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Which Sexual Views Best Describe your way of Loving/ Living ...

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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
So often in life & open forums...we come up against Sexual viewpoints we do not share ...Yes, we are married now... but this subject still comes up... we may struggle to be understood, our views may offend others/ there's offend us....this is an attempt to explain these differences....

It is GOOD to Understand where another is coming from...their foundation if you will.....not to belittle them or put them down - but show "tolerance" (so long as their "sexing" is not hurting others)....it also helps to seek out another who views these things through a similar Lens ....less misunderstandings/hurt in the greatest gift of Pleasure any of us have ever experienced. .

*** Human sexuality can be viewed from 6 perspectives orlenses,” says Dr. Caroline J. Simon, professor of philosophy at Hope College, in Holland, MI. In more than 20 years of teaching classes in sexual ethics, she noticed that most textbooks described only two of them. She has broken these down (below) ....further explanation in her book >>
Bringing Sex into Focus: The Quest for Sexual Integrity .....

“Rival views of how sex matters in our pluralistic society often mean that there are few shared understandings, conventions or rules of engagement,” she says. “It is little wonder that there is so much pain arising from misunderstanding & so many disappointed expectations in the sexual realm.”

1. Covenantal View ~ "Become one flesh". : Sex forges a permanent bond between 2 people...a representation of God’s covenantal relationship, it is a life-uniting act.. the Becoming of "one flesh" meant for marriage only.... to take sex lightly is not only disloyal to one’s spouse but also an affront to God... why the Traditional Wedding ceremony contains the words, “What God has joined together, let no man put asunder.”

2. Procreative View ~ "Be Fruitful & multiply" :The purpose of sex is to produce children...Thus sex must be heterosexual, genital & “embrace the hope of fruitfulness.” Also acknowledges that sexual relations that lack present enjoyment would hamper the marriage bond - whether they conceive or not.

3. Romantic View ~ "save yourself for the one, your beloved"
Sex should be reserved for those who are deeply in love with the strings of emotional attachment/commitment. Loveless sex is not appropriate, People should be sexually faithful as long as love lasts. Those who hold the romantic view often talk in terms of sex as sacred, as a Gift to be preserved & given to someone of profound significance.

Romantic view holds that sex should be connected with a thirst for deep psychological & bodily knowledge, Mutually reciprocated gift-giving & intimacy are it's purpose.

The feeling of being in love is a feeling that one’s beloved is an irreplaceable soul mate.

Complications arise, however, when romantic feelings do not last or when someone who has made a commitment to sexual exclusivity finds himself or herself in love with someone else.

The romantic view emphasizes interpersonal intimacy, but sees the duration of commitment as contingent. Commitment lasts for as long as romantic love lasts. But commitment is a must. A one-time encounter with a stranger may be consensual -but it would not be appropriate for those who hold the Romantic view.

4. "Plain Sex" view~ "just enjoy it for what it is".... Cultural constructs linking love & sex are outmoded: Sexual desire is an acute bodily desire for physical contact with another. Sex is an intensely pleasurable physical activity. Sex should be based on mutual consent leading to mutual sexual satisfaction, so that “noone gets hurt.”

In the 1970's, Alan Goldman , penned an article entitled “Plain Sex” -speaking of the times reliable & convenient birth control & undermined any link between sex & commitment.
With the practice of “safe sex,” recreational sex began to seem appropriate between consenting adults. Throughout history...many seen sex "for pleasure alone" ... but before reliable contraception such people were widely viewed as irresponsible libertines and gigolos, if male, and for females, the word even worse.

This view claims feels the above views are outdated, no longer do we need to link Love & sex..... Sexuality is now best seen as simply an acute physical desire for an intensely pleasurable physical activity that naturally leads to engaging in bodily exploration.

This view puts its emphasis on mutual consent/ mutual consideration leading to mutual satisfaction. When “no one gets hurt” and each party gets what he or she wants, plain sex appears to avoid lots of problems.

5. Power View ~ Sexuality is a potent instrument for controlling others/ sex wields power". ... Sexual desire is the desire to possess another, while wanting to avoid being objectified by the other. One must be savvy to the potential for sexual exploitation, manipulation and violence (in it's rawest forms).

Sexuality is seen as "energy", as a force, Sexual interaction lays us bare & can strip us of control as we surrender to desire. Knowing oneself as a being who commands another’s sexual attention is invigorating / experiencing oneself as sexually attractive is enlivening. Yet this power is fragile & leaves you at the mercy of another's way of seeing - when I become a “sex object,” someone else decides whether I am valued, set aside, desired or dismissed.

In order to seize control & not be controlled, I need to objectify my sexual “partner” (in thought or by actions) before my sexual “partner” can objectify me... “Partner” becomes a misnomer because the mutuality of such encounters is mutual rivalry in a contest over power.

