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Whether it is a sex worker or your ex, my points on your choices still stand. It doesn't matter who it is. To hold it as a secret is wrong and cheating.



You're stuck in old world thinking. If you have done nothing wrong with regards to the children, then there is no basis for any court to deny you access to them. It becomes a matter of who has custody for what lengths of period. Many men are getting custody as women are these days. Dual custody is a valid option, especially if you both can manage to live in the same school district. Many people who are divorcing are realizing that they may not have been good spouses, but they can still be good parents and co-parent without being married or living together. Keep this in mind with regards to your children. They can end up suffering more and learning the wrong relationship behaviors from you two remaining married. Do you really want them to grow up to think that a sexless marriage is a valid working one, and copy the kind of marriage you and your wife currently have?
I understand what OP is saying. I can't bear to think about being away from my children for weeks at a time, even with equal time on custody. And aside from how common divorce is, I know my family will be so different if we split. It is literally two families. I am old school and don't believe in divorce. It isn't "just as good". It has to be sometimes, but I think making it work is best. You can hate on it, but family values developed for a reason.
 

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As has been mentioned OP, we've seen a few stories where a dead bedroom is because the uninterested spouse is getting laid elsewhere.

Another story where the uninterested wife had contracted herpes thru an affair, and cut off her husband because her infidelity would be discovered if she then had sex with him.

Desperate times, might be worth hiring a PI to find out if she's having an affair.
 

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Your wife's behavior is highly unusual for a faithful spouse, but not unusual for a cheater. You have to think about the statistics of that.

Have a good look at phone records, her phone itself, etc.

If she isn't cheating and you plan to stay married.... maybe she won't care if you openly (with permission) see others since she has no plans of having sex with you. This is not a healthy example for your kids to model.....

Right now you are co-parents and roomates.... I don't see why you couldn't continue to co-parent and divorce.
 

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I understand what OP is saying. I can't bear to think about being away from my children for weeks at a time, even with equal time on custody. And aside from how common divorce is, I know my family will be so different if we split. It is literally two families. I am old school and don't believe in divorce. It isn't "just as good". It has to be sometimes, but I think making it work is best. You can hate on it, but family values developed for a reason.
Staying in a sexless, passionless, unfulfilling, potentially adulterous marriage out of fear of disrupting the fragile children’s family structure (and probably just fear of the unknown) - is NOT family values.
Weakness, passiveness, conflict avoidance and sneaking off to get unmet needs sort of met on the side - is not family values.
 

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She just told me that she loved me but wasn’t willing to discuss it.
But see, that is the thing. She does not love you. A partner who claims to love his/her partner would not refuse them sex for no justifiable reason. Love is an action as well as a verb, and she has not shown you any real love for the entirety of your marriage.
 

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@MassDaddy

Being a virgin before marriage does NOT suggests that the person is sex-averse. People masterbate for a reason.

Both me and my wife were virgin(s) before marriage by choice, and due to our religious convictions as well. But WE are NOT sex-averse. My wife welcomes intimacy.

Sex-aversion could be due to medical problems, or trauma, or questionable past.

You should try your best to figure out that your wife is absolutely faithful to you, and honest with you. This is important for you to move forward and make a decision about shaping your future.

Try to reach out to your wife's college friends for information (if any). These people might have revelations for you. Also, hire a PI (Private Investigator) to keep tabs on your wife to see if she is clean.

As for your EX, this is not a good time for you to be in touch with her. You are emotionally vulnerable and will end up doing much more harm than good by engaging with her. You have marital problems to address.

So get to work and provide an update about what more you could learn about your wife.
 

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To have and to hold. If you can't hold, is it a marriage? What you have is a long term unhealthy relationship which will wear you down.

Your ex or any other vessel can comfort you, but it's still unhealthy. Best option is to go through the hassle to live separately, and go from there. The option to remain in limbo could take years off of your life.

T. C. B.
Begin again, live a new life.
 

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My wife is steadfast in her refusal to discuss her reasons for not having sex. I’ve literally tried talking to her for the last 12 years about it. She has gotten up and left the room. I sent her a letter in the mail to impress upon her the importance of it. She just told me that she loved me but wasn’t willing to discuss it.

my sense is she is well aware she can’t justify her behavior towards me and therefore won’t discuss it. She just said on a few occasions in the past four years that based on my attitude I didn’t deserve sex. She refused to be specific. Will she ever have sex with me again? How could I know that?
This is a very disturbed woman. Something very wrong with her, perhaps stemming from some type of sexual abuse.
You have tried very hard to address this problem but are banging your head against a wall. Not much you can do. She is just too closed off. Consider divorce.
 

