[2ntnuf]

This is where I think knowing human nature and avoiding PC views is needed. We know one way to avoid falling in love with a co-worker is to not allow the interaction to become even slightly inappropriate. We know (I think) that many women who have lost respect for their husbands can't really control the innate feelings and are resentful. It reiterates that having boundaries, being respectable, and being respectful, also create a fog. A good fog so to speak where those chemicals tell your spouse they want to be with you.

But we are not "Affair Proofing" our marriage. We are making it less likely that an affair will happen. Also, that "good fog" must clear to allow us to make the best decisions possible about whether or not to marry someone. It has been stated on here many times by much respected, knowledgeable folks.

I am agreeing with you in part as I have done with others in this thread. I am not disputing that we need the tools or that the tools are good or that they help to make a marriage less prone to affairs. What I am saying is this, no marriage is "affair proof", not even with the best of tools and the smartest folks.

 

[2ntnuf]

Here is an excellent thread on this phenomenon ...explaining this "FOG"...these hormonal chemicals that can overtake.....

.

Never and always are absolutes which are inherently lies. I am not calling you a liar. I believe you are one of the most honorable women on this forum and absolutely love your posts. Especially since I have tested myself with one of your tests and found myself to be a romantic like yourself with similar love languages. I do my very best to avoid those words and if I have used one of them in this thread, I am not aware of it and I hereby apologize.

 

[Thundarr]

I am not disputing that we need the tools or that the tools are good or that they help to make a marriage less prone to affairs. What I am saying is this, no marriage is "affair proof", not even with the best of tools and the smartest folks.

:iagree:
You are correct that affair proof is not absolute. There's no recipe to eliminate the possibility. Just things to minimize.

 

[2ntnuf]

Affairproofing - Is it REALLY possible?

My answer is, NO. The fog will lift and you will see my answer as true.

 

[Shadow_Nirvana]

NO.

Hmmm, okay yeah I guess, that is true.:smthumbup:

So what about the MMSL and such to make a passionate marriage? Do the effects of passion wear off after a while?

 

[2ntnuf]

Affairproofing - Is it REALLY possible?

My answer is, NO. The fog will lift and you will see my answer as true.

Hmmm, okay yeah I guess, that is true.:smthumbup:

So what about the MMSL and such to make a passionate marriage? Do the effects of passion wear off after a while?

Sorry, Shadow I can't speak about that book. Passions change. I just examine my own life to know this. Seems like about every seven to ten years my passions change. I wish you the best with your quest.

 

[2ntnuf]

I guess we have a lot in common then - being the way I am, I think being single would be pure torture. I know you are divorced right now. I hope you will find someone who will be honorable and true to compliment your gifts & be compatible with your desires in life.

I am not sure what "words" you are talking about. I agree that we can only "minimize an affair" by choosing very wisely who we attach ourselves too.

Let me give my Dad for example... He was like me -he didn't HIDE anything, but he did "cheat" on my mom...I call it cheating because he was STILL MARRIED.....

Why - because she didn't like sex, she wasn't attracted to him...they married too young, had virtually NOTHING in common whatsoever, he was being lustful, she was niave, noone counted the cost of that trainwreck. I remember the fights as a little girl.

He slept with her best friend...they never hid it and got a divorce quicky...she didn't want him anyway ...so no big deal.

Do I think my father is the scum of the earth... No, I do not. I am just like the man... I am nothing like my mother and if I was my dad... I would have left her anyway.

Him & my step mother were made for each other...grand love story....even though I was a casualty of that... He never wanted another after her....and he, too, was the apple of her eye, I watched her tear up in a hospital waiting room telling me how he was the love of her life...could never love another man....I even started balling... And I used to hate her !

2 Pure Romantics those 2 are... I think that works best of all. But I am kinda biased.

I certainly do not know what you are referring to here, SA. I am sure you are trying to make a point. So, rather than derailing this thread, if you want to discuss anything further, just pm me or start another thread about whatever point you are trying to make. I am more than willing to discuss your thoughts, but not here. I am leaving this thread now since I am not able to help with anything about MMSL.

 

[gbrad]

Yeah, okay but there is the fact that when it happens later on in life, there goes your whole life with everything you believed in out the window.

Changes happen in life all of the time. Things in life happen for a reason. If someone has an affair, there is usually a reason. maybe afterwards the marriage can survive and get better, maybe it ends.