Self-Protection is vital here...one must enter into sexual relationships with one’s eyes wide open, savvy about the potential for exploitation & manipulation, taking care to preserve one’s own dignity by not being the victim of another’s conscious or unconscious exertions of power.

6. Expressive View~ "a form of self expression"...Sex is a source of personal empowerment that is central to human flourishing. Sexual restraint is unnatural but sexuality should be used without hampering the empowerment of others

Sexual expression garners creative power. Writer Sally Tinsdale voices a modest version of this view saying .... “Sex can help us to like ourselves and find a generosity of spirit, open ourselves to the world and simply be alive".... another calls it "body language".....

Another says ..."I believe that the celebration of the erotic & of our desire to express it sexually ought to be a major issue in our life together because it is the primary wellspring of our capacity to be creative together ... to love one another, write poetry, struggle for justice & friendship".

Because the expressive lens sees sexual expression as vital to personal empowerment, it sees sexual restraint as diminishing or warping the self.

The importance placed on sexual expression as part of a full human life sets the view apart from the plain sex view, as it is more than just a desire for pleasure..however intense. It sees sexuality and sexual activity as central to one's identity.
Please share your Journey of Sexual views........ if you have always held to 1 ... have jumped from "Covenant" (if you grew up with this) but struggled/ rebelled... jumped to "Plain sex" ....to "Expressive" ...or perhaps you've always looked through a "Romantic Lens" ?

Or maybe you have another ! And what, if any, will you impress upon your children....do they understand the various lenses they may come up against ~ in dating ?

Would appreciate your feedback!
 

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For me it has always been a mix of the first 3 in the order 1,2,3.

The primary purpose of sexual intercourse is procreation and the best (for me only) place for that is with a stable loving marriage.
The secondary purpose of sex is to strenghten the bonds between partners (for me husband and wife).
I know this makes me sound like some sort of Victorian but that is who I am and how I feel.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
*** UPDATED for further understanding......

Below is an example in the book given ...it is explaining how all of us look through a PRIMARY sexual Lense ...in this example below, it is Covenant ..and as you can see, it has others listed on the edges...(some may not use them all)...

For instance.... in Arranged marriages, the Covenant view is often Primary....no sex until marriage... there could be little to no romance in these marriages (which would be horrible!)... vows being of the HIGHEST IMPORTANCE ....than even a near sexless marriage or one dreadfully failing down the road..... but people will not exit it -because , to them, the Covenant is Primary....

It also addresses how different views look at pre-marital boundaries -how some view oral as permissible... another sees every sexual act "the same"...it is a bit complicated but fascinating, I felt.

I could never have Covenant as Primary due to the fact, I would not stay in a miserable marriage ongoing because of VOWS....(I need a workable partner)..... We both share the ROMANTIC VIEW as Primary.... with every single other listed here on the sides..

Now those who do not require committed strings of attachment for sex CAN NOT use the Romantic view as PRIMARY.. .they can use others, just not the 1st 3 listed ....and the Romantic can be on the side lines... I hope this makes sense...





I vote romantic, then power and expressive.

As for power, I enjoy having the power over her body, it's fun :)
Unless of course her body overpowers me...
I know you 2 have a Power Dynamic - probably more than any couple on this forum !

I specifically made it possible to choose a variety of views.

So Random... I've heard you say a # of times on here... if your sweet precious daughter brings home a guy like yourself... well... hmmmm, that could be very interesting ~ looking yourself in the face....What if HE is into the whole "POWER" thing too... ha ha .... I could see this being YOU someday Random >>>
 

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:rofl:

Yeah that's me alright! I am already an old man :p

But no, my daughter ain't bringing home guys like that unless she wants them killed, going to make that very clear lol
Having teenage daughter (one 17 and one 16) is the scariest thing I have ever done.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
For me it has always been a mix of the first 3 in the order 1,2,3.

The primary purpose of sexual intercourse is procreation and the best (for me only) place for that is with a stable loving marriage.
The secondary purpose of sex is to strenghten the bonds between partners (for me husband and wife).
I know this makes me sound like some sort of Victorian but that is who I am and how I feel.
We might as well be out of the Victorian age also...appreciate your feedback Wiltshireman :)... We waited till marriage, I believed strongly in #1...though I can't say it was always "easy" to maintain... and although we didn't do intercourse or oral, we WERE enjoying ourselves... to me the Fusion was the "becoming one"...also it was something "New" to bring to our marriage. I have always looked upon Intercourse as "sacred" somehow.

I was very blessed to find a man on board with that, it is a rarity today. We wanted a larger family (speaking of "Procreative View", got pregnant right away, was on top of this world).... though I do praise my IUD !!