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OK, let's all break this down and talk about this a little more in depth.

Her saying he's nice enough to have sex with him is one of two things -

One is that he is the A-hole and is a drunkard and abusive and neglectful and nasty.

The other is that he is spineless simp that spends his days chasing his tail trying to appease her and make her happy and like Lucy pulling the football away from Charlie Brown every time she has him convinced she'll play nice, he can never seem to appease her enough and she just wants more.

So let's look at what information we have starting with the fact that they haven't had sex in 6 years and she has her heels dug in that she will NOT be entertaining that idea. Would an A-hole go 6 years without sex???

He says he has "asked" for sex many times but she says no. Do A-holes "ask" for sex?

They have been married for 17 years and the sex has never been good. Do A-holes stick around for 17 years with bad sex?

The way he has clung on to hope that this ex wants to bang him, leads me to believe he has not cheated before or has only done so very rarely in the distant past if at all. Would an A-hole have gone 11 years of bad sex and 6 years of no sex without getting some tail elsewhere?

He is questioning whether the ex has an agenda and is questioning whether this would even be cheating or not. Would an A-hole question the morality and would an A-hole even question her motives or not??

And would an A-hole even take the time and effort to write to a marriage and relationship forum about the intentions of an ex contacting him and the ethics of getting with her, or would an A-hole have had her legs over his shoulders within days of her contacting him if that was her intent??????

So when she says he needs to be "nicer", what does she really mean? Does she mean he needs to stop coming home from the bar and pushing her around and quit picking up bar flies for BJs in the parking lot and at least picking up a jug of milk on his way home where there is no food in the house?

Or does it mean he's not picking the blades of grass out of the cracks in the sidewalk the way she wants him to and he doesn't tuck his shoelaces in his shoes the closet the way she showed him time and time again??
The OP needs to find out why his marriage became dead. he can go have an affair, but the assholery (assuming he is an Ahole, using your words above) will continue and he may get some temporary sex but if he wants a relationship with another person after divorce, he needs to sort our his 'assholery' as other women are unlikely to want to sleep with him either. OP why does your wife say you are not good to her?

I am in the same position, I moved out of the bedroom and have not slept with H for over a year cause he was treating me like **** with his drinking and constant let downs. He has bemoaned the fact but for me enough was enough. Now I am at the point of indifference. He is a weak selfish man who doesn't have the backbone to change, so be it. I wont put up with his walking over my boundaries. Some men treat their wives like **** and think they can do that forever without consequences. I never wanted to lose my marriage, but will no longer be a martyr. Current living arrangements suit me for now. I have thought about cheating, opportunities have been there but will not. He refuses to communicate about anything, so fine with me, we live like passing ships. I am no longer emotionally bonded to him as a result of leaving the bedroom, it hurt like hell initially, all the trauma but now I am free though we still live in the same house. It took a long long time of detaching for me to get to this point and I am happier than I have ever been.
So OP, my advice is to sort yourself out first. Be a man your wife admires and wants to make love to instead of blame shifting and looking for tail elsewhere. It makes you look like a loser and a man of no character. Have you actually talked to your wife about her concerns, are her concerns valid? What steps have you taken to resolve the issues?
 

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Answering some questions:

my wife thought marriage would be a little different. She thought she was marrying a guy just like her father- who’s a very good guy. I like him. he’s always good to me and my kids. I’m different than him.

the four kids are little and require hard work. She is a great mother and I’m a good father. She says I could do more around the house. We have argued. Never anything violent just a few unkind words.

we never had sex prior to marriage. She was a bit resistant to sex on honeymoon but she said yes twice. During our first year of marriage she refused to have sex for a six month period. Her reason was that it didn’t feel good - physical problems. She refused to do anything about it (never saw a doctor). she sort a of raised that as a reason not to have sex for a few years on occasion but on other occasions cited other reasons. For a few years we had sex about 5-10 times. She instigated it twice during our marriage when she wanted children

On the few occasions we had sex she’d jokingly make fun of me just a little the next day. She hates any type of foreplay and absolutely refuses to discuss our sex life. in 17 years she’s never been willing to discuss it at length at all .

