage and how the OW couldn't believe how my wife had "thrown away such a good guy". That sort of stuff. I broke contact and sent NC letter without prompting. Arranged my schedule at work to never really have to see her again, offered to change jobs, move, etc.

Wife never gave up AP, found that out 3 more times before calling it. Every time anything ever came up, her response was "don't pretend to be perfect, you did your sh!t too!" I just got tired of never addressing my affair (she never wanted to talk about it), and her inability to leave her AP.

I was more than willing. She wasn't.
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My wife had an affair and I handled it well, or so I thought. I started drinking heavily, met -through a hobby group- a woman who I started an EA with which nearly resulted in unprotected sex, but I suddenly realised I was cheating on my wife and lost all desire to have sex with the OW. I confessed to my wife.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
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I had an online relationship that my W judges as an EA.
She had an EA/PA ongoing with an ex who she never ditched (he was married and had given her the shove off letter two years before but they continued).
We're about a year and a half into R, things keep developing and there is true remorse. We're going to make it, I think. We both want this relationship really bad. Only one kid, her from her first marriage, 23 and living with us.
 
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