And Romantic ....This... I'd have to say is.. Overwhelmingly my Mindset ... the last 3 views are not something I would engage in, it would be going against my foundational beliefs ....how high I view the vulnerability & emotional in committed Erotic Love.

Without this (as I want the whole package)....I'll have an affair with an "hitachi wand" or something...though this wouldn't be ideal, in fact this would get boring & I'd long for someone to hold....I feel the others would leave me even more "empty"....possibly feeling used -cause my expectations would be way higher / wanting more then they, which would leave me hurt & devastated. Not wise to go there...So I'd wait to find another who felt the same. That is just how I am made... I am not into turning my emotions off - to get off.

I feel the enthusiastic passionate expression can all be let loose once the Emotional & commitment is in full swing.

Having teenage daughter (one 17 and one 16) is the scariest thing I have ever done.
You may have an appreciation for my personal views on this Wiltshireman...


 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
When I was younger sex was about power for me.Now that I'm a little older and frown upon manipulation I realize sex is about connection,romance,and bonding.Plus,it feels amazing when you're doing it with the person you love. :D
That is very Cool .. .before I came across this authors writing...exploring these 6 (don't have the book in my hands yet but plan to buy it - love this subject )..... I never heard or entertained a "Power" view.

I would have to say.... in our marriage, I USE THIS (or a form of it) ...dressing up to entice, to seduce....Love love love to turn him on & bring him to his knees.... I get off on that it seems. But yet...I know the rest is there (which I NEED)....or I wouldn't be able to GO THERE, if that makes sense. Just as in my youth, that one would have never hit the radar ...it was purely "Romance" for me.

Neat to see how these can change, or we can GROW in these "Lens" as well...I think they all have a place in the proper setting...depending on what we personally "need" from the relationship....

ScarletB :)
 

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That is very Cool .. .before I came across this authors writing...exploring these 6 (don't have the book in my hands yet but plan to buy it - love this subject )..... I never heard or entertained a "Power" view.

I would have to say.... in our marriage, I USE THIS ...dressing up to entice, to seduce....Love love love to turn him on & bring him to his knees, I get off on that it seems. But yet...I know the rest is there (which I NEED)....or I really wouldn't be able to GO THERE, if that makes sense. Just as in my youth, that one would have never hit the radar ...it was purely "Romance" for me.

Neat to see how these can change, or we can GROW in these "Lens" as well...I think they all have a place in the proper setting...depending on what we personally "need" from the relationship....

ScarletB :)
Well that gives me a new view of the power aspect.I guess I never really thought of doing those things like the sexy outfits or teasing SO as a play on the power side.
I also like being able to bring him to his knees:) It's only fair after all,he does it to me as well.
It's a good point saying all these things have a place.You know I love a good balance;)
 

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I'm a Romantic with a little Covenantal thrown in just to confuse things for me. There has been very little change in what I believe to be moral involving sex. I confuse myself with my decisions because I would like to be more receptive to sex, but I have never been able to change much about myself in that regard. Probably why infidelity stings so much when it's my spouse doing it. Probably why I am so against it. Not sure.

Sex was never just for fun or pleasure. It was so much more. Probably why I could not be told in the morning we were going to have sex that night. It never worked and whoever suggested she do that was and idiot because they did not know me. I would have understood much better in more subtle ways and have been receptive and ready; happy to please and joyful. I wish I knew who told her to try that. What she did before that time was what worked. Whoever told her to try that helped ruin sex between us. One of the most important aspects of giving myself to her. In my mind, it was more than just physical. It was a sharing of souls. That's how much I loved.

Would have been good to show ages of folks and religious upbringing. I'm fifty and brought up strict Roman Catholic, but no longer practice. Also, my parents grew up in the 1920's and 30's.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Well that gives me a new view of the power aspect.I guess I never really thought of doing those things like the sexy outfits or teasing SO as a play on the power side.
I also like being able to bring him to his knees:) It's only fair after all,he does it to me as well.
It's a good point saying all these things have a place.You know I love a good balance;)
Actually I'm probably wrong on it's intended meaning here ....beings there is no objectifying in committed loving relationships (Objectify = To present or regard as an object)..... it says this on the Power view >>
In order to seize control & not be controlled, I need to
objectify
my sexual “partner” (in thought or by actions) before my sexual “partner” can objectify me... “Partner” becomes a misnomer because the mutuality of such encounters is mutual rivalry in a contest over power.
... in comparison to when a couple is primarily wrapped in the Romantic... that would cancel this out.

I think Random Dude put a "seed" in my head by mentioning it in his post...and I know he meant before he married & during...with the Power view.