I suggested marriage counseling but she said we should only talk to her parents about our marriage or a close friend of theirs. I don’t want that.

A good friend of mine describes me as a great father and a good husband - but not great. He describes my wife as an amazing mother but disinterested wife. She’s extremely well liked and always very kind to others. My friend Said I’m an A father, B husband. Says she’s an A+ mom, C/D wife. Everyone we know loves her.

Prior to marriage I had several long term girlfriends. Very healthy relationships with excellent sex. They just weren’t the ones. As I said my wife never had a boyfriend but no premarital intercourse. she had no real dating life. she’d fool around with guys that were interested in her but zero sex. The odd part is guys didn’t ask her on dates. Only hook ups. She has always had many friends and makes them very easily.
Sounds like your wife has issues surrounding sex, is there a very strict religious upbringing or CSA involved? Maybe time to investigate?
 

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The OP needs to find out why his marriage became dead. he can go have an affair, but the assholery (assuming he is an Ahole, using your words above) will continue and he may get some temporary sex but if he wants a relationship with another person after divorce, he needs to sort our his 'assholery' as other women are unlikely to want to sleep with him either. OP why does your wife say you are not good to her?

I am in the same position, I moved out of the bedroom and have not slept with H for over a year cause he was treating me like ** with his drinking and constant let downs. He has bemoaned the fact but for me enough was enough. Now I am at the point of indifference. He is a weak selfish man who doesn't have the backbone to change, so be it. I wont put up with his walking over my boundaries. Some men treat their wives like ** and think they can do that forever without consequences. I never wanted to lose my marriage, but will no longer be a martyr. Current living arrangements suit me for now. I have thought about cheating, opportunities have been there but will not. He refuses to communicate about anything, so fine with me, we live like passing ships. I am no longer emotionally bonded to him as a result of leaving the bedroom, it hurt like hell initially, all the trauma but now I am free though we still live in the same house. It took a long long time of detaching for me to get to this point and I am happier than I have ever been.
So OP, my advice is to sort yourself out first. Be a man your wife admires and wants to make love to instead of blame shifting and looking for tail elsewhere. It makes you look like a loser and a man of no character. Have you actually talked to your wife about her concerns, are her concerns valid? What steps have you taken to resolve the issues?
I do not think we can assume this man behaves like your husband. His posts sound reasonable and his attempts to discuss the issue seem sincere and non-threatening. His wife, OTOH, is just shutting down any attempt to have a meaningful discussion, summarily.
Some wives, BTW, treat their husbands like crap.
 

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I do not think we can assume this man behaves like your husband. His posts sound reasonable and his attempts to discuss the issue seem sincere and non-threatening. His wife, OTOH, is just shutting down any attempt to have a meaningful discussion, summarily.
Some wives, BTW, treat their husbands like crap.
Agreed, men and women can be equally cruel and treat spouses badly.
If you had read my post, it was clear in the opening paragraph that he being an asshole is an assumption (to follow on from an earlier post by @oldshirt , 2 assumptions, (he was bad to her or he was not bad to her).
I never suggested he was bad to her. I simply said in my own case my H is an AH hence my own response.
We also cannot assume that the man has not treated his wife badly either which is what you are doing. People come on here and don't always give the full picture. Hence I agree and followed on from @oldshirt 's post on the possible scenarios. Did you read that post?
 

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Agreed, men and women can be equally cruel and treat spouses badly.
If you had read my post, it was clear in the opening paragraph that he being an asshole is an assumption (to follow on from an earlier post by @oldshirt , 2 assumptions, (he was bad to her or he was not bad to her).
I never suggested he was bad to her. I simply said in my own case my H is an AH hence my own response.
We also cannot assume that the man has not treated his wife badly either which is what you are doing. People come on here and don't always give the full picture. Hence I agree and followed on from @oldshirt 's post on the possible scenarios. Did you read that post?
Yes, we really do not know.
 

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Discussion Starter · #115 ·
The OP needs to find out why his marriage became dead. he can go have an affair, but the assholery (assuming he is an Ahole, using your words above) will continue and he may get some temporary sex but if he wants a relationship with another person after divorce, he needs to sort our his 'assholery' as other women are unlikely to want to sleep with him either. OP why does your wife say you are not good to her?