 

[SimplyAmorous]

I certainly do not know what you are referring to here, SA. I am sure you are trying to make a point. So, rather than derailing this thread, if you want to discuss anything further, just pm me or start another thread about whatever point you are trying to make. I am more than willing to discuss your thoughts, but not here. I am leaving this thread now since I am not able to help with anything about MMSL.

No important anything....just giving an example of an affair ....not that there isn't enough examples here. I know for my parents, they weren't compatible...like...at all. It didn't play out well.

I didn't mention anything about MMSL. No important point -other than - it happens and I think it can happen to "good people" even. Others may not agree with that... but that's ok.

I deleted my post.

 

[gbrad]

Yes there is a way to affair proof a marriage. I honestly believe this. It take two strong, emotionally intelligent people.

If I ever get married again I would insist that before marriage we work through the Marriage Builder material for building a passionate and affair proofed marriage. I’d also insist on the going to one of the MB weekends for engrain the lessons into hour pea brains.

In the USA today people have few good models to follow on how to have a healthy, lasting marriage. The dynamics of marriage have changed from the old days when divorce was not acceptable and people stayed together despite abuse, the husband’s infidelities, etc. The wife is no longer ruled by her husband. Today the married couple are equal partners. This change in society and marriage has only been around for a few decades. And people just do not know how to live within this model of marriage. So we have huge divorce and infidelity rates.

I have links in my signature block to the Marriage Builder’s material. There is more on their website and of course their books are all for sale on Amazon where you can buy used ones for very little so it’s not expensive. (No I do not work for MB I just really like their approach.)

ETA: 2ntnuf is right, the above does not 100% affair proof a marriage. But I do believe that they seriously reduce the possibility of an affair.

Some people are so broken that they will cheat no matter what. It's just part of who they are.

And if I ever get married again (still married) it will be to someone who I am with that the relationship is not that much work. That being together and enjoying one another is just easy and natural. The compatability will just work. I have seen relationships like this and that is what I hope for.

 

[Thundarr]

Changes happen in life all of the time. Things in life happen for a reason. If someone has an affair, there is usually a reason. maybe afterwards the marriage can survive and get better, maybe it ends.

You'll likely find people in this thread who would like to have a strong healthy marriage and who think they can actually make a difference in that regard. The woe is me whatever happens happens dribble gets people nowhere.

 

[gbrad]

You'll likely find people in this thread who would like to have a strong healthy marriage and who think they can actually make a difference in that regard. The woe is me whatever happens happens dribble gets people nowhere.

I never said woe is me what happens happens. I am all for creating a strong and healthy marriage for those who can do that. When I said things happen in life, I didn't mean woe is me.
Things happen in life, that doesn't mean woe, that just means you deal with it.

 

[Shadow_Nirvana]

I never said woe is me what happens happens. I am all for creating a strong and healthy marriage for those who can do that. When I said things happen in life, I didn't mean woe is me.
Things happen in life, that doesn't mean woe, that just means you deal with it.

Okay, yeah but we already get that, so basically you are just saying the basics of what should be and frankly it's not really helpful.

 

[RandomDude]

You can't affair proof a marriage but you can try divorce-proofing which is something I neglected when I got married

Now I stand to either lose my business or my house. And I just hope my wife doesn't fight me for my business if we ever do decide that divorce is the best option for us.

 

[Faithful Wife]

My H and I use our version of the Marriage Builders program, and we do feel we are specifically affair proofing our marriage as much as is possible. It feels great, actually!

Their plan is simple but very complex to execute. It was so worth it to us, however.

They start by teaching you the basic premise that to have a lasting monogamous happy marriage, you need to stay romantically in love. So they give you a bunch of new ideas to work on, where you learn how and why a couple become (and stay) romantically in love. You also learn why couples fall OUT of romantic love. Then you learn what behaviors you both should do (and not do) that helps keep you romantically in love with your spouse. Mostly this has to do with fulfilling each other's emotional needs, but there is a lot more to it. I found the reading material somewhat hard to get through, but once I understood the concepts I started really flashing through it all easily.

Then you surround your marriage with strong boundaries that basically say "no other may fulfill my emotional needs".

Some of the behaviors of enforcing these boundaries are things like:

No friends of OS.

No GNO/BNO.

No hidden emails, phone numbers, other accounts.

No same sex friendships with toxic friends.

No telling anyone of the OS about marriage problems.

Those are just some examples of tight boundary enforcement. My husband and I are not 100% tight on the OS friendships and GNO/BNO. We both do have some totally safe OS friends, and we have totally safe same sex friends for GNO/BNO. But other than that, we are pretty strict in these areas.