There was a time , where my drive was SO high... my husband felt I LUSTED after him MORE than he felt LOVED... can't say this was true...but during that spell... I did seem to care more about my FIX over anything else..."just give it to me baby!"... one could say I was objectifying him a bit.. (with
)...and if he was objectifying me - so I could get my Fix, I was as happy as pigs in mudd.... what a crazy time that was! :rofl:

Good thing I wasn't single ...that could have gotten me in some Trouble.
 

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RandomDude:
But no, my daughter ain't bringing home guys like that unless she wants them killed, going to make that very clear lol
Word to the Wise:
Not to disillusion you, dad, but you DO REALIZE then that she will simply TELL YOU, "I'm going to the library to study with Amy!" while she's REALLY OFF meeting up with him at the local McDonald's! Forbidden fruit is that much more appealing!

[says 56yo former teen-age girl and currently mother of a 15yo] ;)
 

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What does 'sex is great anytime both people want it but far better when you both love each other" count as?

Never thought of my sexual views as complicated. I like sex, it's great. Always enjoyed it before I found anyone I wanted 'to be with' but all of my most memorable sexual encounters were with the woman I love.
 

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1, 2 and 5 are alien to me.

I'll go with (4) Just enjoy it for what it is (3) with your beloved, (6) as it is central to human flourishing.

Have my views changed? Since getting married, not much, more "Just enjoy it for what it is", as in don't over think (I am so good at that). Before marriage my view was simply, sex, "Yes, please", not that I got much.


ETA: in the poll I hit 5 rather than 4.
 

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I've always, by my moral nature, deemed that it should be for the "romantic aspect," but perhaps with a mild dash of the Freudian "id concept."

There's nothing more intoxicating and mind-boggling in the world than doing it with the one that you absolutely love beyond measure, knowing full well in your heart that they feel the very same way about you!
 

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My mother, bless her as she was a single mom doing a kick-ass job, raised me to think sex was sacred and ONLY meant for marriage.

That's a HUGE guilt trip on an adolescent. That's a HUGE mind-eff for someone, like myself, who never really wanted to get married. SO I struggled for years.

I lost my virginity to a guy I had been dating for almost a year. We dated 2 more years after that and had great sex. Was it love? I thought so...until I had real love down the line. But at that time, it was love to me and so I decided LIKE AN ADULT (I was 21) to lose my virginity.

Before that, I was SCARED of sex. that is not ok for me. I was scared of sex and sexuality. I gave a boy a handjob at age 17 and my mom found out and it was like I was the WORST person in the world. WTF?! It angers me now to think about because it was NORMAL teenager behavior. In my head, I didn't want sex, I was just experimenting and the guy was ...omg...first real puppy love. For 2 years. Awwww love. :) But to embarrass me like that and to shame me like that...WRONG WRONG WRONG. ESPECIALLY after finding out years later that my mother lost her virginity at age 16. So....honesty wasn't her strong point but shaming me was.

After my loss of the V card, I broke up with him beause he was banging my friend while I was away at school (drama omg) and I was dry in the sex department for 2 years until I met my older daughter's father. Then I was with him for 3 years.

Then...after leaving him and all that bullshet...I was DONE thinking that sex was tied to love. Eff that. Sex was tied to my body at that time and I explored. I had two partners at age 25 and by 30 I had 8. Whatever.

At 31 I met my husband and he was my lucky number 9...or so I thought. I thought he looooved me and I thought we were making love, etc....nope. Turns out all of THAT was a lie too. Awesome.

I'm a bit jaded. lol. But I DO KNOW that my sexuality isn't tied to anything but myself and how I feel about the person I'm with. Sometimes it's just for fun. Sometimes it's just FOR ME. Sometimes it's all about them. Sometimes it's truly magical and "Making love" and sometimes it's just a hard fvck.
 

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I am a mix of Romantic and Expressive but don't totally agree with all of the descriptions.

Very much I agree with: "Romantic view holds that sex should be connected with a thirst for deep psychological & bodily knowledge, Mutually reciprocated gift-giving & intimacy are it's purpose."

I also agree with: "Sex is a source of personal empowerment that is central to human flourishing. Sexual restraint is unnatural but sexuality should be used without hampering the empowerment of others."

I don't believe sex is only for those in love. It can be 'just sex', a physical pleasure. On that level it is fine but it is not complete at all. The ONS or FWB serve a function.

The Covenantal view has a lot of value but as an Atheist I don't hold the religious mandate view.

I was a virgin when I met my wife. She had several previous lovers. For me sex with her is still a very precious gift and sharing of myself because of the exclusivity. There is an emotional meaning to me. For her it is in some ways 'just sex' because she gave away the exclusivity.

One of my barriers to divorce is knowing by definition I can never have in my own heart that same kind of uniqueness or exclusivity with any other woman.
 
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