I am in the same position, I moved out of the bedroom and have not slept with H for over a year cause he was treating me like ** with his drinking and constant let downs. He has bemoaned the fact but for me enough was enough. Now I am at the point of indifference. He is a weak selfish man who doesn't have the backbone to change, so be it. I wont put up with his walking over my boundaries. Some men treat their wives like ** and think they can do that forever without consequences. I never wanted to lose my marriage, but will no longer be a martyr. Current living arrangements suit me for now. I have thought about cheating, opportunities have been there but will not. He refuses to communicate about anything, so fine with me, we live like passing ships. I am no longer emotionally bonded to him as a result of leaving the bedroom, it hurt like hell initially, all the trauma but now I am free though we still live in the same house. It took a long long time of detaching for me to get to this point and I am happier than I have ever been.
So OP, my advice is to sort yourself out first. Be a man your wife admires and wants to make love to instead of blame shifting and looking for tail elsewhere. It makes you look like a loser and a man of no character. Have you actually talked to your wife about her concerns, are her concerns valid? What steps have you taken to resolve the issues?
Very interesting thoughts. It’s hard to honestly self examine. My wife told me many years ago that at no point in her life has she been interested in sexual intercourse with any person. She never masturbated and is extremely religious. She used to hook up with random men at weddings prior to meeting me but refused sex. She never had a boyfriend before me.

I have endured numerous set backs in my life but she has never comforted me. She told me that I should see a psychotherapist if I need guidance and encourages me to take medications. I have been resentful in recent years. She really doesn’t care.

the one thing I haven’t been able to eliminate is to possibility wife is gay. To a very religious person, homosexuality is worse than being a felon. It’s the ultimate sin. She has never indicated any interest in another woman. I noticed a few women flirt with her over the years. She didn’t reciprocate. But her being gay would literally explain everything.

as for cheating, I’d be more open to the possibility if I didn’t personally experience her complete lack of interest in sex at all times since we first began dating. As odd as it seems. I’d prefer her to be cheating, because it would prove she is capable of se and intimacy.

I think the reason she married me is because she had no options and she wanted family and friends to see she could find a husband.
 

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Very interesting thoughts. It’s hard to honestly self examine. My wife told me many years ago that at no point in her life has she been interested in sexual intercourse with any person. She never masturbated and is extremely religious. She used to hook up with random men at weddings prior to meeting me but refused sex. She never had a boyfriend before me.

I have endured numerous set backs in my life but she has never comforted me. She told me that I should see a psychotherapist if I need guidance and encourages me to take medications. I have been resentful in recent years. She really doesn’t care.

the one thing I haven’t been able to eliminate is to possibility wife is gay. To a very religious person, homosexuality is worse than being a felon. It’s the ultimate sin. She has never indicated any interest in another woman. I noticed a few women flirt with her over the years. She didn’t reciprocate. But her being gay would literally explain everything.

as for cheating, I’d be more open to the possibility if I didn’t personally experience her complete lack of interest in sex at all times since we first began dating. As odd as it seems. I’d prefer her to be cheating, because it would prove she is capable of se and intimacy.

I think the reason she married me is because she had no options and she wanted family and friends to see she could find a husband.
You might want to read Dr Minwalla’s work about the Secret Sexual Basement. Your wife’s past might not be as she says. She may hcreated a false narrative that fits whom she wished to be, something consistent with her beliefs and different from her actions. My wife had two entirely different sides to her, an evening with boys and day as a conservative Christian. No close friends to confide in so she never came to terms with it. 45 years claimed to not have had sex prior to me, only to discover I was #3, maybe #5, who knows. And she has resented sex since, we’ll, the first time. I married her partly out of guilt for taking her virginity.

Random hook-ups with men at weddings? There could be more to that than you believe.

Oh. Almost forgot this. My wife also said she “fooled around with a bunch of guys but never had sex.” Even described herself as a tease before we married.

Your wife could be gas-lighting you big-time, to preserve her preferred image of herself. It may have nothing to do with you.
 

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I knew someone years ago who had his stereo system stolen from his car.

His solution was to break into the car of someone else and steal their stereo system.
I had forgotten about things like that ,
 
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