We do not pick up "new" friends of either sex, here and there. We have a pretty tight grip on outside influence of any kind. We each have several long term friends and some acquaintances, but we aren't looking to add more friends. We do not go out and drink in bars with our friends of either sex (without each other), as it is simply not a good healthy marriage activity, we feel.

We remain deliberately focused on each other, and refuse to even acknolwedge advances of others. We treat each other with the highest regard and respect.

Because we learned the Marriage Builders concepts and plans together, we still talk about how we are deliberately protecting our boundaries, so there are no questions about it. We even "check in" once in awhile with each other by one of us looking sternly into the others' eyes and saying "you know I'm gonna check up on you if I feel I need to, right?" and the other will reply "of course, and the same for you, but I invite you to check out anything I do or say at all because I am all about you and have literally nothing to hide". Then we smooch and remark about how good it feels to know we are each doing our part to keep those boundaries shut tight.

It makes me swoon, actually...the individual acts of self-discipline involved in keeping these tight boundaries that we both have to execute really do keep the romance burning.

 

[gbrad]

Okay, yeah but we already get that, so basically you are just saying the basics of what should be and frankly it's not really helpful.

Not exactly sure what you meant there. I'm saying that people shouldn't go to extra lengths to try and prevent affairs. The work and choices to affair proof shouldn't happen. If an affair is meant to happen, then it is meant to happen. Maybe its not. But you shouldn't go to lengths to prevent something that you don't even know if will happen or not. And even it does, maybe it was meant to.
That is all I am trying to say.

 

[gbrad]

Faithfulwife.....those are some of the reasons why those people over at MB are crazy.

 

[SimplyAmorous]

They start by teaching you the basic premise that to have a lasting monogamous happy marriage, you need to stay romantically in love. So they give you a bunch of new ideas to work on, where you learn how and why a couple become (and stay) romantically in love. You also learn why couples fall OUT of romantic love. Then you learn what behaviors you both should do (and not do) that helps keep you romantically in love with your spouse. Mostly this has to do with fulfilling each other's emotional needs

I sure agree with all of this :smthumbup: Gotta keep the Romance Aflame.

Thought I'd throw some articles on this here >>

Keeping the Fire Alive in Your Marriage

14 Ways to Keep Romance Alive

Little Things to Keep the Romance Alive after Marriage and Kids

How to Keep Love Alive: 12 Principles for Nurturing Love in Your Marriage

Before I landed on TAM, I can't recall us ever having 1 discussion on "boundaries" with the opposite sex...it's just been something written on our hearts... We've always been very close/ Best friends who jump & share all with each other.....generally where he is.... I am... .where I am, there he is ! We do near everything together...that's what makes us happy. We've joked we Enjoy "the ball & chain."

I never even cared for Girls Night Out, not my thing. He never cared to hang with the guys. So these things never needed any limit or boundary talk. Though we've done it on occasion...if we could, we'd probably bring each other!

All of our Opposite sex friends are equally BOTH our friends, none has ever disrespected that -though we've always been careful who we befriend or allow to our house... He has never cared if I talk to them on the phone, or whatnot. We have opposite sex friends on Facebook, it's never been an issue.

Some may feel that is too much freedom...and maybe it IS for their marriage... but it hasn't been for ours. Where I feel we shine is in a willing giving Transparency with each other.....it is just something that has always BEEN... it is like breathing to us... can I say this is a large part of our "Affair Proofing"...

No matter who I talk too, or what about (If it is interesting, a little "juicy").... he gets an earful ....and it goes that way on his end as well. But yet.. we do have freedom here. He doesn't have to worry if he runs into some woman Out & about & starts a conversation with her (even if an old GF)... he can easily tell me all about it, I am not going to take his head off & think "OMG, why did you do that, are you interested in her?". This would never even enter my mind.

So our craving for "togetherness".... Keeping the Romance Alive...lots of emotionally bonding

...& our steadfast belief in sharing ALL with each other... is what works for us. We do not believe in any secrets in Marriage.

 

[Enchanted]

Affair proofing begins with the self. First, think about everything you love about your spouse and spend time everyday appreciating all that they are and everything they've done for you. If you do that everyday then you won't have too much need to look elsewhere.

"If I ever go looking for my heart's desire again, I won't look any further than my own back yard. Because if it isn't there, I never really lost it to begin with." - Dorothy Gale